Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
October 18, 2005
Plame Thread V

After first reading today’s Washington Post VandeHei/Pincus piece I saw nothing new in there. But firedoglade had better eyes and found these bits:

Senior administration officials said there was a document circulated at the State Department — before Libby talked to Miller — that mentioned Plame. It was drafted in June as an administrative letter and addressed to then-Undersecretary of State Marc Grossman, who was acting secretary at the time since Secretary of State Colin L. Powell and Deputy Secretary Richard L. Armitage were out of the country.

As a former State Department official involved in the process recalled it, Grossman wanted the letter as background for a meeting at the White House, where the discussion was focused on then growing criticism of Bush’s inclusion in his January State of the Union speech of the allegation that Hussein had been seeking uranium from Niger.

Grossman has refused to answer questions about the letter, and it is not clear whether he talked about it at the White House meeting he was said to have attended, according to the former State official.

So far we only knew that this June 10 document was printed out and send to Powell on board of Air Force One on July 6. It was speculated that it was from there (through Ari Fleischer?) that the name Plame/Wilson moved to Novak, who then was the first to put it into the public.

We are now told, that this letter reached the White House much earlier through Grossman who requested it as background for a meeting at the White House. That meeting was about a counterstrategy to the Niger criticism. Who might have attended that meeting?

RawStory has something on that:

Two officials close to Fitzgerald told RAW STORY they have seen documents obtained from the White House Iraq Group which state that Cheney was present at several of the group’s meetings. They say Cheney personally discussed with individuals in attendance at least two interviews in May and June of 2003 Wilson gave to New York Times columnist Nicholas Kristof and Washington Post reporter Walter Pincus, in which he claimed the administration ‘twisted’ prewar intelligence and what the response from the administration should be.

Was it one of these meetings and discussion with Cheney that Grossman did attend? With the Plame/Wilson information in his pocket? I hope Fitzgerald has answers to these questions.

Some other loose ends:

– AP reports that Plame was NOT part of the CIA WINPAC analyst group as Libby told Miller, but:

[Plame] worked on the CIA’s secret side, the directorate of operations, according to three people familiar with her work for the spy agency.

 
– It is often said that the NY Times OpEd’s, first by Kristof and then by Wilson himself, triggered the White House response. But as Wilson says in his book, the first time he was used as an anonymous source disputing the Niger documents was earlier, on March 14 2003 in a CNN report. (Unfortunately the video is not online anymore.) Wilson also alleges that White House interest in him started just after that CNN report.

– As Laura Rozen points out Judy Miller had just written a book about biological weapons and Washington was her beat when someone killed five people by sending Anthrax around. Judy Miller never really explored the Anthrax story in an article. Her beat, her expertise – why no reporting?

– What are the connections to the deaths of State Department WMD expert John J. Kokal and David Kelly?

– And the ultimate question: Who gave the order to spread the Anthrax?

Comments

Yes, these are all questions screaming for answers, but
it’s hard to believe we’re going to be so lucky
as to learn any more than is pleasing to our hidden masters. Cheney and Bush may go, but “the lobby”
will be with us long after they are gone, and although
a few “pawns” (popular word in Washington of late) will be sacrificed, and a few venerable institutions reduced to laughingstocks (NYTimes, US Congress, just to name two, in decreasing order or institutional gravity) the elites will go on unperturbed.

It is disgusting that the crow-bar being used to dismantle the Bush administration is rather more lèse-majesté against the CIA analyst faction, rather than the war itself. Apparently bombing, torturing and starving innocents is perfectly OK, but fucking the CIA
is fatal. One can hope (and I do) that the explosion
in the offing is more devastating than expected to
elite institutions and folkways, but it’s playing out like little more than the denouement of a ferocious burocratic turf battle.

Posted by: Hannah K. O’Luthon | Oct 18 2005 10:37 utc | 1

I’d be rejoicing at the imminent implosion of the Secret Government if I wasn’t so worried that they could be replaced by something even worse.
I concur with Ms. O’Luthon. People are not deserting this administration because it broke the law and started an illegal and immoral war, but because it is losing.
If things were ‘going well’ none of this would be happening.
There has to be a change of mindset and a rethinking of how our economy is powered, to get us off the war tit, before any of this will change.

Posted by: hopping madbunny | Oct 18 2005 10:43 utc | 2

2 Interesting posts from Americablog:
And the big beneficiary of Brewster-Jennings and Associates being defanged? None other than I. Lewis Libby’s 15-year (1985-2000) client: Marc Rich and his international arms biz.
Hornet | 10.18.05 – 5:21 am
PLAME WAS CHENEY’S WARNING TO OTHERS NOT TO SING!!!
MANY PEOPLE IN GOVERNMENT KNOW THAT CHENEY LIED ABOUT IRAQ (HE’S GREEDY AND HE NEEDED TO MAKE BILLIONS FOR HALLIBURTON TO GET THEM OUT OF THE ASBESTOS-LIABILITY HOLE HE GOT THEM INTO WHEN HE, AS CEO, PURCHASED HARBISON WALKER -A COMPANY WITH HUGE ASBESTOS LIABILITY- AN ACQUISITION THE WSJ CALLS THE WORST ACQUISITION OF THE CENTURY).
WHEN THE FIRST PERSON TO CHALLENGE THE LIES CAME ALONG (JOE WILSON EXPOSING THE LIES ABOUT URANIUM), CHENEY WANTED TO BE SURE THAT EVERYONE
WHO KNEW ABOUT THE LIES GOT THE MESSAGE THAT IF YOU SQUEAL, YOUR CAREER WILL BE RUINED.
That’s what Plame-Gate is all about!
Dan in Baltimore
Dan Cobb | 10.18.05 – 6:49 am |

Posted by: jj | Oct 18 2005 11:29 utc | 3

William Rivers Pitt reminds us that there is more to the story.

WHIG, and its intention to sell an unnecessary war to a shell-shocked public, is only half the story. The other half of the manipulative sales team could be found in the neighborhood occupied by the Department of Defense. The Office of Special Plans, or OSP, was created by Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld specifically to second-guess and reinterpret intelligence data to justify war in Iraq. Think of it like baseball: the OSP pitched, and WHIG caught.
The OSP was on no government payroll and suffered no Congressional oversight. Their tainted information and interpretations overtopped the Iraq data being provided by the State Department and CIA. The OSP was able to accomplish this thanks to devoted patronage from high-ranking members of the administration, most prominently Vice-President Cheney.

