Billmon:
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July 28, 2006
WB: How To Win Friends and Influence People
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Bush and Crew are still mealy mouthing about diplomacy, saying sure, sure we need a ceasefire, but this next ceasefire has to last for eternity or it’s just not good enough.
Meaning, keep going Israel.
The international pressure on Israel to “stop doing this shit” is beyond enormous, and will inevitably begin translating into de facto economic sanctions. Fewer and fewer wanted to do business with apartheid South Africa even before it became fashionable to boycott them.
That Bush is pushing for an Immaculate Ceasefire — a thing that has never existed anywhere, at any time in history — means he wants this war to keep going.
That Israel has called up thirty thousand reservists to assist the several hundred Israeli troops now operating in Lebanon means they intend to continue.
None of which makes sense except as a means of expanding the war beyond its current size and theater.
To believe this war will now cool off and devolve into discussion mode requires that we first believe that the neocon war dogs governing Israel and America have changed their minds, and no longer wish to reduce and restrict their sworn enemies.
And that is hard to believe. Judging them by what they do instead of what they say, the opposite conclusion is easier to believe — that all this talk of the Mother of All Ceasefires is just deception, which is the first weapon of war.
Diplomacy is the art of saying nice doggie until you can find a rock.
America is shipping in precision guided bunker busters by the planeload, and Israel is calling up thirty thousand grunts.
They’re going with the rock.
Posted by: Antifa | Jul 28 2006 17:45 utc | 1
When I hear a Lebanese government official named Gemayal come on television and speak in a heartfelt supportive way of Lebanese resistance, then I know that we are all beyond the looking glass.
Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 28 2006 17:55 utc | 2
Minor disagreement w/Antifa. They’re calling up the Reservists ‘cuz they’re getting their asses kicked in Lebanon. They have to rush in more troops or they’ll be defeated. In fact many are already saying that the fact that they haven’t already prevailed is a huge victory for Hezbollah. I’m not sure what you mean by expansion. I seriously doubt that they intend to go further than the Litani River, but someone’s head should be on a stick for not having the reservists ready in case Hezb- was more battle ready than anticipated – of course, then it’s hard to play victim. I expect one reason they bombed UN was to both get them out & keep them from returning as peacekeeping force.
Nevertheless, if someone doesn’t wake up fast in Israel & Washington the consequences will be Catastrophic for all. Public opinion has already shifted in ME & throughout the world. Even the NYT couldn’t bury it:
At the onset of the Lebanese crisis, Arab governments, starting with Saudi Arabia, slammed Hezbollah for recklessly provoking a war, providing what the United States and Israel took as a wink and a nod to continue the fight.
Now, with hundreds of Lebanese dead and Hezbollah holding out against the vaunted Israeli military for 15 days, the tide of public opinion across the Arab world is surging behind the organization, transforming the Shiite group’s leader, Sheik Hassan Nasrallah, into a folk hero and forcing a change in official statements.
The Saudi royal family and King Abdullah II of Jordan, who were initially more worried about the rising power of Shiite Iran, Hezbollah’s main sponsor, are scrambling to distance themselves from Washington.Tide of Arab Opinion Turns to Support for Hezbollah
Bubbleboy is still yakking about Iran, but he damn well better let his Daddy take the wheel before we go over the cliff ‘cuz that simply isn’t possible.
Edward Peck, former Chief of Mission in Iraq, was on Amy’s show this am. He went over this winter & met w/Nasrallah. On the subject of taking hostages, Nasrallah said that it’s the only circumstances under which Israel will release prisoners it holds for years w/no trial. You take some of their soldiers & then they’ll swap!
Posted by: jj | Jul 28 2006 18:04 utc | 3
Your gifts of over $250 are eligible for a US IRS tax deduction.
Posted by: Cloned Poster | Jul 28 2006 18:24 utc | 4
When I hear a Lebanese government official named Gemayal come on television and speak in a heartfelt supportive way of Lebanese resistance, then I know that we are all beyond the looking glass.
If that was Amine Gemayal speaking, he was the Marionite Christian president of Lebanon during the civil war years of the 80’s. The entire Gemayal family has been heavily involved in Lebanese politics and have held high govt positions for decades. To hear him speak in support of Muslim Hezbollah is a huge blow to Isreal which certainly expected just the opposite.
Posted by: Ensley | Jul 28 2006 18:24 utc | 5
i must affirm my agreement with antifa
i feel it is a sort of ruse – it will deepen & engage syria
there is a reason, as i sd yesterday that israel might want a disengagemnt – simply because it is losing & it has gone too far
that would of course presume that this was not planne but i imagine it was & it was done at the behest of the u s & the americans need to break what they believe to be supply lines to the iraqi resistance in iraq
we need to be remided that the terrible events in lebanon mask bloody murder in gaza & an escalation of the slaughterhouse in iraq – this country where policy makers have to change their mind every six weeks, publically. that tells you how disastrously it is going
th us & israel believe their myth of invincibility (something my friend slothrop also seems to believe)& it is a myth & that myth is being dismantled – even in a relatively minor way – but it is a lesson to every other national, resistant, or jihadi movement. it will also be giving another lesson entirely to the potentates of the gulf
finally it is telling europe something it needs to understand
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 28 2006 18:28 utc | 6
I’m just pointing out here and there the means of violence possessed by the u.s. is immense. much greater lethality than existed in vietnam.
but I agree the ceasefire talk is a ruse. no way can israel afford not to at the very least disable the rocket attacks. and the u.s. can ill afford the perception of israeli defeat.
cool, isn’t it, the adroitness of the bush doctrine to impel policy always beyond the point of no return.
