Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
September 22, 2006
WB: Only the Beginning

Billmon:

It’s getting very dark in here — the little bit of light left is primarily the result of me trying to convince myself the signs we saw in the run up to the Iraq invasion don’t have the same significance this time around. Who knows? Maybe doing the same things and expecting different results isn’t crazy after all.

Or, at the least, maybe the use of tactical nukes is off the table.

Only the Beginning

Comments

Best guess:
– there is no military nuclear program in Iran – the IAEA woould have cought the wiffs.
– the Neocons are planing the exactly same scenario for Iran than used for Iraq, but today being 1990 in comparison. They will bomb the hell out of Iran under whatever reason, blockade the harbours, establish “No fly zones” under which some Iranian parts may become near independend, like the Kurds did in Iraq. Add sanctions to that and 10, 12 years from now, Iran will fall like a ripe apple. Did work in Iraq, will work in Iran- same script.
– there are secret negotiations going on. One line is consigliere Baker, who is now semi-officially talking to Iran, but there is another line too. In a Letter to America Akbar Ganji, a real anti-war Iranian dissident, hinted to a “secret deal”. Maybe a China moment coming?

Posted by: b | Sep 22 2006 5:57 utc | 1

A tiny ray of light in another part of the universe. Take it where you find it…
“Families visiting Disneyland on their holiday this week saw a life-size Guantanamo bay inmate standing inside the Rocky Mountain Railroad ride at Disneyland in Anaheim California.”link

Posted by: jj | Sep 22 2006 6:49 utc | 2

But then …
Senior intel official: Pentagon moves to second-stage planning for Iran strike option

The official, who is close to the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the highest ranking officials of each branch of the US military, says the Chiefs have started what is called “branches and sequels” contingency planning.
“The JCS has accepted the inevitable,” the intelligence official said, “and is engaged in serious contingency planning to deal with the worst case scenarios that the intelligence community has been painting.”

The senior intelligence official who spoke to RAW STORY, along with several military intelligence sources, confirmed that the nuclear option remains on the table. In addition, the senior official added that the Joint Chiefs have “come around on to the administration’s thinking.”
“The Joint Chiefs have no longer imposed roadblocks on a possible bombing campaign against Iran’s nuclear production facilities,” the intelligence official said. “In the past, only the Air Force had endorsed the contingency, saying that it could carry out the mission of destroying, or at least significantly delaying, Iran’s ability to develop a nuclear weapon.”

With allegations of a plan in place and contingency scenarios in play, several military and intelligence experts see this as proof of a secret White House order to proceed with military action.
Last week, a military intelligence official described to this reporter the movement of Naval submarines and a deployment order sent out to Naval assets of strategic import, such as minesweepers, that could indicate contingency planning is already under way to secure oil transport routes and supplies.
On Sunday, Time Magazine confirmed much of what the military intelligence source had described.

From all appearances, however, it would seem that at least some members of the Senate Armed Services Committee have not been briefed on deployment orders or on any strike plans, even contingency plans. The Senate Intelligence Committee is attempting to get a grasp on what is and has been going on.
A source close to the Committee, who asked to remain anonymous due to the sensitivity of the information, explained that a series of briefings will be going on this week and into next.

Posted by: b | Sep 22 2006 6:50 utc | 3

Bombing Iran without regime change will have the reverse effects you mention, and be considered a failure by neo-con standards. What is different from the Iraq experience — that the attempted and eventual decapitation of the regime in Iraq was a deliberate and personal attack upon the regime itself — is if a similar logic is followed in Iran, it would necessitate a similar, personal attack upon the religious clergy of that country. Especially considering that the clergy in Iran maintains a relitive legitimacy that Saddam could only dream about, so therefore considerably more difficult to neutralize. So the big question becomes — is the U.S. ready to bomb Qom and decapitate the Shiite religious leaders of Iran?

Posted by: anna missed | Sep 22 2006 7:03 utc | 4

Iran Is Given More Time to End Uranium Enrichment

The United States has agreed, once again, to extend the “weeks, not months” deadline that it set in June for Iran to stop uranium enrichment or face Security Council sanctions. The new deadline: early October.
A senior Bush administration official said Thursday that foreign ministers from the six world powers seeking to rein in Iran’s nuclear ambitions decided Tuesday night to give Iran a little more time to comply with their demand. Iran missed an Aug. 31 deadline for suspending enrichment, and the United States is pushing for a new measure imposing travel bans and asset freezes on Iranian officials.