Justin Raimondo and others have been saying all along that Plamegate is connected to the Franklin/AIPAC spy case. It was the OSP, for which Franklin worked, that provided some of the “intel” that WHIG used to hype it’s war. It is probably asking for too much that Fitz will be able to link them in court. Rivers continues:

Two questions remain: why would the administration take such a fantastic risk in attacking Wilson, and where are Bush’s fingerprints on this thing? Both questions can be answered by another tidbit that has fallen down the memory hole. On May 22nd, 2003, two months after the invasion of Iraq, George W. Bush signed an Executive Order titled “Protecting the Development Fund for Iraq and Certain Other Property in Which Iraq Has An Interest.”
The so-called “Development Fund for Iraq” was, by the way, one of the most grandiose money-laundering schemes ever devised. All of the profits made from plundering Iraq’s oil were to go into this fund, ostensibly for use by the Iraqi people. In fact, this was the clearing-house for payouts to companies like Halliburton and its subsidiary, Kellog Brown & Root.

It is easy to bury ourselves in the minutae of the Plame scandal (who said what and when to whom, lie vs inaccurate memory, etc) and forget the bigger picture. Whatever crime was committed in this affair is part of a much larger crime that will most likely go unpunished. I’m all for convicting all of these people, but whatever Fitz gets them for legally will be comparable to Al Capone’s conviction for income tax evasion: he did a hell of a lot worse than avoid paying taxes but that was all that could be proved in court. My guess is Fitz understands that but wants to give them as much of what they really deserve as he can.

Posted by: lonesomeG | Oct 18 2005 13:43 utc | 4

thanks for bringing up the John Kokal article. it was fishy from day 1, but few have been wanting to touch it. even Madsen only reported on it twice. I’m not saying he was murdered, but the change in his security clearance certainly smells connected to the funny business of the NeoCons. I just wonder what kind of pressures were brought to bear on David Kelly and Kokal that would induce them to commit suicide. and I had forgotten about Dr. Gus Weiss.
it’s just too fishy

Posted by: dk | Oct 18 2005 14:09 utc | 5

Bits of news
Reuters

Fitzgerald’s office said on Monday it had decided to announce any decisions in the Plame case in Washington, rather than Chicago, where the special prosecutor is based.
It is unusual for Fitzgerald’s office to comment on the case and the statement led some observers to wonder if it might signal an imminent decision or that Fitzgerald was trying to increase pressure on potential targets to cut a deal.

In Britain the barkeeper announces “Last Call Please”. Whoever needs a deal with Fitzgerald should order now. The Grand Jury sits on Wednesdays and Fridays, so indictments may come tomorrow. But I guess it depends on who orders up a deal.

Cheney’s name has come up amid indications Fitzgerald may be edging closer to a blockbuster conspiracy charge – with help from a secret snitch.
“They have got a senior cooperating witness – someone who is giving them all of that,” a source who has been questioned in the leak probe told the Daily News yesterday.

by NY Daily News
A bit soft, only one source, but I guess it’s right. Someone made his/her deal quite early.

Posted by: b | Oct 18 2005 15:08 utc | 6

“A bit soft, only one source, but I guess it’s right. Someone made his/her deal quite early.”
Well you know, it’s first come, first served.

Posted by: Billmon | Oct 18 2005 15:42 utc | 7

something tells me we are going to start hearing more about freddie in the days to come.
fredrick fleitz

Insights leap out of recently declassified e-mail messages from the office of Undersecretary of State John Bolton, archdeacon of politicization. I was particularly struck to learn from the Washington Post that Bolton’s principal aide and chief enforcer, Frederick Fleitz, is actually a CIA analyst on loan to Bolton. In this light, his behavior in trying to cook intelligence to the recipe of high policy is even more inexcusable. CIA analysts, particularly those on detail to policy departments, have no business playing the enforcer of policy judgments, have no business conjuring up “intelligence around the policy.”

Posted by: annie | Oct 18 2005 16:21 utc | 8

Even more: fredrick fleitz was part of WINPAC the anaylst group for WMD. He probably did knew about Plame as she was on the operative site of the WINPAC business.

Posted by: b | Oct 18 2005 16:31 utc | 9

actually he’s the chief of staff @ winpac

FREDERICK FLEITZ:  August 2001. BRIAN McKEON:  And have you been — for the three and a half, going on four year period you’ve been there — have you been acting Chief of Staff, or did you have other positions and other duties?
FREDERICK FLEITZ:  I came on as a Special Assistant in August 2001, and sometime in 2002, the Executive Assistant left, and I took this, the responsibilities of this job had actually been passed to me, and they just weren’t able to find another Chief of Staff, so I just kept performing those duties. (note, the pagination on this file is unreliable, so I wont give page numbers)

Posted by: annie | Oct 18 2005 16:37 utc | 10

excuse me i read that wrong. he’s bolton’s chief of staff sorry. i was cross referencing the cuban allegations in a previous link… oh never mind… spinning head

Posted by: annie | Oct 18 2005 16:45 utc | 11

Freddy, don’t ever take sides with anyone against the Family again. Ever.

Posted by: Cheney | Oct 18 2005 16:46 utc | 12

whoops. i also should have added this
A senior aide to Vice President Dick Cheney is cooperating with special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald in the outing of CIA agent Valerie Plame Wilson, sources close to the investigation say.

Posted by: annie | Oct 18 2005 18:12 utc | 14

Would Cheney take Bu$h down or protect him? Rove will protect him, since for him meeting Idiot was love at first sight.
One thing that’s coming out is how deeply personal the war in Iraq was. For Cheney, as I posted on another thread, w/out the war, Halliburton would likely have gone under from his disastrous stewardship – this was the war to make him rich. Aren’t there charges for that, say under RICO? For Idiot, it was about “being a man” – too cowardly to fight; too much of a homosexual & drug addict to even stay in national guard…but goddamnit now HE Commands the Most Powerful Military in the History of the World…The strategy, the oil, China…all wayyy off in the distance…Greed & Redemption

Posted by: jj | Oct 18 2005 19:27 utc | 15

In Arabic, a “P” is usually transcribed as a “B”. For example an Arab would typically pronounce the word “people” as “beeble”. Arabic does have a symbol for “F” sounds, though. So I don’t think that the informer was an Arab.

Posted by: George | Oct 18 2005 22:16 utc | 16

It’s a nuisance that there’s a Scots actor by the same name as the ‘give-up’. I did find one story about John Hannah though. It’s from early last year and tells us he may have been Fitz’s squeeze pretty much from day one.