Posted by: slothrop | Jul 28 2006 18:46 utc | 8
cp @4, last year i worked for an israeli syrian jew who claimed just under $450,000 in charitable contributions to israeli organizations with us tax id numbers as deductions in his tax filing.
Posted by: conchita | Jul 28 2006 18:53 utc | 9
The expansion will be Israeli air strikes on Iran’s nuclear facilities.
The Revolt of the Generals removed nuclear bunker busters from the Iran Plan over at the White House. The Air Force replacement solution is ‘multiple conventional strikes’ on every Iranian bunker, instead (boom boom boom is the same as K-A-B-A-B-O-O-M! in USAF parlance.
The USAF is actively pushing a month-long campaign across Iran, hitting hundreds of targets, making that nation’s military incapable of effective response. No boots on the ground needed.
Regime collapse, Tonto. Regime change.
Well now . . . another Tee-Vee war in the Middle East would be just dandy for the November elections, thinks the Bush crew. But how to start the damn thing? The American public just isn’t buying Iraq: The Sequel. Oh, they want some Armageddon over there, but it has to look . . . all destined and such.
Well, if America can’t start the damn thing, America can still come in on a white horse and save the situation if it were to get out of hand.
How to get the Middle East out of hand? Ignoring it for five long years hasn’t done the trick.
Israel. If Israel can mix it up with Iran’s proxies, Iran will help those proxies with weapons and missiles. That’s a solid self-defense excuse for Israel to strike Iran.
Besides, Israel has already said that Iran has crossed “the tipping point,” where enriching uranium has earned them a preemptive Israeli air strike. Bush has publicly said that Israel is likely to act on its own that way.
Two good excuses for Israel to smite Iran!
And when Iran strikes back, America has a license to kill. America already has the extra aircraft carriers loitering in the region by, ummm, happenstance. We’re actually all ready to rumble.
Solution: have Israel start with Hizbollah in southern Lebanon, and after some smash and grab, launch some of America’s best bunker busters on Iran.
Just don’t let the UN eff things up with their peacekeeping and shit. Keep diplomacy alive until the Israelis have a few divisions active in the field so Syria can’t act.
Heh heh — Condi can’t act either, come to think of it. But she’ll have to. This show must go on.
This can work. Hell, this has to work.
Dammit, boys — America needs a new pair of shoes.
Posted by: Antifa | Jul 28 2006 19:13 utc | 10
i’m wondering, antifa- if those bombs sent so rapidly to israel from u s, in contravention to its ally’s laws at gatwick airport, have not a little to do with some of the action you describe
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 28 2006 19:17 utc | 11
How to influence
Original in plain face, my comments in italics.
For weeks, 12-year-old Merav has been buzzing about summer camp. On Friday, she heads off for her first overnight camping experience – two weeks at the “Kayitz b’Kibbutz” program at Kibbutz Shluchot, just south of Beit Shean in the Jordan Valley.
Isreali kids are real kids they do camp
Much of Merav’s excitement has been about what to bring. She’s spent hours and not an insignificant number of her parents’ shekels buying new gear – pajamas and a new bathing suit, a better sleeping bag, two disposable cameras, bug spray, suntan lotion, snacks for the bus ride, and many more items I’ve long since lost count of.
Israelis love to buy, children are concentrated on clag, abuzz about things, her parents buy her the proper good stuff, suntan lotion etc., and its all so much one can’t even remember it all
She has busily consulted with her friend Shayna, who was a camper the year before, on everything from what to expect on Shabbat to the type of boys she might meet. Together they have looked at pictures posted by the camp on its Web site. By this point, she knows just about all she can before actually getting there.
Israeli kids are cool kids, their friends are real important, they even take advice from them. 12-year-old girls are concerned with meeting boys – how cute, how precocious, how savvy, she is right up there, real popular. Of course, she has access to modern media, pictures, internet, and knows how to prepare. She is sexy and rich, at 12.
Except for one thing, which we haven’t had the heart to tell her. We’re not sure she should go.
Parents blithely let her prepare for an event which may not happen. If she is to be disapointed, it will be unexpectedly, and without proper explanation – a sudden cold shower, all the fault of others of course. A sad, horrendous, and somewhat fortuitous event, not anchored in any way except that her parents care for her security and evil is about…
You see, her camp is a two-hour drive north of Jerusalem. Which puts it potentially in Katyusha range of southern Lebanon.
Dramatic and thrilling. Imagine a lovely 12-year-old being deprived of camp because of rockets! Rowing on Lake Shirley and being in danger of rockets! Barbarous, unimaginable. Anyone who could such a thing, deprive 12-year-olds of their camp, disturb such idyllic scenes, complete with greenery, giggles, camp spirit, the epitome of healthy childhood deserves – death.