Posted by: b | Sep 22 2006 7:08 utc | 5

Gen. Abizaid went public outlining some of ways Iran would likely respond, though he doesn’t explicitly spell out the implications for Iraq. It was in Brit. press, here. Does anyone know if Am. press carried it, much less featured it prominently?
Also, found this on discussion on Iran in DC. Thinking Through the Unthinkables on Iran Does anyone know much about it, or had time to listen to the proceedings?

Posted by: jj | Sep 22 2006 7:13 utc | 6

JUAN COLE WILL BE ON DEMOCRACY NOW FRI. (tomorrow/today)

Posted by: jj | Sep 22 2006 7:17 utc | 7

The Bushes & the Truth About Iran
By Robert Parry

Having gone through the diplomatic motions with Iran, George W. Bush is shifting toward a military option that carries severe risks for American soldiers in Iraq as well as for long-term U.S. interests around the world. Yet, despite this looming crisis, the Bush Family continues to withhold key historical facts about U.S.-Iranian relations.

MOA’s really need to read this…
I have followed Parry’s work since 95. His was one of the very first websites I would visit on a regular basis back then. One of the very first muckrakers on the net imo. Always thought-provoking always digging deeper.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Sep 22 2006 9:25 utc | 8

Billmon missed one point. If Cheney & Co. conduct an air campaign to destroy Iran’s nuclear weapons capacity, then it will be in the Bush administration’s interest to make people believe it really succeeded. After all, a Bush at 35% in the polls is not going to start a third war in six years and then give a speech saying “We have acheived a moderate degradation of Iran’s nuclear capability. Mission Accomplished”. He is going to claim he bombed every last shred of Iran’s nuclear capability back to the stone age.
In other words, whether or not a series air strikes really does set back the Iranian nuclear program, Bush will claim it did. This will suit the Iranians just fine.
The Iranians can then say, “Yes our program is totally destroyed. We will never be able to produce nuclear weapons now.” while quietly letting their own people know that’s just for American consumption. They can then resume their nuclear program, perhaps only months behind schedule. All the while the same crowd/propaganda machine that convinced America and itself that Saddam had nukes will be working overtime to convince America/itself that Iran’s nuclear program really is destroyed. The US media will never give the average Joe in the US a chance to realise the Iranians are laughing so hard they can barely pick themselves up to finish off Iraq.
If this sounds like it would take a lot of sophistication on the part of the Iranians, remember how sophisticated Hezbollah’s military/political strategy was in the recent war. Carefully controlling the levels of rocket attacks to undermine Israeli leader’s credibility with their own public was an amazing piece of work that I doubt many people in the Whitehouse even understood. The Iranians are close allies of Hezbollah and may think with similar levels of sophistication.

Posted by: still working it out | Sep 22 2006 10:00 utc | 9

“I’m reasonably sure it would be technically impossible to hide the tell tale signs of a nuclear detonation”
Agree with that statement for a reasonable rational person. But that’s applying one “filter” too many.
Let me put it this way. How reasonable does the following statement sound?
I’m reasonably sure it would be technically impossible to hide the tell tale signs of a nuclear detonation from the audience of FOX news.
And from Bush’s point of view, does hiding it from anyone else really matter ?

Posted by: still working it out | Sep 22 2006 10:12 utc | 10

I really urge readers to read my #8 above, between that and billmon’s Only the Beginning post, some things have shifted for me. I have made the decision tonight to prepare to expat the fuck out of here. This move has been under consideration for me for a while now, always at the back of my mind, however, tonight something has brought it forward that I can’t explain, I am up to my chin in disgust for the sad nation, and finding it hard to breath. My soul is suffocating. I can no longer watch this madness from within. If any of our non-American readers have a flat, sofa, or closet they’d be willing to share for a few weeks, I’d be happy to know about it. I would prefer South East Asia, but at this point it doesn’t matter, as I feel the need to just get out.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Sep 22 2006 11:01 utc | 11

Assume, just for the sake of the argument, that the neonuts chanced their hand with ‘tactical’ nulcear weapons, how long before they are chased down the street by lynch mobs?
“If the people knew what we had done, they would chase us down the street and lynch us.” (Is that quote authentic?)

Posted by: DM | Sep 22 2006 11:07 utc | 12

The Bush military threat machine is still working when it comes to impressing Billmon and friends, but not when it comes to impressing Iran. Not after failing in Iraq and Afghanistan. Not after 120+ countries lining up behind the pro-Iranian new candidate for the UN security council, Venezuela. What would bombing Iran achieve other than completely isolating the US and demonstrate the West’s dependence on oil? Can’t see the upside. Ergo for Bush and Co things are reduced to: showing war face in public, sucking their thumbs in private.

