Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 20, 2005
Not Roberts Thread

Anything but Roberts … open thread

Comments

London mayor knows the score.
What’s the general mood in Great Britain? Are they feeling any more Spanish these days? Or does Tony have the Diebold touch?
Ah, god, I’d love to see the propaganda machine crumble into dust. I’m in mourning for my future here in the US, don’t know if I have the wherewithal to follow Lupin’s lead and relocate to civilization.

Posted by: catlady | Jul 20 2005 19:00 utc | 1

A really interesting and moving military “blog” from Iraq: The Iraq Experience

Posted by: b | Jul 20 2005 20:23 utc | 2

@b Why do I get a mental picture of Frank Burns when reading this guy?

Posted by: DM | Jul 20 2005 22:40 utc | 3

@ catlady
I’m in mourning for my future here in the US, don’t know if I have the wherewithal to follow Lupin’s lead and relocate to civilization.
Getting to France or New Zealand or Canada is only a temporary reprieve catlady. If they aren’t stopped here do you think they will stop anywhere before McD’s & Msf’s (i.e. corporate-military-industrial amerika) totally rule the world?
Forget about abandoning ship and grab the biggest bucket you can handle. We need you here where you have the most power and can be most effective in thwarting them.
And keep the faith. I think most all the avatars recommended this.

Posted by: Juannie | Jul 21 2005 0:00 utc | 4

I guess it’s too much to expect much traffic on this thread!

Posted by: ab | Jul 21 2005 2:29 utc | 5

For all the movie/tv analogies made on blogs (LOTR, StarWars, Seinfeld, etc.), Bill’s latest Godfather analogy is by far the best. I immediately thought that one example was when Senator Boxer hit the confirmation hearings for Rice and Bolton. She did her homework and hit hard, all at once, and the MSM had to show her clip over and over and over. Time, effort and money well spent, Senator. And that is how you go to the mattresses.

Posted by: MyPOV | Jul 21 2005 4:19 utc | 6

@catlady Juannie’s correct, in the end you have to make a stand somewhere and it is much easier to do it where you are familiar with all the levers/buttons. Don’t take this as a rejection by others, it’s just I have seen a lot of people relocate from the US to Australia and NZ and there is a culture shock thing happening. I mean there’s lotsa good things but unless someone moves culture quite early in their life I reckon they spend a lot of time playing catch-up.
I grew up in New Zealand and left in my late teens, not returning for any substantial time until the mid 90’s and I found it hard to find the handles/levers again.
Living in a small country you learn a lot more about how bigger societies operate than living in a big society teaches you about how small country’s work.
One of the hardest things I found to deal with was that NZ doesn’t have a written constitution and only has one house of assembly. In some ways that can be good because it means that the people’s will can be instituted easily without a lot of complex to-ing and fro-ing. However it also means that it is easy for a government that wants to, to behave quite undemocratically. Sure the chances are they will get sorted at the next election but in the meantime they can do a great deal of harm and one can feel even more powerless than usual.
Don’t despair it may feel like the world as you know it has finished but the imperialist stage of the US looks like it’s going to be even shorter than the English empire and although it is brutal there have been worse. Post imperial cultures are actually very interesting and tend to be artistically vibrant. I have certainly noticed that parts of US culture are becoming much more interesting than ever before. I know we’re not meant to enjoy TV but I find some aspects of US commercial TV much better now than ever before. I quite literally couldn’t watch that formulaic garbage that was being fed to the lowest common denominator in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s and although there is still more than enough of that around there are also enough gems to tell me that there are people in US society with both the power and creativity to provide real insight into their culture. Definately IMHO a sign of post-imperialism.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 21 2005 4:49 utc | 7

Thanks, Juannie and Debs is dead, for responding to a few squiggly black symbols on a pale blue-grey field.
I wish I didn’t succumb to despair so often. I already moved to the Left Coast, a place that is still beautiful and where quite a few people have dropped out and tuned in and are making a stand. (and in case of dark times, we can grow food year ’round.)
I’m still mentally and emotionally in a halfway spot between Midwestern conservative (grew up in a happy home in Go Big RedRedRed Nebraska) and “citizen of the world of compassionate people.” I’ve come a long way in weaning myself from consumerism and carelessness, but there’s much to be done in the Great Work. Participating in that vibrant decadent art world is part of the plan–I’m a big fan of the 1930’s Berlin cabaret scene.
No TV for me though, D.i.d.; I gave it up 4 years ago. I visit friends’ houses for my viddy-fixes. Lots of garbage to wade through to get to the gems. It’s bad for my eyes and gives me nightmares.
Argh, it’s late. I’m rambling.