As the war with Hezbollah enters its third week, there seems little indication the missile barrage that has blanketed the north of Israel will let up any time soon. As of Wednesday, an estimated 1,402 missiles have been fired by Hezbollah – with Wednesday being the worst day of all with 119 rockets landing in Israel. Four people were injured, one seriously.
This normal life
— This kind of stuff is all over the net. A good example of the propaganda, beyond Frum et al. The exploitation of children is quite disturbing. It works, though, through identification (Israelis are just like Americans, etc.)
Posted by: Noirette | Jul 28 2006 19:18 utc | 12
Armitage Fears Bombing Campaign Will ‘End Up Empowering Hezbollah’
Richard Armitage dramatically broke ranks with his neoconservative allies yesterday, saying in a radio interview that he feared it was impossible to eliminate Hezbollah through airstrikes, and that by attempting to do so, “you’re going to end up empowering Hezbollah, and perhaps introducing an element into the body politic in Lebanon that will take some great period of time to recover from.” Armitage also criticized the Bush administration for refusing to talk directly to Syria.
According to a database search, no major media outlets have yet printed Armitage’s remarks.
source ; think progress
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 28 2006 19:23 utc | 13
Poor kid, she’ll be disappointed if she can’t go to summer camp and has to stay home. But then again, she still has a home unlike many Lebanese girls of her age.
Posted by: Ensley | Jul 28 2006 19:25 utc | 14
It is somewhat ironic whereby the implicitly held belief that “the only thing the arabs understand is force” is so woefully misunderstood by those who reach for it in mass with every imagined provication. Everyday Israel (& the U.S.) continues their lopsided celebration of overwhelming force, their hazy self representation to the rest of the world becomes more succinctly an image of evil. An evil whose prime supposition is fear and death. Or rather, the control of fear and death. Its not so far off primitive ritual sacrifice, where the control of death is a demonstration of political prowess ment to rival the powers of nature or god. Megalomania then, in modern parlance is the color and value — the self-portrait, Israel and the U.S. are now unveiling upon the world.
Posted by: anna missed | Jul 28 2006 19:34 utc | 16
jj
about the bomb & gatcwick & ms beckeetts belated offence – cnn
armitage – think progress
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 28 2006 19:37 utc | 17
Nevermind – here’s link to full transcript of Armitage’s very brief remarks on NPR
Posted by: jj | Jul 28 2006 19:38 utc | 18
Watched BBC, Sky tonight………… no news from the war front but the BBC Washington correspondent left the viewers (that said, I wonder how many were listening?) with the point that only an utter defeat for Hezbollah was the intended outcome of the US/UK summit pre-ceasefire deal.
The irony of the Blair/Bush bullshit of committing a strong “international” force to the buffer zone was that they are already up to their balls in Basra and Ramadi and can do fuck all… I bet the Turks are chomping at the bit.
Posted by: Cloned Poster | Jul 28 2006 20:25 utc | 19
anna missed, you said,
Its not so far off primitive ritual sacrifice, where the control of death is a demonstration of political prowess ment to rival the powers of nature or god.
This has given me pause for thought, thank you. Ever read Rene Girard on scapegoating & mimetic rivalry? Fascinating stuff. A good portrait of what happens when societies need to escape their own inner tensions and contradictions. Lots to think about.
Posted by: 2nd anonymous poster | Jul 28 2006 20:34 utc | 21
from that link jj
armitage says
Well, I remember with stunning clarity one of our Israeli interlocutors sitting in my office, telling me that, “Don’t worry about this peace in Galilee operation. We understand our neighbors very well. We understand them better than anyone. We know all the dynamics of the situation in Lebanon.” And that turned out not quite to be the case.
Posted by: Cloned Poster | Jul 28 2006 20:51 utc | 22
WHITE HOUSE PRESS CONFERENCE July 28 2006
BUSH: “Her instructions are to work with Israel and Lebanon to get a — to come up with an acceptable U.N. Security Council resolution that we can table next week.”
Table Next Week???
Correct me if I’m wrong but did our President just say (paraphrased)
We’re going to “come up with an acceptable U.N. Security Council resolution that we can Postpone the consideration of…Next week”???
Posted by: tescht | Jul 28 2006 22:38 utc | 23
Richard Armitage served in Vietnam and is a hard nosed realist. Not a delusional neo-con and not a signer of the PNAC manifesto like Cheney or Rumsfeld. But, like his boss, Colin, he sold out the American by going along with the nut case war mongers and not resigning before the misbegotten Iraq Invasion.