Posted by: Guthman Bey | Sep 22 2006 11:20 utc | 13

Post 9/11, my middle-aged, middle-America (born again) brother, father of two young boys, was gungo-ho for Bush to attack Iraq and Syria and Iran and to use tactical nukes for bunker busting: “We’ve got ’em, we need to use ’em”. We’re not much on speaking terms, but my sense as an expat with an ear for how Bush is received “at home” is that outside lefty circles, there would be little reaction among Americans at large; the media has prepped all to expect Bush to what he has to do to protect America; the use of nukes would be down played (“underground”, “no fallout”). How much public concern is there now for the depleted uranium poisoning of Iraq and Afghanistan?

Posted by: Hamburger | Sep 22 2006 11:28 utc | 14

Can’t see the upside.
We’re bad, we’re bad. Fear us.

Posted by: Hamburger | Sep 22 2006 11:32 utc | 15

Therefore, we will say it again clearly, so that even the nabobs on the Washington Post editorial page can hear it: John McCain is a goddamned liar, and his “agreement” today serves some of the most evil principles ever supported openly by the United States government since slavery.
– Floyd
Recommended reading (for everyone except Uncle $cam) – Uncle – read some travel brochures – have a few drinks – and chill out for a while. Same old same old since forever. We just had an illusion that we were something that we are not.

Posted by: DM | Sep 22 2006 11:51 utc | 16

UK suspects in new claims of torture at Guantanamo
By Robert Verkaik, Legal Affairs Correspondent
Published: 21 September 2006
The extent of the torture and abuse that British residents held at Guantanamo Bay claim to have suffered is revealed for the first time in a series of recently declassified interviews between the detainees and their human rights lawyers.
Documents submitted to the American courts allege that one of the detainees was strapped to a chair by prison guards and beaten and tortured to the point of death.
Other British suspects are still being held in solitary confinement, four years after their capture, where they are subjected to extreme temperatures, sleep deprivation and the confiscation of the most basic necessities, including lavatory paper and blankets.
None has been charged with any crime.
Some of the most serious allegations of torture concern the treatment of Shaker Aamer, a Saudi national who until his arrest four years ago had been living in London with his wife and four children.
In June this year, Mr Aamer claims he was badly beaten and tortured because he failed to provide a retina scan and fingerprints to the camp authorities. He says he was strapped to a chair, fully restrained at the head, arms and legs.
The habeas corpus motion filed in the court of the District of Columbia states: “The MPs [military police] inflicted so much pain, Mr Aamer said he thought he was going to die. The MPs pressed on pressure points all over his body: his temples, just under his jawline, in the hollow beneath his ears. They choked him. They bent his nose so hard he thought it would break.
“They pinched his thighs and feet constantly. They gouged his eyes. They held his eyes open and shined a Maglite [torch] in them for minutes on end, generating intense heat. They bent his fingers until he screamed. When he screamed, they cut off his airway, then put a mask on him so he could not cry out.”
Mr Aamer, who had been resident in Britain since 1996, was used as key negotiator on behalf of the prisoners during recent hunger strikes.
But when a settlement between the prisoners and the guards broke down last year he was sent to solitary confinement. This month he was visited by his lawyer from the human rights charity Reprieve. Mr Aamer told the lawyer that he had not seen the sun for 79 days and had had no meaningful contact with the outside world.
In a harrowing account of his torture he said: “At any moment, they can strip you naked. They will put your head in the toilet in the name of security. It is all about humiliation. They are trying to break me.”
Bisher al-Rawi, another British resident captured by the Americans in Gambia after alleged collusion between the CIA and MI5 officers, is also being held in solitary confinement at another detention centre known as Camp V.
Mr al-Rawi has stopped co-operating with his interrogators because they are still seeking answers to the same questions they were asking when he was first arrested in 2002.
His resistance has cost him the few privileges he had and led to his interrogators using torture lasting for weeks. The most common form of torture he has been forced to endure is the use of extreme temperatures in the cells. During the day the guards let the temperatures reach 100 degrees and in the night take away his sheet and use the air conditioning system to create freezing conditions
Zachary Katznelson, the Reprieve lawyer who interviewed the men in Guantanamo, said the torture had been so severe that Mr Al Rawi had suffered wheezing and loss of consciousness.
The evidence relating to Mr al-Rawi is to be used to support an appeal already lodged at the High Court in London. Two other British residents, Omar Deghayes and Ahmed Errachidi, are also being held in Camp V.
Ahmed Belbacha and Abdennour Sameur are in Camp II. Jamil al-Banna is in Camp IV, the lowest security rated part of the prison. An eighth man, Binyam Mohamed, is due to appear before a military commission. All the men remain defiant and protest their innocence.
Reprieve, the British based human rights charity representing the men, says their detention is a gross breach of international law and an infringement of the Geneva Conventions.
The extent of the torture and abuse that British residents held at Guantanamo Bay claim to have suffered is revealed for the first time in a series of recently declassified interviews between the detainees and their human rights lawyers.
Documents submitted to the American courts allege that one of the detainees was strapped to a chair by prison guards and beaten and tortured to the point of death.
Other British suspects are still being held in solitary confinement, four years after their capture, where they are subjected to extreme temperatures, sleep deprivation and the confiscation of the most basic necessities, including lavatory paper and blankets.
None has been charged with any crime.
Some of the most serious allegations of torture concern the treatment of Shaker Aamer, a Saudi national who until his arrest four years ago had been living in London with his wife and four children.
In June this year, Mr Aamer claims he was badly beaten and tortured because he failed to provide a retina scan and fingerprints to the camp authorities. He says he was strapped to a chair, fully restrained at the head, arms and legs.
The habeas corpus motion filed in the court of the District of Columbia states: “The MPs [military police] inflicted so much pain, Mr Aamer said he thought he was going to die. The MPs pressed on pressure points all over his body: his temples, just under his jawline, in the hollow beneath his ears. They choked him. They bent his nose so hard he thought it would break.
“They pinched his thighs and feet constantly. They gouged his eyes. They held his eyes open and shined a Maglite [torch] in them for minutes on end, generating intense heat. They bent his fingers until he screamed. When he screamed, they cut off his airway, then put a mask on him so he could not cry out.”
Mr Aamer, who had been resident in Britain since 1996, was used as key negotiator on behalf of the prisoners during recent hunger strikes.
But when a settlement between the prisoners and the guards broke down last year he was sent to solitary confinement. This month he was visited by his lawyer from the human rights charity Reprieve. Mr Aamer told the lawyer that he had not seen the sun for 79 days and had had no meaningful contact with the outside world.
In a harrowing account of his torture he said: “At any moment, they can strip you naked. They will put your head in the toilet in the name of security. It is all about humiliation. They are trying to break me.”
Bisher al-Rawi, another British resident captured by the Americans in Gambia after alleged collusion between the CIA and MI5 officers, is also being held in solitary confinement at another detention centre known as Camp V.
Mr al-Rawi has stopped co-operating with his interrogators because they are still seeking answers to the same questions they were asking when he was first arrested in 2002.
His resistance has cost him the few privileges he had and led to his interrogators using torture lasting for weeks. The most common form of torture he has been forced to endure is the use of extreme temperatures in the cells. During the day the guards let the temperatures reach 100 degrees and in the night take away his sheet and use the air conditioning system to create freezing conditions
Zachary Katznelson, the Reprieve lawyer who interviewed the men in Guantanamo, said the torture had been so severe that Mr Al Rawi had suffered wheezing and loss of consciousness.
The evidence relating to Mr al-Rawi is to be used to support an appeal already lodged at the High Court in London. Two other British residents, Omar Deghayes and Ahmed Errachidi, are also being held in Camp V.
Ahmed Belbacha and Abdennour Sameur are in Camp II. Jamil al-Banna is in Camp IV, the lowest security rated part of the prison. An eighth man, Binyam Mohamed, is due to appear before a military commission. All the men remain defiant and protest their innocence.
Reprieve, the British based human rights charity representing the men, says their detention is a gross breach of international law and an infringement of the Geneva Conventions.