“Federal law-enforcement officials said that they have developed hard evidence of possible criminal misconduct by two employees of Vice President Dick Cheney’s office related to the unlawful exposure of a CIA officer’s identity last year. The investigation, which is continuing, could lead to indictments, a Justice Department official said.
According to these sources, John Hannah and Cheney’s chief of staff, Lewis “Scooter” Libby, were the two Cheney employees. “We believe that Hannah was the major player in this,” one federal law-enforcement officer said. Calls to the vice president’s office were not returned, nor did Hannah and Libby return calls”.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Oct 19 2005 0:24 utc | 17

i know that it always darkest before the dawn – but i’m feeling especially pessimistic about the possibilities of indictments of anybody but the most inconsequential
if this thing was to hit with the force that many of us have been predicting on the net all over the place – it would be malfeasance of historic proportions making that vicious thug nixon & his goons look like small fry
if fitz really has the nonesty & courageousess to follow this through – perhaps there would be a real hope for another america
i watched television here for the first time in a year – watched all the anglo informatin sources & not one mention in over four hours of anything to do with this criminal administration – not one – plenty on the show trial of saddam & the maybe & maybe nots in relation to the bird flu but nothing at all on – fitzgerald or on delay or on the whole series of crimes that have been committed openly
for gitzgerald to do the real work – he would be unbalancing the whole structure – even if those things like jurisprudence & the media rest the corrupt coils that they are – politics will never be the same
ô i want these fuckers allright but i am trying to be cool about what are the real possibilities
there is a show trial in chicago of a certain salah who is being prosecuted by fitzgerald – perhaps he is like his namesake & can keep two contending positions in his head att the same time – but i fear that we will be dissapointed & the defeat of a real politics will be total
for thos of us here in europe – what is the substance or not of rawstory.com – there graphics are shit – looks like they’re inherited by someone working for murdoch who’s taken to mescaline. firedoglake – good but very teasing – dkos like some harvard undergraduates idea of democracy – perhaps i am being too dark – i hope i am
sometimes i feel we are living in a parrallel universe to the one being inhabited by the ‘information’ agencies

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 19 2005 0:41 utc | 18

OK I hate search engines, but pulled all of my sniffers out years ago (pedantic bandwidth chewers) but Hannah was a key player in the WMD disinformation campaign as well as being up to his neck in the Plame outing .
Juan Cole says:

“Libby and Hannah form part of a 13-man vice presidential advisory team, sort of a veep NSC, which helps underpin Cheney’s dominance in the US foreign policy area. Hannah is a neoconservative and old cold warrior who is really more of a Soviet expert than a Middle East expert. But in the 90s he for a while headed up the Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP), a think tank that represents the interests of the American Israel Political Action Committee (AIPAC). Hannah is said to have been behind Cheney’s and consequently Bush’s support for refusing to deal with Yasser Arafat. But he was also deeply involved in getting up the Iraq war.”

Does that mean all of these people are being killed and maimed because BushCo managed to get a frustrated cold war warrior whose CIA career had been cut off at the knees by perestroika, inside the tent (May 2 2002).

Posted by: Debs is dead | Oct 19 2005 0:58 utc | 19

great find Debs. i have so much faith everything will fall into place. feeling giddy. can’t wipe the grin off my face. none of them are a match for fitzgerald. coles post means fritz has been onto hannah since day 1. while we were all sleeping he was circling. can’t wait to read the book.

The strategy of the FBI is to make clear to Hannah “that he faces a real possibility of doing jail time” as a way to pressure him to name superiors, one federal law-enforcement official said.

it wasn’t just hannah, it takes a village

Posted by: annie | Oct 19 2005 1:24 utc | 20

Israel Maintains Option To Strike Iran Nukes
Dots? anybody ever play pacman?

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 1:47 utc | 21

For rememberinggiap. I read your posts with great interest and anticipation, and perhaps someday when I am posted back in Paris we will get together. Here is what you need to know. I think you wil understand. The struggle of which we are only seeing the most superficial spume is between the CIA and the thugs who have effectively taken over the United States government. I appreciate that you have some problems with the CIA, but looking from a US perspective, it is an institution peopled by persons of exceptional ability and total dedication to the security of the United States. That they may have been mis-used is doubtless; that they may have mis-used themselves and the United States, doubtless also. That is the way of superspy organizatons. But they are good people. I knew at one time long ago, some very high officials in the KGB. They were also good people, totally patriotic, and in an odd sense, liberal.
The CIA are charged with protecting this country. Their job is intelligence, but they have an operations division. Ms Plame was in that division. They are not happy about her having been outed, and they are more than unhappy that the crew of adolescent bandits who have taken over the United States government have seriously compromised the national security of the United States. These people are feeding Fitzgerald the stuff he is working on. It was their stuff that he took to Judge Hogan, who gave him the authority to widen the investigation. This is politics at the highest stake. David Kelly died – and some (me included) think he was murdered. The CIA is watching Fitzgerald’s back.
So, though you don’t particularly like the United States and certainly don’t trust the CIA, think about this. We are witnessing a struggle between what’s left of the old government and a band of criminals who effectively mounted a coup d’etat. Fitzgerlad is the the CIA’s answer to that challenge. What you have to understand is that the justice system at the federal level is immune to popular politics, and is peopled by professionals. When the cases go to court it’s a different story, but by then the damage is done. If the story gets out, whether the criminals get off or not doesn’t matter, except to those who are hooked on revenge. The indictments reverse the coup d’etat.
Bush has no ability. When he’s stripped of his thugs, he is naked. There will be a de facto caretaker government.

Posted by: Knut Wicksell | Oct 19 2005 1:49 utc | 22

an institution peopled by persons of exceptional ability and total dedication to the security of the United States….good people
How do you know this? You can’t prove it, because the CIA is unaccountable to our ‘democracy.’
I acknowledge this error, because ‘liberals’ now make strange bedfellows w/ ‘spooks’ in the effort to declaim/imprison admin. officials.
At the end of the long trip to find these assholes indicted, ‘liberals’ extol the sanctity of our dear old CIA. WTF?