Posted by: Jim S | Jul 28 2006 22:39 utc | 24
What I don’t understand is this:
It seems, from reading these blogs, that were the U.S./Israel to strike Iran — because they have such superior fire power, they would be assured of success…. Yet everybody cautions that they don’t know what would happen next… $10/gal gas… major disruptions in the world’s economies… terrorists being given nuclear weapons by sympathizers in Pakistan…. in short, a world in greater chaos than now… So, if that’s the case, why do the neocons want to go through with this? I thought they were all about big business and corporate greed… bombing Iran couldn’t be good for economic stability… they must know this… (I won’t mention the carnage and suffering of thousands of people because I know that doesn’t factor into the equation…)
I’m just an average Canadian, with no real knowledge of world affairs, trying to make sense of the situation… I’ve read the comparision between when the Europeans slaughtered the native N.A. and just took over — because they had superior fire power… But to me, it’s simply not so cut and dried this time — and I’m thinking that they must know this…
Posted by: Dena | Jul 28 2006 22:49 utc | 25
bombing Iran couldn’t be good for economic stability
i’m not sure economic stability is in the plan. if oil becomes scarce and the price goes up, doesn’t that represent more $$ for the people who have access and control the flow?
Posted by: annie | Jul 28 2006 23:09 utc | 26
@Dena – So, if that’s the case, why do the neocons want to go through with this? I thought they were all about big business and corporate greed…
Neocons and big business are very distinct forces.
There are three different forces aligned supporting the current US administration and its policies:
1. Fundamental christians believing the end of the world is coming and furthering it
2. Big buisiness esp. oil business
3. A small but effective ideological cabal, the neocons. They are some megalomanic crazies working more in Israels interest than the US interest.
1, 2 and 3 currently have converging interests. All think their interest is furthered by more trouble in the middle east.
The end times will come nearer, the oil profits will go up, Israel will prevail and grow bigger if all its enemies get killed.
Only in this combination they are a force. Peel one away and the whole story falls apart. But sofar, nobody had the power and will to do that.
annie,
What you’re saying is true, but I for one will start leaving my car at home and take the subway if gas prices get out of hand — and I’m pretty sure, human ingenuity being what it is, that if gas prices go sky high, alternatives will be developed….. and then I hope ARAMCO etc. dies a horrible death and we’re free of this curse of being dependent on oil forever.
Posted by: Dena | Jul 28 2006 23:18 utc | 28
The always-delightful DEBKAfile, in an article otherwise full of the most blatant lies, makes a strong case for saying that this is a resource war as far as at least some high-ranking Israelis are concerned.
Perhaps the most important gain from the crisis is Israel’s recovery of control over its main sources of water, the Wazani springs in the divided Ghajar village. This was achieved in the early hours of the IDF push in the east. Israel will not cede this asset in a hurry. Worth citing in this regard is defense minister Amir Peretz’s statement Tuesday, 25, after US secretary of state Condoleezza Rice left the Middle East, that Israel would retain control of a security belt in southern Lebanon until a multinational force takes over.
Posted by: apodo | Jul 28 2006 23:22 utc | 29
@ tescht #23
Although tabled means postponed in the US, in Britain it means submitted for discussion. I really hope the British version is being used there…
Posted by: apodo | Jul 28 2006 23:26 utc | 30
Thanks for that, b.
The group that I really have the hardest time with, am flabbergasted by — and most of the time think they absolutely can’t be serious — are the Rapture crowd… I only took history in high school, but even I know that in the past people always thought the world was going to end — but it never did… In today’s day and age, with the Internet, free schooling, etc. how is it possible that people in a first world country can be so breathtakingly crazy? I mean, maybe they want the world to end, maybe that would be the answer to all their problems… but can’t someone tell them it’s just not going to happen? Or am I the one that’s being naive?
Posted by: Dena | Jul 28 2006 23:31 utc | 31
Via Laura Rozen a perfect propaganda piece
Intelligence reports indicate the leader of Hezbollah is hiding in a foreign mission in Beirut, possibly the Iranian Embassy, according to U.S. and Israeli officials.
Israeli military and intelligence forces are continuing to hunt for Sheik Hassan Nasrallah, Hezbollah’s secretary-general, who fled his headquarters in Beirut shortly before Israeli jets bombed the building last week.
“We think he is in an embassy,” said one U.S. official with access to the intelligence reports, while Israeli intelligence speculates Sheik Nasrallah is hiding in the Iranian Embassy.
…
But other reports from the region indicate Sheik Nasrallah may be in Damascus.
…
A Middle East diplomat confirmed that Israel is seeking out Sheik Nasrallah and that the Iranian Embassy appears mostly evacuated. However, the diplomat stated: “Wherever he is, he is a legitimate target,” similar to al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden. “He’s responsible for organizing attacks and killing Israelis,” the diplomat said.
no, the last i heard sheik nasrallah was hiding out in a tent in the rose garden at the white house – (he is said to be joined by richard cheney to talk some oil/arms deals)
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 28 2006 23:47 utc | 33
@Dena —
Sadly, here in America about half our adult population expresses a preference for the Book of Genesis over Darwin’s theory of evolution.
This is a function of soft living, television, an ubiquitous evangelical culture, and propaganda. It is not a result of considered thinking.
For example, about half of our citizens also believe that Iraq was behind the 9/11 bombing. In a fast food and TV culture, you can believe whatever you want, and there are no bad consequences. It simply doesn’t matter.
As a further example, about half our citizens never bother to vote. At all.