Posted by: DM | Sep 22 2006 11:56 utc | 17

October 1st marks the 60th anniversary of the closing gavel of the Nuremberg Trials. For four years, the top 24 Nazi leaders, instigators and perpetrators had their crimes fully explored and revealed.
After the final the gavel fell, most of these Nazis went to the hangman or to prison.
Sixty years later, the Nuremberg Principles established by those trials are now openly violated by the United States of America — crimes against peace, wars of aggression, war crimes, and crimes against humanity.
Most importantly, the Nuremberg Principles established that for all nations, whether they ever became signatories or not, that there is no excusing these crimes by any individual by making claims of ‘just following orders,’ by virtue of being a government official or head of state, or of not knowing that it was a war crime.
If it happened, if you were there, if you took part, if you failed to stop it — you committed a war crime, or a crime against humanity.
And there is no statute of limitations, none whatsoever, on these crimes.
Both political parties, both sides of both Houses of Congress, by absconding from their sworn oaths and duties to our Constitution have left themselves entirely open to prosecution for permitting, abetting, conspiring and engaging in elective wars of aggression, crimes against humanity, war crimes, and crimes against peace.
Not a one of them may walk this earth as free men and women from this day forth. They are all non-prosecuted war criminals until such time as they are prosecuted.
AFTER America bombs Iran back to Stone Age in late October of 2006,
and Iran manages to cut Middle East oil shipments by a third or more,
and the world’s economies approach wholesale collapse,
and the nations of the world dump their dollars,
and America is reduced to Depression era financial travails,
and America’s next Administration bows to worldwide demands that the entire Bush Administration be put on trial,
along with the various “criminal organizations” that participated in the Bush wars of aggression,
every Senator, Congress member, military officer, intelligence agent, and police officer who had any part in any of it is subject to criminal prosecution.
All that stands between now and then is the bombing of Iran and the inevitable blowback of doing so.