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 19 2005 2:25 utc | 23

knut
you are always welcome
have thought from the beginning that this was an intercinine conflict as it was during the cuban missile crisis – at the basest level between those who think within the elites & those that don’t
it has certainly seemed from here like a classic cia destabilisation – but in this case – i support those who are enemies of my enemy – & yes ironic tho it may seem i know that the liberal intelligentsia have often populated the cia – tho it has had some very odd odd people – james jesus angleton – amongst the oddest (read roman clef – flowers for mother – about him) – there was the buthcher helms who believed his predecessor – colby – was a kgb mole from their moscow directorate
whatever – it is intercinine at a zairean level – waiting for mr kurtzy – to come out white house with two severed heads in his hand & holding a ledger of incoming telephone calls
from here – not clear – who will win this fight – the general public does not seem to give a fuck while the rest of the world looks like it could go up in flames & every day the mullahs have one recruit more – to follow their way into jihad
as i have sd before – a military defeat – of the illegal occupation forces – would do the trick – but a political defeat in washington of the kind we are envisaging through fitzgerald would go a long way toward calming the bedlam we are facing

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 19 2005 2:33 utc | 24

Anyway, it’s good to read the posts of outraged, alabama, pat, and others who were on vacation. thankx for coming back.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 19 2005 2:35 utc | 25

If we don’t radically distract these Savages quickly, we’re in deeper shit:
3 articles from today:
1) Iran tops agenda of Rice’s meeting with Blair
2)Rice enlists support for Syria, Iran showdowns
Saul Hudson Reuters October 16, 2005
U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice mobilized support among major powers for diplomatic showdowns over the next few weeks with Syria and Iran on a trip that ended on Sunday. Over three days, Rice held talks with the leaders of France, Russia and Britain — all holders of vetoes at the U.N. Security Council – on how to make the two U.S. foes meet U.N. security demands. …
3)U.S. warns Iran over Iraq bomb attacks, Rice says
Reuters October 16, 2005
The United States has issued a stern warning to Iran over the Islamic republic’s possible involvement in helping insurgent bomb attacks in Iraq, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said on Sunday. Washington has backed accusations from its closest ally Britain that there is evidence insurgents laying roadside bombs, or improvised explosive devices (IEDs), in southern Iraq might be using sophisticated technology linked to neighbouring Iran

link

Posted by: jj | Oct 19 2005 2:41 utc | 26

slothrop – good to see you posting again, as well

Posted by: b real | Oct 19 2005 2:54 utc | 27

thanks breal
If y’all haven’t read Anatol Lieven America Right or Wrong–do so. quick read and annoying in places as he defends his realism against ‘leftist’ critiques (he says Reagan was no ‘war monger’ for ex.), yet the book compelled me to confront my own instinctive devotion to ‘democracy’ urged along as it is by my persistently implicit, and embarassing, allegiance to the credal fantasies of american exceptionalism.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 19 2005 3:06 utc | 28

@ slothrop
… ‘liberals’ extol the sanctity of our dear old CIA.
‘Some” liberals slothrop, just as they banded with the FBI, Catholics and Elites, Ex-communist’s in the twenties and thirties, to attack the American communist movement, afterall, it was the democratic party that brought us MacCarthyism. Why are you surprised by this? This is a major part of why I do not label my self as a democrat or liberal or libertarian nor progrssive. Fuck labels, until humans learn ‘general semantics’ and ‘precise speech’, labels are useless. And can and will be manipulated.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 3:08 utc | 29

welcome back too slothrop – tho it’s quite dark – it will get darker

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 19 2005 3:08 utc | 30

Wayne Madsen blog says,
October 18, 2005 — In a rare public announcement by the spokesman for CIA leak special prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald, Randall Samborn said that if and when there are any announcements in the case, they will be made from Washington, not Chicago where Fitzgerald serves as U.S. Attorney for Northern Illinois. Samborn is the Public Information Officer for the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Chicago. Fitzgerald has been detailed to Washington during his two and a half year investigation of the CIA leak matter. There is speculation that the announcements of indictments will come on Wednesday, October 19. The Grand Jury will be seated on Wednesday and its mandate is due to expire on October 28 unless it is extended, which a number of informed observers doubt will occur.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 3:16 utc | 31

scam
As the blogosphere slowly congeals into a status quo, you’ll notice how few (no one, I can recall) ‘left’ blogs have condemned the justifications of the sort of laws possibly used to attack the admin. These laws protect secrecy, afaik. These laws have been instrumental in pursuit of clandestine murder and covert war whose enumerations are obvious to most MoA readers.
I’m continuously interested in the mass obfuscation on the ostensible ‘left’ of this fact.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 19 2005 3:19 utc | 32

UPDATE from NYT: Not surprising, but disappointing. So much has happened in last week…: No Announcements expected this wk. from Fitzy – he’s wrestling w/his decisions… link

Posted by: jj | Oct 19 2005 3:32 utc | 33

@jj
And you trust this NYT’s outfit?

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 4:07 utc | 34

for something restricted like this, I’d say probabilities are weighted on their side….or I’d trust them to continue faithfully supporting the elite agenda, as JMiller did w/such fervor…perhaps a bit too much. Insofar as there’s blame there, I’d fire Bill Keller pronto; and I seriously doubt that the new Sulzie has a fraction the capability of the last generation. It seems as without leadership & vision as the rest of our institutions being taken over w/such ruthless determination by the Christo-fascists & their allies du jour.

Posted by: jj | Oct 19 2005 4:17 utc | 35

@R-Giap-
I don’t buy the talk of there having been a “coup” in Gov’t. After all, Bush is the son of a President, Cheney and Rumsfeld were well known qualities, as was Powell, and Rice is the protege of Geo. Shultz, past Sec. of State. Rather, I would say, the current gang represents the most radical statist wing of elite consensus, believing in a public display of hard power, while the Clinton gang believe more in using soft power. Still, the aims are exactly the same.
Yow could argue that Bush is being punished for blowing the Iraq opportunity, or at least making it more difficult. Nevertheless, I don’t see any change in our foreign policy stemming from Fitzgerald’s indictments. We have already entered the “China Shop”, broken all the China, kidnapped the owner, and are running the shop; we can’t leave while there is still money to be made.
Domestically, with the appointments of Roberts and Miers, Bush has shown his true colors–namely, that of the business party: He has sold out the movement conservatives, proving that all his “born again” rigamarole is just of bunch of horsefeathers. So maybe they are cleaning house to try to fix the Iraq policy. Domestically, the elite have accomplished everything they need to, with this week’s concessions by GM and Delphi labor contingents, effectively destroying the blue collar middle class for good in this country. Now they need a “good cop” Dem in to consolidate the gains for a spell, to stave off revolution.
As far as the spooks, that was a fine game to play in the 1950’s, but now the future of humanity is at stake–either they quit playing and get serious about saving the planet, or they are ignorant, or they have a scheme to kill off 3/4 of humanity. Choose your medicine.
Regardless, on a personal vendetta level, everything said here and elsewhere applies. I can’t think of better or more diverting entertainment. And this is only Act I, Scene II!