Because of that, the 12 to 15 percent of Americans who are true believers in Darbyism and the Rapture — and in voting — have about twice the punch at the ballot box than they should have.
As b pointed out, this Rapture ready crew are a key pillar of the current Administration. Pleasing them in their various fantasies does indeed drive the White House agenda and foreign policy in part.
We live in a comic book here in America. It’s less scary than the real world.
Posted by: Antifa | Jul 29 2006 0:21 utc | 34
from b’s link
�If confirmed, the reports could lead to an Israeli air strike on the embassy, possibly leading to a widening of the conflict, said officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity. Foreign embassies are sovereign territory and an attack on an embassy could be considered an act of war.
gee, ya think? we are getting a double whammy from the moonietimes. first the bolton recommendation from the ‘liberal democrat’ , then this.
Posted by: annie | Jul 29 2006 0:22 utc | 35
“Sadly, here in America about half our adult population expresses a preference for the Book of Genesis over Darwin’s theory of evolution.”
Half? Try 70-80%.
Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 29 2006 0:24 utc | 36
For the little girl above who did not get to go to camp:
Camp Granada – Allan Sherman
Hello Mudda,
hello Fadda,
Here I am at
Camp Granada.
Camp is very
entertaining,
And they say we’ll have some fun if it stops raining.
I went hiking
with Joe Spivy;
He developed
poison ivy.
You remember
Lenard Skinner;
He got ptomaine poisoning last night after dinner.
All the counselors
hate the waiters,
And the lake has
alligators,
And the head coach
wants no sissies,
So he reads to us from something called Ulysses.
Now I don’t want
that this should scare you,
But my bunkmate
has malaria.
You remember
Jeffery Hardy,
They’re about to organize a searching party.
Take me home, oh
Mudda, Fadda,
Take me home, I
hate Granada!
Don’t leave me
out in the forest,
Where I might get eaten by a bear.
Take me home,
I promise I will not make noise,
Or mess the house
with other boys,
O please don’t
make me stay,
I’ve been here one whole day.
(contd.)
Dearest Father,
Darling Mother,
How’s my precious
little brudda?
Let me come home
if you miss me,
I would even let Aunt Bertha hug and kiss me.
Wait a minute,
it stopped hailing,
Guys are swimming,
guys are sailing.
Playing baseball,
gee that’s betta,
Mudda, Fadda kindly disregard this letta!
Song Title: Camp Granada (1964)
Artist: Allan Sherman
Posted by: Ms. Manners | Jul 29 2006 0:25 utc | 37
We live in a comic book here in America. It’s less scary than the real world. or scarier depending on the MO of the powers that be. ‘wag the dog’, create your own reality mentality.
Posted by: annie | Jul 29 2006 0:28 utc | 38
Half? Try 70-80% comeon??? i don’t buy that. plllease, that’s just what the propaganda masters want us to believe, we aren’t that screwed up. are we?
Posted by: annie | Jul 29 2006 0:32 utc | 39
It depends how you ask the question. If you are asking if God was involved in creating the universe and the earth — whatever method he used, like evolution, etc — you will probably get 50%. But if you ask if God created the universe, the earth and all its creatures, including man, in only SIX DAYS about 6000 YEAR AGO, you would be lucky to get 10-20%. Most people accept geological and anthropological evidence as to the age of the earth and that mankind didn’t show up until way late; certainly not just a few days later. The Six-Day crowd is pretty small, even among devout Christians, but they love to twist the wording of the polls they use for propaganda.
Posted by: Ensley | Jul 29 2006 0:42 utc | 40
Thanks Antifa…
Well, if the world is less scary for Americans (and Canadians) now, my fear is that it will get a whole lot scarier if they did do anything as insane as become agressive in Iran… It’s the law of cause and effect…. they teach that in the bible too don’t they… as you sow… so you shall reap…
Posted by: Dena | Jul 29 2006 0:58 utc | 41
That “all they understand is force” genius will always be with us, loud-talking.
Posted by: gar | Jul 29 2006 1:47 utc | 42
How can I explain the power of the idea that the Bible is the most reliable source of truth available to human beings?
As someone who once believed this – and I still feel the temptation – let me try to explain how tempting it is to give credence to the Bible. Because…
The Bible speaks truth to power, promises that the last shall be first, and provides a just resolution to an unjust world.
Both in church and in politics, the Bible often provides just persons the solid ground from which to challenge the powers that be. What liberal humanist gives equal empowerment to real justice in the world today?
The Bible exposes the weaknesses of all the old Jewish kings and great men. What historical resource is more reliably critical of human frailty of the great, especially the great? What document has taught Christians more about how to see the world critically than the Bible?
When did the Hebrews prosper? When they listened to what God said and ignored the so-called wise men of the day. Do the wise lie? Clearly. Does God? [—– how would that work? Isn’t God a kind of synonym for truth?—–] Guess not. To whom should I listen? To God. But God is silent when I pray. Read the Bible, like everyone else has to, as Jesus recommended.
Do the Scriptures recommended by Jesus include the New Testament?
. . . . . .
Oops.
. . . . . .
. . .