Posted by: Antifa | Sep 22 2006 12:22 utc | 18

Antifa,
Noone has ever been bombed back into the stone age. Not Germany, not Japan, not Vietnam, not Iraq, not Afghanistan, not Lebanon. Noone. Bombs don’t have that power.
You are buying into PR: Bush Shock and Awe PR.

Posted by: Guthman Bey | Sep 22 2006 12:51 utc | 19

@ Uncle Thanks for the link to Parry, who provides a bit more detail
with regard to “almost known” facts. Ben Menashe’s book , Rodney Stich’s book
Defrauding America
, Kevin Phillips American Dynasty all give pieces of the story, and even Victor Ostrowski’s novel Lion of Judah are of interest in that regard. Philips is the
most “main stream”: he weighs the evidence available when he wrote the book, and although clearly tending to believe the existence of G H W Bush’s secret flight to Paris, he’s level-headed enough to recognize the unproven character of the story (which Parry keeps chipping away at). Ostrowski offers an “alternate version” of the meeting (safely packaged in the middle of his “purely fictional novel”) for which one can only wonder whether it’s more CIA-Mossad disinformation or revelation of another scam. Of course, believing any of these writers (except possibly Phillips) guarantees you a tin-foil hat, which, I’m told, are much in fashion this year.

Posted by: Hannah K. O’Luthon | Sep 22 2006 13:19 utc | 20

I think that there’s another option that Billmon might want to consider as an explanation for Iranian insouciance: that if it comes down to a shooting war, they think that they can win, and that they have their chess-pieces already in place on the board waiting to spring the check-mate.
From both a tactical and a strategic point of view they have a number of very clear advantages – a large, embattled US military force surrounded by a sea of militias and insurgents in Iraq, lots of easy-to-hit critical US logistical infrastructure, allies, a strategic oil weapon that can only be decisively countered with boots on ground that the US cannot muster, a US military machine that is degrading as it heads into year 5 of OIF deployments and year 6 of OEF deployments with no end in sight and is caught in the entropy trap, political leverage over key US enablers in the region ( Qatar, Kuwait, Dubai and Bahrain ) and, perhaps most critical of all, general global loathing of the Bush administration, an administration that appears to be hard-wired to fuck things up when it comes to the application of military force.
The Iranians have won every battle against the Bush administration thus far, and I can see nothing on the horizon to suggest that this trajectory is going to alter in any material way. The Bush administration might see a million dead Iranians as a victory, the Iranians might see it as the price of defeating the US.

Posted by: dan | Sep 22 2006 13:34 utc | 21

What about the Khuzestan Gambit? Neocons have long bellowed, “real men go to Khuzestan”. It’s the small little Iranian province where 90% of the oil is. There is a build-up of troops in Iraq, both US and Brittish, and the Brittish are already engaged in maneuvers on the Basra/Khuzestan border.

Posted by: Jesus Reyes | Sep 22 2006 13:46 utc | 22

I also wonder about that $150-$200 oil. A world wide recession/depression might send oil to $30-$50.

Posted by: Jesus Reyes | Sep 22 2006 13:51 utc | 23

As to Gardiner’s comments, and others upthread, in parsing the administration’s motives I think it’s necessary to distinguish between geopolitical goals and domestic political goals.
From what I can tell, their geopolitical goals are unsophisticated, grandiose, poorly thought out, ill-informed, and ultimately not achieved — or even set back — by their actions, Iraq being Exhibit A.
But their domestic political goals have been much more sophisticated, their methods stunningly successful, and the results plain for all to see.
So in thinking about actions with respect to Iran, I would look first to to domestic implications. Forget the US’ standing in the world, or the spread of “democracy,” or peace in the Middle East, or stability in volatile areas. Look to corporate profits, US military control — or at least supervision — of oil production and transport, and continued Republican dominance in US government. Advancing those goals will drive our actions with respect to Iran.
Consider “bombing them back to the Stone Age.” It’s so often discussed as an option that it’s almost trite, and yet, as observed above, it’s not at all realistic. But because it gives our nation of armchair warriors a thrill, it’s a real possibility. (We’d need to be sure cameras were in place to record it, of course.) Nukes? Sure, if it made good TV, and it could be spun the right way with the right domestic audiences. (Another sign of imminent Rapture! God Bless His Anointed Preznit!)
The lunatics have taken over the asylum. Old-fogy adults like Gardiner are yesterday’s news. Keep your head down.