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 19 2005 5:35 utc | 36

@slothrop
Of that we can agree, for just as Keith Olbermann fakes his ‘moment on the road to Damascus’. His kind are as bad. Either a useful idiot or agent provocateur or both.
Why the reference to Walmart? To neuter the report, that’s why. PROP-AGENDA. This is a serious matter and should be taken seriously. These fake terror alerts, by definition, ARE terrorism. Why not point that out? Because the propagEnda would not have the desired effect. This is fake dissidence. The Meta-Mediocracy, Kabuki Journalism. Lest we heed Saint Exupery, when he talked of the “torture of hope”.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 5:39 utc | 37

Bush is the son of a President
before he was the son of a president he was the son of the director of the cia

Posted by: annie | Oct 19 2005 5:51 utc | 38

No indictments this week. Which according the previous analysis here, means that they are lined two-deep at the bar for last call. Also, Fitz has to time announcement with Saddam trial, terrorist threat, etc., spectacle machine for traction. Although, if he comes out with 22 indictments he will get media traction even if it snows in July.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 19 2005 6:00 utc | 39

Actually, I don’t think Bush did sell out the Christian right. He has been signaling her opposition to Roe v Wade and they are coming around to supporting this nomination. The people he sold out were the diehard right wing intelligencia who wanted someone they consider an intellectual heavyweight who will uphold right wing positions all the way down the line – a Bork. All they got with Harriet was what they wanted with Roe v Wade, not nearly enough for them. For the Christians, right wing positions on Roe v Wade, God v Athiests and Jesus v Faggots will be enough.

Posted by: lonesomeG | Oct 19 2005 6:08 utc | 40

Elite scandals are hard to understand. What was really going on with Clinton’s impeachment? Profits were good; Were they angry about his not having enough wars?
And what was really up with Watergate? Two minor break-ins. When the public evidence is lacking, the story line is always, “The coverup is worse than the crime.”
But with this regime, we have what, 42 fired, dozens dead or missing. How is that not 100 times worse than the original Watergate?
So, we must look deeper to understand the elite buy-in and motivation in a scandle.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 19 2005 6:09 utc | 41

As the blogosphere slowly congeals into a status quo, you’ll notice how few (no one, I can recall) ‘left’ blogs have condemned the justifications of the sort of laws possibly used to attack the admin. These laws protect secrecy, afaik. These laws have been instrumental in pursuit of clandestine murder and covert war whose enumerations are obvious to most MoA readers.
I’m continuously interested in the mass obfuscation on the ostensible ‘left’ of this fact.

Right on both angles, $cam. Left blogistan is indeed erecting their own ivory tower and establishing a pecking order to insulate themselves from the pesky B-list they refer to as “the lesser known blogs” — lesser known because they want to make sure they remain lesser known. In due time, A-list left blogistan will become exactly what they hate — a direct carbon copy of the complicit “holier-than-thou” MSM and it is only with those “lesser known blogs” that one can find people with the testicular fortitude to slam and blast that “Manifest Destiny / American Exceptionalism” as the steaming pile of Roman Empire-esque bullshit it is.

Posted by: Sizemore | Oct 19 2005 6:42 utc | 42

@ Sizemore
Quite right. As I’ve said before the best thing Judy Miller ever did was outing a spy, albeit a spy who was doing work that could, presumably, have been done in the
open. I don’t see why anti-proliferation work should be secret rather than merely “low profile”, except perhaps because it so blatantly conflicts with the U.S. intent to maintain its nuclear weapon stockpile.
The CIA should be abolished (privatize the analysts
and send the “wet job” boys into golden retirement). The same goes for about 95% of the bloated security establishment whose methods and institutional goals are at odds with the functioning of a liberal democracy and free republic. This is, I know, considered to be sheer irresponsible fantasy but someone should be saying it.
By the way, do you have any suggestions for the new
“lesser known blogs”?

Posted by: Hannah K. O’Luthon | Oct 19 2005 6:58 utc | 43

@Malooga
What was really going on with Clinton’s impeachment? Profits were good; Were they angry about his not having enough wars?
You may find a answer to that in the the documentary entitled: The Hunting of the President : the ten-year campaign by conservatives and Republicans to destroy Bill Clinton. In paticular, in the extra features where, slick willie talks about the film.
Notice, I did not say the but, a. answer.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 7:46 utc | 44

@lonesomeG
I don’t think you’re cynical enough there. Miers was selected precisely because she won’t overturn Roe v Wade. There’s no conspiracy just realpolitik.
I don’t see how the elites could possibly benefit by allowing poor people to breed more. They’ve got too many in the US now, especially ones with citizenship.
Plus of course if the working class and what’s left of the middle class conservatives have their needs met they will only want something else. Heaven forfend higher pay. I mean how many times can you drag out that verse about a worker being content with their wages.
I don’t think anyone has to worry about Harriet, BushCo will say they got conned in the same way as Ike did I’m not familiar with this rightist trash I’ve linked to but they wear tinfoil hats and seem to think that there has been a conspiracy to keep the court that gave Bush Florida “Liberal”.
Interestingly enough they may have a point on abortion, but only because of the old divide and rule thing.
Imagine if all the people in the US that weren’t billionaires were on the same side.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Oct 19 2005 8:53 utc | 45

Fitz-Bang!
Michael Ledeen/AIPAC
No wonder my source tells me that “Fitzgerald asked the Italians if he could share the report with Paul McNulty,” the prosecutor in the AIPAC case. There are plenty of links between the two investigations: they are, in a sense, the same investigation, since many of the same people are involved. McNulty is delving into a single aspect of the cabal’s activities, while Fitzgerald seems to have broadened his probe to include not only the outing of Plame, but also the origin of the Niger uranium forgeries and other instances of classified information leakage via the vice president’s office.
Iran-Contra Redux.
Get the pop corn ready!