But it takes work and suffering, and a supremely lonesome kind of auto-excommunication to get past reliance on all those people with whom you shared a devotion to study the new testament. And even the most stultified still hunger to learn, because they are human. So, because we are human, we learn the Bible, and believe a lot of it in the process – including crazy Uncle John’s dreams.
The heart of a heartless world. Karl was sharp.
It’s actually very lonely in the heart of the Beast. Especially just around the time you start to figure out that the Republic is an Empire, and you start to need a story that promises a clean end to the train wreck that is clearly coming from our silos to everyone’s homes. Wouldn’t it be nice if this disaster that I personally cannot stop actually had a lovely ending?
Yes, the end is too much to imagine, or to take responsibility for.
So we make like Leonard in Memento and gin up an original lie that, once tatooed in good and permanent, will be beyond our ability to doubt.
How can we Leonards realize that we lied to ourselves, because it felt better that way
Posted by: citizen | Jul 29 2006 1:51 utc | 43
@citizen:
If you believe in reincarnation, what happens right now does not matter that much, although I try to change it for the better, as I believe the better is.
More into other religions, than Christ or Mohammed, myself.
Posted by: Ms. Manners | Jul 29 2006 2:03 utc | 45
Ms. Manners,
I’ve found Buddhism to be an excellent critical resource/method to clean up my Christianity.
And my sense of reincarnation is that what happens now shapes who we will give rise to in the future. So, although I appreciate the cosmic scale on which to plod away, it still seems consequential. And giving up teleology has made this passing present more poignant.
Posted by: citizen | Jul 29 2006 2:11 utc | 46
@ 27 & 34
That’s rather reductionist. Many others in big business coalition: pharma, software, entertainment, and most especially military suppliers. Also, an inherited wealth contigency with much power and a mainstreet contingency which gets little press but would desert instantly with $6 gas.
The rapture ready crew have NO influence on foreign policy. Only domestic. The big boys don’t let them fuck around with the real works.
Posted by: BMOC | Jul 29 2006 3:28 utc | 47
Did Everyone see this? (In case I missed a post on one of the many threads…) Peace was about to break out in Israel, when ….read it & weep…
PRESS RELEASE
Drafted by Nafeez Mosaddeq Ahmed, Department of International Relations, University of Sussex
For immediate release 28.7.06
SHIN BET VETOED SECRET ISRAELI-PALESTINIAN PEACE AGREEMENT
Israeli and Palestinian Sources Concur: Israel Made War Inevitable
The Omega Institute (OI), which works closely with the Institute for Policy Research for Development (IPRD), has learned from Israeli and Palestinian sources that just prior to the current crisis, senior Hamas leaders were in active dialogue with Israeli religious leaders in a round of bilateral peace negotiations. Israeli negotiators included Rabbi Menachem Froman, former deputy leader and co-founder of the Israeli Settler movement Gush Khatif; Rabbi David Bigman, head of the liberal religious Kibbutz movement Yeshiva at Ma’ale Gilboa; and Yitzhak Frankenthal, founder of the Arik Institute. Ongoing negotiations had resulted in a breakthrough peace “understanding”, which was to be announced at a press conference in Jerusalem to mark the launching of an extraordinary peace initiative. Israeli Prime Minister Olmert had been briefed extensively about the initiative by Frankenthal. Also due to attend the conference were Khaled Abu Arafa, the Palestinian Cabinet Minister for Jerusalem, Sheikh Muhamed Abu Tir, senior Hamas Member of the Palestinian Parliament, and other senior Palestinian delegates.
The meeting was to announce a joint Israeli-Palestinian call for the release of Corporal Gilad Shalit who had been abducted by Hamas in Gaza, along with proposals for the beginning of the release of all Palestinian prisoners. These measures were to precipitate unprecedented new peace negotiations on a framework peace agreement, drawn on the 1967 borders. The presence of Palestinian Cabinet Officers and senior Israeli religious leaders in contact with the Prime Minster was to underline the seriousness of this peace proposal on both sides.
Just hours before the meeting was due to start, the Israeli Shin Bet internal Security Service arrested Abu Tir and Abu Arafa and warned them not to attend the meeting, under threats of detention. The meeting, which offered a major opportunity to obtain Shalit’s release and launch a new framework for peace, was thrown into disarray. The next day, the Israeli Defence Force (IDF) invaded Gaza, and the day after both Abu Tir and Abu Arafa were abducted by Israeli forces, along with a third of the Palestinian Cabinet, provoking a predictable escalation of violence.
Israel simultaneously began conducting covert incursions on to Lebanese territory, provoking Hizbollah’s capture of two IDF soldiers. Credible sources confirm that the soldiers were not abducted on Israeli territory, but inside Lebanon.SHIN BET VETOED SECRET ISRAELI-PALESTINIAN PEACE AGREEMENT
In 2002-03 there was big shakeup in Mossad w/firings & resignations. Anyone have more info. on this.
Posted by: jj | Jul 29 2006 4:26 utc | 48
Oops, confused Mossad w/Shin Bet (Israeli FBI?)…NeoNut Hot bed?