Posted by: bleh | Sep 22 2006 15:07 utc | 24

The American Empire has reached River Styx. Before, it has stepped back.
Rational observers see US troops surrounded by militias in Iraq, NATO and Canada in a hot nasty guerilla war in Afghanistan, the failure of Shock and Awe in Lebanon and falling gasoline prices because oil traders decided Iranian oil supplies won’t be blockaded.
But, Curtis LeMay’s Bomb them into the Stone Age has reappeared. William Lind sees the rise of Islam and the drowning of Christianity in a sea of political correctness. In the Clash of Civilizations a million casualties from nuclear fallout from the use of tactical nuclear weapons becomes just collateral damage.
Billmon’s nuclear dawn is one of only two alternatives. The other is containment. Except in the twilight of Hades, corporate media is blind and enables the true believers rush towards Rapture.

Posted by: Jim S | Sep 22 2006 16:21 utc | 25

The American Empire has reached River Styx. Before, it has stepped back.
Before it wasn’t run by bribery & blackmail…and the elites hadn’t stolen everything & shipped their assets overseas preparing for a quick escape…that’s why Nationalism matters, if you want your nation to flourish…and the Winds of Apocalypse weren’t blowing so ferociously…Somebody should have written a book on life in 1000…
Uncle, This may help get you started. But don’t forget the Caribbean. And Ireland is thriving, and will survive global warming.

Posted by: jj | Sep 22 2006 16:57 utc | 26

PLEASE, Any of yours, pls friends translate this commentary. (If possible).I read everyday this page , but I can´t write English decently.
POR FAVOR, Alguno de Uds, por favor traduzca mi pequeño comentario.(Si es posible)
Cuando la preparación de la última guerra de Iraq, con todas las acusaciones del gobierno USA y otros paises del mundo acerca de las Armas de Destrucción Masiva ( WMD), con las dudas de los inspectores de la UN y las negaciones de Sadam, me pregunté muchas veces, por qué Sadam actuaba de esa manera prácticamente sin defenderse. Sadam podía haber dicho con cara seria: “No tenemos Armas de Destrucción Masiva aquí en Irak. Nuestras Armas de DM, No están en Iraq.” Y dejar al arbitrio del mundo pensar si las tiene, dónde estarán.
Nunca pensé que Sadam ,fuera un gran lider ni un gran terrorista. Probablemente era un mediocre asesino de su propio pueblo y un gran ladron, que se robó gran parte de sus propios presupuestos de Defensa. Como muchos otros Jefes de Estado.

Posted by: curioso | Sep 22 2006 17:05 utc | 27

I agree with Billmon’s take. Basically, the world is preparing for Bush to do something incredibly harmful and self-defeating–attacking Iran–that, if Bush decides he wants to do it, is unstoppable. So Iran and the world are positioning themselves to mitigate and profit from this incredibly stupid move, if it occurs. Iran’s regime looks to survive the strike and hunker down for a long war that’s probably more political than military. Call the “Long War” the “Lame Duck War”, as in two years of hostility, until Bush leaves office and a new American president rings down the curtain on the catastrophe in the Middle East. I expect Iran’ll look for ways to hang on and keep their channels open to Europe, Russia, and China by acting “responsibly” and not allowing themselves to be marginalized as a “terrorist regime”. China, for its part, is leading a general rush away from Bush so that its relations with Iran will be uncomplicated by any taint of complicity with Bush’s campaign. Ditto for Europe. If Iran plays its cards right, it will come out of the war as the injured party–a sovereign state that tried to play by (most of) the rules, not a rogue state that deserved what it was getting (like Iraq). Bottom line: temporary setback to Iran’s nuclear program. Pro-US moderates in Iran destroyed politically and probably physically. Iran gives up idea of rapprochement with US. Middle East coalesces into anti-US block backed by China and Russia. Mission accomplished!

Posted by: Peter | Sep 22 2006 17:07 utc | 28

I’d like to offer a scenario to complement Billmon’s analysis.
What if Iran has made a deal to buy nuclear weapons, if the United States launches an unprovoked attack?