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 19 2005 11:43 utc | 46

“McNulty is delving into a single aspect of the cabal’s activities”
McNulty appears to be in the tank. He’s a GOP patronage type, he also wrote some of the more extreme legal briefs in the Padilla case, arguing that the president has the right to throw anybody he wants in jail for as long as he wants.
The Jewish Telegraphic Agency reports that McNulty people’s have already hinted to Rosen’s and Weissman’s lawyers that they’ll drop the charges if the AIPAC Duo ask the court for access to their wiretapped conversations. As far as I can tell, this is all a Kabuki play. It looks like Larry Franklin is the only one who’s going to do any real time.

Posted by: Billmon | Oct 19 2005 15:43 utc | 47

billmon, if you are reading this ,the bush whacked rove on cia link on your new post is dated oct 19 2003.

Posted by: annie | Oct 19 2005 16:31 utc | 48

Debs, you could be right but I’m not sold yet. Bush doesn’t do nuance. The Christian right needs a reason to stay loyal and they want this victory bad. Tossing them this bone costs the elites nothing; there will always be plenty of poor people to exploit.
My reason for seeing it this way is that the Christian community leaders (Dobson, Robertson, etc.) support Meirs because they trust Bush and he has made quite an effort to reassure them on Meirs. They have been loyal to Bush and he has rewarded them with federal money – done by executive order and without requiring accountability – for their faith based nonsense and by appointing graduates of many of their movement colleges and institutions into govt. Many of the southern elites are also part of the Christian right and feel strongly about this issue. I think Bush and the Christian right believe Meirs is a vote to overturn Roe v Wade. They could be disappointed in the future, but I don’t see a con here. It is the right wing beltway intellectuals that are pissed, and Bush is not one of them.

Posted by: lonesomeG | Oct 19 2005 17:40 utc | 49

Second Cheney aide cooperating in leak probe

Now, those close to the investigation say that a second Cheney aide, David Wurmser, has agreed to provide the prosecution with evidence that the leak was a coordinated effort by Cheney’s office to discredit the agent’s husband. Her husband, former ambassador Joseph Wilson, was one of the most vocal critics of the Iraq war.

Posted by: annie | Oct 19 2005 20:21 utc | 50

lonesomeG
We won’t know until its too late but I think the true motivation behind all this faith based stuff has been revealed in Abrahamoff mess which tells us that these organisations are headed up by people who put material gain well ahead of any ‘values’ they may claim.
If Harriet plays her cards right she will be able to protect his ‘coolness’ even if she does recuse herself.
I imagine like most courts the justices do a bit of favour trading and supporting sides in arguments they have no predetermined position on.
If Roe v Wade were overturned there would be a massive backlash from parts of the community that haven’t troubled themselves with the ideology ie middle of the road women and as I said above it would remove the need for strongest force unifying these god botherers. They may take on gambling. gambling in the military is a major problem which effects the families of the repugs support base.
I suspect Bush doesn’t know what he believes but it seems to me that when it comes down to a choice between the corporates and the xtians, the corporates get the nod.
Bush will be protrayed by the same bible bashers telling the world that Harriet is one of god’s children, as a victim of those foul, cunning as a shithouse rat, liberals.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Oct 19 2005 20:29 utc | 51

Eisenhower had Kate who FDR personally signed a waiver to allow a Britain wear a US uniform and live with Ike in his bunker. Bush I had Jennifer Fitzgerald that the whole beltway knew about and Time magazine acknowledge they did not think it relevant to the 92 campaign.
Kennedy was one of the elites but he was promiscuously low class in that area; also he might really have wanted to gut the CIA. Clinton was regarded as real trailer trash the night of the 96 election Brinkley made some readlly off color remarks that were simply class disparaging not knowing his mike was on.
Clinton and Carter represent merit achievement, as did Ross Perot (who was called crazy for saying the Bushes threatened his family),the elites are now into destroying the merit system; like they do not want uppity blackes–they do not want uppity crackers and to the belt way Clinton and Carter were crackers. Turf wars are about power but often the right types of power. If you have been watching Rome you or the history of the Medicis, family schisms among the elite have brought down many an empire.
Speed of everything; especially economic position like Bill Gates; works in favor of oligarchy collapse. Name one thing the Duponts, Morgans, Rockefellers, Carnagies invented, developed, or promoted that progeny was responsible in creating. Will any of Bush children or grandchildren or that of the Cheney’s or any of the neocon familes be able to maintain what their progenitors established?
I know a major lawyer tax attorney cpa who works for some of them. These kids only take down the assets may take two generations but then it is gone–only the foundations remain. These neocons do not even form these–they have no sense of public service — only public sucking.
When we are tired of Trump and Paris having all the breaks; the pendulums will turn back to merit. Until now the CIA was merit. Legacy opened the door but the ladder still had to be climbed. This is the difference between 1 and 2. The elites will not make the puppet mistake again–Reagan was a believer as well as a class act. 2 is only a cheerleader. The decision makers were not really privy to the father/son psychopathology. In the future I will wager IQ scores will be public and mpi will be looked at privately.

Posted by: been there | Oct 19 2005 23:04 utc | 52

I complained above about the lack of leftwing conmtemplation over contradictory outcomes of the plame affair. Via Cursor, Slate editor J. Weisman’s take on possible unfriendly consequences:

Anyone who cares about civil liberties, freedom of information, or even just fair play should have been skeptical about Fitzgerald’s investigation from the start. Claiming a few conservative scalps might be satisfying, but they’ll come at a cost to principles liberals hold dear: the press’s right to find out, the government’s ability to disclose, and the public’s right to know.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 19 2005 23:36 utc | 53

As I’ve said before the best thing Judy Miller ever did was outing a spy, albeit a spy who was doing work that could, presumably, have been done in the open. I don’t see why anti-proliferation work should be secret rather than merely “low profile”, except perhaps because it so blatantly conflicts with the U.S. intent to maintain its nuclear weapon stockpile.

There’s part of your answer. The other part is having anti-proliferation work even in low profile could give John Q. Public too much access to the truth and when it comes down the truth, our outsourced employees of the Corporatocracy (read: politicians) believe we the wallets-erm, I mean, we the people should be on a strict “need-to-know” basis. The more the public knows, the less there is for our “leaders” to spin.

The CIA should be abolished (privatize the analysts and send the “wet job” boys into golden retirement). The same goes for about 95% of the bloated security establishment whose methods and institutional goals are at odds with the functioning of a liberal democracy and free republic. This is, I know, considered to be sheer irresponsible fantasy but someone should be saying it.