Posted by: jj | Jul 29 2006 4:30 utc | 49
I know it’s difficult to believe but sometimes bad things don’t happen to good people.
Despite the way the US is crowing about getting it’s Iran resolution up at the Security Council, it really isn’t anything other than another wait and see. Even that much was impossible until USuk agreed to pull the pin on Israel by mid-next week. What may have started out as a ploy to pressure Iran has back-fired big time. As for stories about bombing embassies in Syria because Nasrullah ‘may be in them’ that is just more smoke being blown up the US voters’ asses to distract them from BushCo’s biggest balls-up yet (bombing an embassy of a nation yer not at war with in a nation you’re not at war with, is a real genuine international crime with all sorts of consequences, remember no one can say accident or collateral damage on that one, cause Syria isn’t meant to be getting bombed at all in fact even in wartime it’s a big-time crime).
The unprecendented support Hezbollah has won throught the Mid East from xtian as well as islam communities and the simple truth that israel cannot dislodge HB from around those villages close up to their common border, the increasing public condemnation and dissatisfaction within Israel (you’d think old Joe Lunchbox in amerika would get a bit hot under the collar about the fact that a foreigner’s vote [Israeli voter] has about 150 times more power in the US than a US voter’s vote does , but that as they say is another story) all of this has left the assholes standing on a new rug with a turd in each hand and their cigarette about to burn their lips.
They shifting from foot to foot without any idea of what to do next, except the sneaking suspicion if they don’t come up with something shortly they’ll piss their pants.
There’s a lot of bluster but underneath near complete paralysis as all the little ‘events’ carefully roved together in succession jam up one behind the other like boxes on a conveyor outta the box machine when the one right at the front has got jammed. A few are getting bent, in fact a couple are awful squashed, but worst of all the pressure of them all squishing up is like a spring and pretty soon there will be a loud SPROOOING! everything’s gonna go flyin every which way. So instead of tryin to clear the jam everyone is half duckin n waitin n prayin not to get hit, but hopefully scoop up a box that aint broke and make a run for the door.
Too many good people are goin to die between now and about Thursday the third but the worst of the killing will have ended by then.
All of this wild shit BushCo is talking is so that even most of his wing-nuts are secretly relieved when Dubya claims a victory which leaves HB better off Israel halfway down the gurgler and vlad the retailer promising he ‘might’ consider sanctions against Iran.
Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 29 2006 6:51 utc | 50
Small correction, comrade remembering:
The US is using Prestwick airport nr Glasgow, Scotland (not Gatwick airport in East Sussex, England) in to ship its cargo of death ™ to Israel, and despite anything la Beckett has to say about it, the shipments continue this weekend.
Posted by: Dismal Science | Jul 29 2006 13:16 utc | 51
Also, the IDF nearly got Robert Fisk (yesterday’s Independent). He says his vehicle (he was travelling w/ the Red Cross) was 25 seconds away from an IDF air bomb as it exploded. Just after I had been asking someone who used to live in Lebanon this week how many lives does he actually have? Nine? 29?
She told me that the UK Foreign Office called him in during the Halabja massacre and told him his reporting of it was distinctly unhelpful to British interests in Iraq.
I wonder if the FCO will do the same now that he is still scouting about in South Lebanon while Bliar disgracefully vacillates over calling for a ceasefire. My friend thinks the IDF will kill Fisk and blame Hizbollah or the Syrians.
On the same day the IDF also nearly got the BBC’s Jim Muir, who was travelling w/ an Australian embassy convoy trying to get people out of South Lebanon. There are apparently 1,000s still trapped there who can’t get out.
Fisk says Patrick Cockburn, who is in Baghdad, and him think that their respective guardian angels are about to form a trade union and ask for better working conditions. Although Fisk & Cockburn have both demonstrated over and over again that they have balls of steel, unlike every fucking Cheney Gang Chickenhawk and 101st Fighting Keyboarder that ever lived, I wonder how long they can on like this without going into shock or post-traumatic stress thingy or whatever it is called these days. I mean that as no disrespect to two guys who are obviously fighting Irish to their bones, but modern conflict is just disgusting beyond belief. How many dead kids can you see without losing it?
I hope that they, and every serious human worthy of the title journalist reporting this conflict, are going to be OK, both now and in the long term.
Posted by: Dismal Science | Jul 29 2006 13:19 utc | 52
Plus thanks yet again to b, billmon and all the barflies for collective space to voice thoughts and rage against all this
peace
Posted by: Dismal Science | Jul 29 2006 13:22 utc | 53
dismal science
i have been thinking the same thing about both fisk & coburn
i am reading fisk’s book
& the only thing i do not like is the haughtiness but he has a right to it before the like of savages like andersooncooper & matt frei
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 29 2006 14:02 utc | 54
Speaking of “How to win friends and influence people”, the following link from Raw Story regarding a New York Times article today. Sorry I don’t have the Times link..