Posted by: Carl Nyberg | Sep 22 2006 17:18 utc | 29

@ curioso according to babel fish:

When the preparation of the last war of Iraq, with all the accusations of government the USA and others paises of the world about the Arms of Destruccio’n Masiva (WMD), with the doubts of the inspectors of and negations of Sadam, I often asked myself, why Sadam practically acted of that way without defending itself. Sadam could have said with serious face: “we do not have Arms of Massive Destruction here in Iraq. Our Arms of DM, are not in Iraq.” And to let to the will of the world think if it has them, where they will be. I never thought that Sadam, outside a great one lider nor a great terrorist. Probably he was a mediocre assassin of his own town and great ladron, that robbed great part of its own budgets of Defense. Like many other Chiefs of State.

Posted by: beq | Sep 22 2006 17:19 utc | 30

One possibility: if the Administration makes a big show of staying its hand in Iran, then it might soften opposition to staying in Iraq (as being a lesser evil of some kind).
Propaganda’s hard to follow because it plays at such very high speeds.

Posted by: alabama | Sep 22 2006 18:01 utc | 31

Is there more backroom co-operation w/Iran going on than we’re told about? Top Sadr Aides Seized in Raids, Movement Says. (Plenty more impt. stuff to read as well – too much to link.)

Posted by: jj | Sep 22 2006 18:12 utc | 32

The stated neo-con goal is regime change in both Iraq and Iran. Iran may have nuclear technology, like India or Pakistan, provided a complicit regime is in power. After all, the U.S. provided Iran with with the initial technology itself. The U.S. (& the world) desperately need Irans (&Iraq) oil production up to speed, and the only way to insure optimum production is U.S. control over production. Conversly (alabama), regime change in Iran would would truncate Shiite radicalism in Iraq (along with Iran). Success in Iraq requires regime change in Iran, the source of extremism, or as Bush would say, evil. For years now, my position (here at moa) has been that the administration would not attack Iran. This has now changed.

Posted by: anna missed | Sep 22 2006 18:36 utc | 33

I’ll send ten samoleons to the first reporter who asks Bush or Snow if they have a post-war plan drawn up for Iran.

Posted by: biklett | Sep 22 2006 18:55 utc | 34

Innaresting.*
Excellent musings concerning Iran’s response to a pre-emptive strike, even a nuclear one. If we actually do go nuke, I don’t know how we, let alon Iran, could “go on” after that and if we could, we’re in deeper sh*t as a society than I thought. And forget getting out of Dodge: who in the world would take us?
I dunno, Billmon. I’ve noticed the amused nonchalance of the Iranian President, too. It’s like he’s got a very big fish by the very short hairs. He definately knows something we don’t.
*William Burroughs: “Naked Lunch”.

Posted by: vachon | Sep 22 2006 20:15 utc | 35

perhaps senor baker will arrange a non-aggression treaty and iran will open up on the nuclear oversight and recognize israel. perhaps this occurs before the general election. it would be an october surprise.
but iran has no reason to trust the u.s., none at all.

Posted by: slothrop | Sep 22 2006 20:43 utc | 36

Anyone remember “I will never apologize for the United States of America — I don’t care what the facts are”?
Like father, like son.

Posted by: cpg | Sep 22 2006 21:08 utc | 37

Adding to what Dan (21) & Jim S (25) say above, I want to note that the US army in Iraq gets most of its supplies by truck and the supply lines are 400-800 miles long. We have a mighty army to be sure but an army that is low on food, water & bullets is not quite so mighty anymore. Given the grief caused by the current insurgency, 15 million enraged & heavily armed Shia might have something to say should we start throwing tactical nukes at their friends & relatives in Iran.

Posted by: darms | Sep 22 2006 21:52 utc | 38

@Call the “Long War” the “Lame Duck War”, as in two years of hostility, until Bush leaves office and a new American president rings down the curtain on the catastrophe in the Middle East.
Not picking on you personally, but I don’t see why anyone would at this point assume that Bush is going anywhere in 2 years. They are trampling laws left and right and justifying it in retrospect as they go along – why would scrapping term limits or even scrapping the election altogether be any different?
The idea that everything will start to get better in a couple years because this crowd will be gone is, I think, a losing bet.

Posted by: mats | Sep 23 2006 1:05 utc | 39

@perhaps senor baker will arrange a non-aggression treaty and iran will open up on the nuclear oversight and recognize israel. perhaps this occurs before the general election. it would be an october surprise.
That’s not the kind of surprise that would fire up their base to go vote. Dropping tactical nukes, now that would turn them out in droves.

Posted by: mats | Sep 23 2006 1:08 utc | 40

@Slothrop, Iran long ago agreed to that – it’s CheneyCo that refused. Other things at issue, for starters at least, are recyling Petrodollars through NY banks, etc, and Iran & Syria are the Only 2 ME countries where xUS doesn’t have bases, so presumably they might have to agree to a military presence.
If you were the Iranian leadership, which poison path would you choose?