Yeah, that’s a third rail, alright. The idea of privatized analysts is attractive as all hell but we run into another problem: how should it privatized? Another monolithic corporation hanging its ass out there on the Dow and Nasdaq? A non-profit organization? I don’t know but I get the suspicion that, either way, we’d still have the same problem we have now — politicization of our intel agencies. The CIA (aw hell, let’s add the Pentagon, too) wouldn’t be so bad if it was totally non-partisan and centrist like it’s supposed to be. Too many senile old wonks and braindead “civilians” in the kitchen.
I’ll have to get back to you on the lesser-known-blogs. I’ve got a folder of shortcuts to my favorites somewhere amongst my 6 drive letters here but, since I’m about half past pickled and a quarter towards staggerville, I can’t find … well I was going say “dick” right there but that’s not quite the human anotomy my mouse is turning up.

Posted by: Sizemore | Oct 20 2005 0:28 utc | 54

“Anyone who cares about civil liberties, freedom of information, or even just fair play should have been skeptical about Fitzgerald’s investigation from the start” cited by slothrop
as if they existed. your press is absolutely comprimised, your jurisprudence worthy of the worst late night thoughs of a schmitt, – the public drowning in their sea of shit of ignorance
there are no journalists except sy hersh
(freedom)of what(information) – it never existed except as another form of metapolitics
fair play – please – give me a break – tell that to the mexicans & every population touched by the evil of this empire – fair play indeed – any fairer & you may as well place arbeit macht frei on ellis island

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 20 2005 0:39 utc | 55

If our “jurisprudence is as nightmarish” then the consequences of the Plame Affair will redound favorably to other unindicted scoundrels who, seizing on the now widely respected values of our spy-services, will do more harm to what we still believe is “our democracy.” As you said before, rgiap, these savages have a talent for crisis-exploitation.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 20 2005 1:08 utc | 56

slothrop
that they do – that they do
but i would have nver believed that ut would have been as messy & as chaotic as it is – & i imagine that is one of the reasons the whore press do not speak – because to reveal even a shadow of what is happening – would reveal what a bordello their political & civic life have become
& i do understand your point, my friend – but in this nightmare – as in all nightmares – when you are offered (as in the cuba missile crisis) the choice between psychopaths who wanted to atom bomb cuba – & those who merely wanted to expand their profit margin – you go with the latter – to just breath – one more day
i wishe the war with the elites would only concern themselves. it does not. there is so much blood – so much blood

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 20 2005 1:16 utc | 57

There’s Arabs and then there’s Arabs. The Arabic alphabet does not contain the letter “P”, but it does contain “B” and “F”. As stated before, most Arabs, when transliterating a Western word, will substitute B for P, but the Arabic word for Palestine is Filistin (think Philistine).
Frankly, I don’t think Miller’s source was Arabic. I do wonder if she is into puns, and if she transformed Plame into Flame because some people were about to get flamed. Not that she would remember that little joke before Fitzgerald.

Posted by: Chris Vail | Oct 20 2005 1:19 utc | 58

from madsens site ;
“October 19, 2005 — As of 3:45 pm, there was still no word on indictments coming out of the Grand Jury on Leakgate. But WMR can report the following: At approximately 4:45 pm, a motorcase consisting of a limousine, an SUV with well-armed security personnel, and a Washington, DC police car pulled into the annex of the E. Barrett Prettyman U.S. Courthouse on the 3rd Streetside of the courthouse complex on Constitution Avenue in Washington, DC. The occupants of the motorcade spent approximately 40 minutes inside the courthouse. There is speculation that the motorcade was that of Attorney General Alberto Gonzales. Sources familiar with the operations of special prosecutors are of the opinion that given the makeup of the motorcade, the time spent by the party in the courthouse, and the moving of the Grand Jury today to new quarters, the Grand Jury and Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald have concluded their deliberations and, as both a formality and a courtesy, Gonzales was invited to the courtroom to hear the indictments, have an opportunity to question the jurors, and be the first to convey the outcome of the secret proceedings to the White House.
Although the Grand Jury has been meeting in the older Grand Jury room in the U.S. Courthouse, today it moved to a new Grand Jury room in the new courthouse annex.”
?????

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 20 2005 1:37 utc | 59

Let’s just say the political inertia of the scandal, undelayed even by real eager for justice, will be recorded in due time as a simple parable for what happens when the political class has failed to exclude any and all competition for “intelligence.” Let’s not kid ourselves the fallout in all this will be 10 percent schadenfreude and 90 percent justification for the expansion of executive power.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 20 2005 1:55 utc | 60

eagerness

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 20 2005 1:56 utc | 61

Unfortunately, I very much agree slothrop.
as Blake said, “One law for the Lion and different one for the Ox is Tyranny.”
Welcome to xUSA.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 20 2005 2:05 utc | 62

slothrop
yes perhaps i’m a little hysteric with this melodrama

Posted by: remembereringgiap | Oct 20 2005 2:06 utc | 63

Put another way:

When a system of power is thoroughly in command, it has scarcely need to speak itself aloud; when its workings are exposed and questioned, it becomes not only subject to discussion, but even to change.
-Kate Millett, Sexual Politics 87 (1971)

The Plame Affair a bit of a bump in the road, but the fallout will be a broadly “bipartisan” legitimation to make future “command” more efficacious for control, “democracy” less “untidy” for elites.

Posted by: slothrop | Oct 20 2005 2:14 utc | 64

@slothrop
Your quote belies your conclusion. Consolidation of power is a possibility, not a given. Regardless, the amount of US corporate class control over world power is demonstrably falling, so a greater percentage of a smaller amount may still be a smaller total, even if we USAans have to suffer the consequences.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 20 2005 3:16 utc | 65

re R’Giap’s post from Wayne Madsen –
I assume they figure appearance was by Gonzo rather than Cheney since it was so short. I’m not sure so much it was about courtesy & formality, rather there’s an urgent question of not blindsiding the elite w/Indictment of sitting VP…is “pres.” an unindicted co-conspirator…Planning to be done…shrubby’s medication has to be adjusted…does new vp have to be selected…rationales have to be concoted…speeches written…

Posted by: jj | Oct 20 2005 3:42 utc | 66

I wonder just who IS adjusting the Soma? That would make a great tell-all book down the road.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 20 2005 3:48 utc | 67

from uncle $ link on the other thread, little big man:
“Those who are truly alive are kindly and unsuspecting in their human relationships and consequently endangered under present conditions. They assume that others think and act generously, kindly, and helpfully, in accordance with the laws of life. This natural attitude, fundamental to healthy children as well as to primitive man, inevitably represents a great danger in the struggle for a rational way of life as long as the emotional plague subsists, because the plague-ridden impute their own manner of thinking and acting to their fellow men. A kindly man believes that all men are kindly, while one infected with the plague believes that all men lie and cheat and are hungry for power. In such a situation the living are at an obvious disadvantage. When they give to the plague-ridden, they are sucked dry, then ridiculed or betrayed.”
……………..
just to note that some of the above(commentary) is consistant with “the plague ridden”. lets not rain on the parade quite yet.