Bush Administration virtually ignores Syria’s ambassador to the United States during Mideast crisis
Of course this guy has made all the rounds almost daily on cabel tv – hurled insult after insult. No need for dialog with the current administration. I was tempted to put this under “Killing Death Squad Leaders” for contrast.
the syrian at the u n has a doctorate in political science & an uncanny resemblane to peter lorre
at least he doesn’t look like a fatboy surfer bolton who is a perverse mixture of meatloaf & freddy nietzsche
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 29 2006 14:47 utc | 56
Israel backed by army of cyber-soldiers
Times on line, July 28, 2006.
WHILE Israel fights Hezbollah with tanks and aircraft, its supporters are campaigning on the internet.
Israel’s Government has thrown its weight behind efforts by supporters to counter what it believes to be negative bias and a tide of pro-Arab propaganda.
The Foreign Ministry has ordered trainee diplomats to track websites and chatrooms so that networks of US and European groups with hundreds of thousands of Jewish activists can place supportive messages.
more:
Link
(sorry if posted before…too many threads…)
Posted by: Noirette | Jul 29 2006 16:54 utc | 57
@Noirette #57
Of course, and depending on how sucessful it is, we (I should say they) will adopt it, for our own ends. If iN fact, it didn’t start with US.
Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jul 29 2006 17:09 utc | 58
trainee diplomats?
fatboy surfer bolton who is a perverse mixture of meatloaf & freddy nietzsche?
the assholes standing on a new rug with a turd in each hand and their cigarette about to burn their lips. (Why not a lit firecracker up the wazoo for good measure?)
Boy, I have been missing some fun by not being around here lately.
Posted by: Malooga | Jul 29 2006 17:23 utc | 59
r’gaip,
The Syrian Ambassador was on the receiving end of “insult after insult” on the talk shows and yet, he remained very calm. Bolton was always interviewed on cable tv talk shows by himself, and said there was no need to talk to the ambassador.
rick
no he’s not doing too bad at all – he has been treated with an impoliteness characteristic of jackalls
Posted by: r’giap | Jul 29 2006 18:13 utc | 61
…regarding my post 55, this constant theme of isolating and refusal to talk seems to me a sure sign of plans to attack Iran. The ideas of death squads and military solutions being discussed in b’s thread is a stark contrast to this Syrian ambassador’s attempts for dialog. R’giap sums it up better than I: “impoliteness characteristic of jackalls.”
U.S. not talking to its enemies
Try as hard as I can, I just can’t remember what it was that Syria did to the US, or threatened to do to the US, that made it our “enemy.” Generally, “enemies” have to do something to you to become enemies. Or at least threaten to flatten NYC or something. What has Syria done to us?
Posted by: Ensley | Jul 29 2006 23:35 utc | 65
We are already at the point where “talking” is so “old Europe.”
The hard part was pulling the New Pearl Harbor stuff off, and getting the machinery of war rolling in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Once the war machine gets rolling, and builds up a pretty good head of steam, as it has now, it is capable of carrying on quite well under its own internal logic.
As a matter of fact, we are getting near the point, as Billmon has intimated, where the problem becomes one of too much momentum, and the machine becomes either very difficult, or even impossible, to slow down.
Other machines join in, like a demolition derby. For a brief while, a giddy feeling of uncontrolled euphoria takess over. Then it cycles manically with depression.
When it becomes impossible to slow down, or control, then you have a situation like a runaway reaction in a nuclear plant (in more ways than one). It can become nigh on impossible to prevent a complete meltdown.
Posted by: Malooga | Jul 30 2006 1:09 utc | 66
Ensley,
Basicly, according to the U.S./Israel, Syria supports terrorists groups. Ironicaly Bolton said there was no need for dialog because Syria could talk to the U.S. embassy in Syria. (The U.S. ambassador was recalled from there !!!)
Scroll down almost to the bottom for info
Additional note on Syria,
Syria has a population of about 20 million. Refugees from Lebanon have been pouring in there by the thousands, perhaps tens of thousands, mostly Shia, and they are welcome.
Statistics from U.S. State Dept. frm link above:
Ethnic Syrians are of Semitic stock. Syria’s population is 90% Muslim–74% Sunni, and 16% other Muslim groups, including the Alawi, Shi’a, and Druze–and 10% Christian. There also is a tiny Syrian Jewish community.
Arabic is the official, and most widely spoken, language. Arabs, including some 400,000 Palestinian refugees, make up 90% of the population.
————
From these figures of population, it appears that Israel has made a big mistake with all these refugees pouring into Syria.
The bible does state that Christ will return and rapture his church this is the generation that will see it,…as the bible states…no one may know the hour or the day for I will come like a thief in the night. However it does tell us we will know the season. Right now we are seeing biblical prophesy coming true or havent you noticed the increase of activity in the middle east and the increase of weather phenomena? Im sure some of you are christians and im sure some of you believe that Christ died on the cross…im sure you have at least glanced at the bible…everything that is happening and i mean EVERYTHING has been prophesied. Check for yourself if you dont believe me….wars and rumors of war, pestilence and famine, weather phenomena increasing.
Posted by: Child of Christ | Sep 10 2006 2:23 utc | 69
After examining it from several angles, I find this argument in no way implausible.
Posted by: Rowan | Sep 10 2006 7:16 utc | 70