Posted by: jj | Sep 23 2006 1:15 utc | 41

Carl,
What if Iran has made a deal to buy nuclear weapons, if the United States launches an unprovoked attack?
Then they would probably have performed a test somewhere in a region they care little about. The purpose of having nuclear weapons is to let the rest of the world know not to mess you. The surest way of letting the world know is to test them.

Posted by: a swedish kind of death | Sep 23 2006 1:46 utc | 42

Another thing. I do not think Iran has any nuclear weapons or any serious plans to develop them. Their (present or former?) highest ayatollah has said that nuclear weapons are evil and unislamic. Such stuff matters if you have a theocratic state.
Plus it is very expensive and the one good thing is to use them for MAD-standoffs which require a lot of them.

Posted by: a swedish kind of death | Sep 23 2006 2:06 utc | 43

Here’s what I don’t get at all. They’ve said all along that they don’t plan on a ground invasion of Iran – I’ve heard that from anywhere – it would be lunacy – anyway xUSgov doesn’t have the troops…but what the hell did Israel gain from bombing Lebanon? What’s the bloody point of just bombing them? What would that accomplish? One thing it would accomplish is kill off a helluva lot of Israelis from cancer, etc., due to the radioactive fallout that would blanket the ME. I’d bet it could also bring about the takeover of Pak. by Fundie Wackos, if, say, Mush. didn’t agree to nuke xAmericans…

Posted by: jj | Sep 23 2006 2:16 utc | 44

Last week’s UN traffic is being read by Europeans as a sure sign that Bush is backing off from the military option. If he goes forward, they’ll have just one conclusion to draw–viz., that the man Bush has no control over the actions of his country. The impact of such a conclusion on American relations with just about everyone would be, I think, incalculable. I mean, who would they work with in any future negotiation on any topic whatsoever?
Israel?

Posted by: alabama | Sep 23 2006 4:10 utc | 45

jj :
…but what the hell did Israel gain from bombing Lebanon? What’s the bloody point of just bombing them? What would that accomplish?
If fuels the rest of the world’s revulsion with Israel, which is coded as anti-Semitism by the neocons in Israel and used to justify more of the same sort of repulsive oppression of the Palestinians, outright land grabs, and genocide.
Same with the US. It is not a mistake that neocon policies result in hatred for the US and a similar revulsion at its criminal wars.

Posted by: John Francis Lee | Sep 23 2006 5:33 utc | 46

An attack on Iran would provide causus centrifugus for other nations to embark upon La Rue de Uranium.

Posted by: dooglefish | Sep 23 2006 5:33 utc | 47

@JFL – as in “we don’t care if you hate us, as long as you fear us”? hence, they’ll open up their markets, allow Western investment in their oil cos., etc. etc…

Posted by: jj | Sep 23 2006 5:56 utc | 48

Interesting report on the Russian Sunburn Missile by Mark Gaffney. The Iranians have this missile, a cruse missile, carries a 750lb warhead, travels close to the water in evasive pattern at Mach2.5 designed to defeat U.S. Aegis type ship defenses. Travels twice as fast as the exocet. They also have the more advanced Yakhonts missile which comes in close to Mach 3. Naval blockade? Could be more than risky.

Posted by: anna missed | Sep 23 2006 8:51 utc | 49

jj:
No… I mean at a lower, much lower level than that.
I mean that the status quo is acceptable to the neocons. All war all the time is ok. The financial interests behind them, oil companies and armaments makers, are profiting and agreeable to their remaining in power. The “challenge” is to keep the status quo alive so that they can remain in power. Staying in power is winning to them.
The more the rest of humanity lines up against us Americans and Israelis the more easily they may herd us, compliant and acquiescent in all the war crimes they have thus far committed and in those we can plainly see on the horizon. ‘The world hates you for your freedom/wants to drive you into the sea, and it’s better to fight them “over there” than here “at home” in America/Israel!’
You may say that we see through them, but the majority do not/cannot/choose not to do so, and the neocons in Washington/Tel Aviv don’t care about what we see or don’t see in any case.
We are not lifting a finger to stop them and that’s all they care about.
This is literally death as a way of life.

Posted by: John Francis Lee | Sep 23 2006 13:19 utc | 50

Since the only allegedly rational motive for bombing Iran, nukes or conventional, is to rally the base, it is most likely going to happen before 7 November: since (as I understand it) the prevailing winds will carry the radioactivity from nukes to the S/SE, we’ll have alot of pissed off Pakis and Indians to deal with.

Posted by: Brian Boru | Sep 25 2006 5:18 utc | 51