Posted by: anna missed | Oct 20 2005 3:51 utc | 68

Great quote.
Give us a link anna missed.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 20 2005 3:53 utc | 69

Shoulda done that, little big man

Posted by: anna missed | Oct 20 2005 4:06 utc | 70

I wonder if Reich actually drew though illustrations–they are great!

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 20 2005 4:37 utc | 71

Wilhelm Reich in Hell is one hell of a read…though out of print, it can be found cheaper than this
Inspired by the U.S. government’s imprisonment of the great psychiatrist Dr. Wilhelm Reich and the seizure and burning of his scientific books and papers.
“No President, Academy, Court of Law, Congress, or Senate on this earth has the knowledge or power to decide what will be the knowledge of tomorrow.”
“Erudite, witty and genuinely scary.”
— Publishers Weekly

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 20 2005 4:47 utc | 72

Some quotes from the must read article “Chickens Come Home to Roost on Cheney” by Ray McGovern of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity on Larry Johnson’s blog, No Quarter.
The investigation has long since morphed into size “extra-large,” which is the only size commensurate with the wrongdoing uncovered—not least, the fabrication and peddling of intelligence to “justify” a war of aggression.
The coming months are likely to see senior Bush administration officials frog marched out of the White House to be booked, unless the president moves swiftly to fire Fitzgerald—a distinct possibility….
(Sad to say, the White House approach has worked. There are perhaps a hundred of my former C.I.A. colleagues who know about the lies; none—not one—has been able to summon the courage to go public.)…
Fire the Special Prosecutor? Shades of Watergate
When the Watergate scandal reached a similar stage in October 1973, President Richard Nixon, ordered Attorney General Elliot Richardson to fire the intrepid special prosecutor Archibald Cox. Richardson resigned rather than carry out Nixon’s order; and so did his deputy William Ruckleshaus. So Nixon had to reach farther down into the Justice department where he found Robert Bork, who promptly dismissed Cox in the so-called Saturday Night Massacre.
Fitzgerald is at least as vulnerable as Cox was. Indeed, in recent days some of the fourth estate, Richard Cohen in the Washington Post and John Tierney in The New York Times, for example, seem to have accepted assignments to help lay the groundwork for Fitzgerald’s dismissal.
Will the White House decide to fire special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald, and simply absorb the PR black eye, as Nixon did? There is absolutely nothing to prevent it. Can you imagine Attorney General Alberto Gonzales refusing on principle an order from President Bush?
Could Bush himself be named an un-indicted co-conspirator? If that or something like it happens, we can expect a circling of the wagons and Fitzgerald cashiered.
If the case Fitzgerald has built, however, is not strong enough to implicate Bush personally, it seems likely that the president will acquiesce in wholesale frog marching of others from the White House and then go off for a Thanksgiving vacation in Crawford—opps, more likely, Camp David. For Cindy Sheehan is planning Thanksgiving in Crawford: she still hopes to see the president so that he can explain to her personally what the “noble cause” was for which her son died.
It promises to be an interesting autumn. By all means stay tuned.

Posted by: Malooga | Oct 20 2005 4:58 utc | 73

Threads so twisted now. Don’t know whether to use this or Li’l Piggies for this update on the Soros & the CIA vs. the NeoNuts Circus. Goddamnit to hell, they’re not going to dump shrubby.
Anyway, here’s a must read art – NEW & IMPT. INFO.
We are told that eight indictments have already prepared, with the possibility of another tenThese indictments include senior white house staff, most notably Vice President Cheney’s Chief of Staff Scooter Libby, Fred Flights (special assistant to John Bolton), and–very surprisingly–national security adviser Steve Hadley. apparently, Libby and Hadley have both been told by their lawyers to expect indictments. the indictment of senior bush political advisor Karl Rove seems highly probable.
Most critically, a plea bargain process has evidently been opened with Vice President Cheney’s lawyer. that does not mean that an indictment is coming. but i’ve some critical background around the issue.

Powell played pivotal role in giving Fitzy info. to sink Cheney. He seems to have protected Shrubby. And as I’ve said from day one, McCain would prob. step in for Cheney.
Lead prosecutor patrick Fitzgerald has apparently been looking at the precedent of formerly indicted Nixon vice president Spiro Agnew. this shows the likely path, because addressing executive immunity and privilege questions would necessarily begin start with a plea-bargain deal that would entail a resignation.
This is all likely to occur within the next week.

One interesting point though–it is worth noting that a parade of senior republican senators have evidently been privately pushing McCain to lobby to be Cheney’s replacement.

But Do Read

Posted by: jj | Oct 20 2005 5:28 utc | 74

Just read comments to above post. Someone pointed out that VP didn’t go to Africa & Pres. & VP don’t travel on same plane together, so that bit is fallacious. The rest sounds very plausible.

Posted by: jj | Oct 20 2005 5:36 utc | 75

Threads so twisted now. Don’t know whether to use this or Li’l Piggies for this update…
That’s prolly my fault, sorry. I think in wholistic views not newtons single vison mech.
great post jj, thanks. Not surprising.

Posted by: Anonymous | Oct 20 2005 5:40 utc | 76

Threads so twisted now. Don’t know whether to use this or Li’l Piggies for this update…
That’s prolly my fault, sorry. I think in wholistic views not newtons single vison mech.
great post jj, thanks. Not surprising.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | Oct 20 2005 5:40 utc | 77

FITZGERALDS WEB SITE

Posted by: annie | Oct 21 2005 18:27 utc | 78

On Dean’s National Security argument, please remember that Fitzgerald got in the case by a referral by the CIA (National Security) to the Justice Department. At best the Administration has clashing national security interests in this matter.

Posted by: tagore | Oct 24 2005 3:03 utc | 79

On Dean’s National Security argument, please remember that Fitzgerald got in the case by a referral by the CIA (National Security) to the Justice Department. At best the Administration has clashing national security interests in this matter.

Posted by: tagore | Oct 24 2005 3:03 utc | 80