Posted by: catlady | Jul 21 2005 6:03 utc | 8

Make that Libertarian Congressman Ron Paul of Texas.

Posted by: Hannah K. O’Luthon | Jul 21 2005 6:32 utc | 10

b, visited that blog, have to disagree 100% with your assertion that it is “moving”, guy comes across as a white supremacist.

Posted by: Cloned Poster | Jul 21 2005 6:42 utc | 11

Sorry b where you see moving I see a closed minded unempathetic boor

“He sent the enemy home, leaving only a few useless and scared locals for us to interrogate”

The guy claims to be a doctor and given the shortage of fresh water and supplies throughout Iraq I feel sure he could have found something more useful to do than interogate “useless” locals. Mind you Frank Burns always frowned on Hawkeye and Trapper wasting army resources on potential commies.
I guess the part that incenses me the most is in the piece he has called “The Return Letter” where he uses cheap maudlin sentiment to justify his aiding and abetting the slaughter of innocents

Our country is defined, not by it geographical boundaries, but by a thought put to paper hundreds of years ago by some extremely intelligent men. It was the idea that all men are equal and entitled to freedoms of that equality. You have most likely been taught these phrases in your elementary school classes. But this is the true reality of those ideas.
Payton Chester Leerman, like millions of boys before him, entered a hostile environment to fight for the freedoms of those who couldn’t. There are little old ladies in black robes just outside my window. They, nor the children playing beside them have ever experienced freedom.

Only someone who has travelled outside the US without ever bothering to find out what other people think could possibly put together a statement as outrageous as that. Does the writer think that those “extremely intelligent men” (that’s right they had a woman sew up the flag but the rest was strictly man’s work) who defined the US would have felt free if a bunch of foreigners had come into the colonies chased out the Brits and said “Now c’mon fellow you’re free, get free and give me your resources, let my mob set up where ever we want but don’t get in our way cause we’ll shoot you for showing ingratitude to us for making you free”
Apart from Frank Burns this chap reminds me of the Fred McMurray character in the ‘Caine Mutiny’, the one who claimed the artistic liscense of a great writer (which he could never be) at the same time he sold out his shipmates. Our doctor in Iraq probably goes to sleep at night wondering how he can turn his facile mutterings into a ‘treatment’ that Jerry Bruckheimer would pay a hefty advance for.
I am interested in the thoughts of those party to the current slaughter in Iraq, but I’m sorry this fellow sounds as though if he ever experienced a genuine emotion, as opposed to some ersatz piece of jingoistic nonsense, he would push that emotion back down into the deep dark corner where he imagines it belongs.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 21 2005 9:48 utc | 12

I hate to sound like some sort of priggish holy roller, a shill for evangelism disguised as aid, or the dreadful Geldorf today; but I reckon if the people coming into here check out Today’s CNN story on Niger they can be upset that it doesn’t mention Rove and co if they like but they can also probably help reduce this suffering if they have an Aid agency that they know and trust. Everyone has been quoting this 3.6 million people figure for months now so it rolls across the consciousness without really carrying any associated tendrils of misery, but it’s just a number which is best ignored. Instead concentrate on the increased urgency in this story from one of the sleazier outlets and understand that by all accounts this situation has reached crisis. We all have our favorite theories about the best way to deal with these awful situations so if there is a method of providing assitance that you believe works, now is the time to support it.
Maybe this foulness has finally surfaced in the public eye now that it is too late to help a lot of these people but if it hasn’t lets all try and point out this the next time someone frames Niger in terms of Rove and uranium. It is no co-incidence that the most stable and peaceful countries in the developing world are the ones that have the least resources. Was it Kesey or Heller that wrote about the native americans whose lives got wrecked everytime something got found under the land that the US govt last shunted them to?

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 21 2005 10:16 utc | 13

@ catlady and everyone else,
I spent this past weekend at an Abenaki ceremonial site in north eastern VT. The occasion was an initiation ceremony for seven young (16 to 23) ladies (one, my 20 year old daughter) who had completed a year long process of preparation and hard work. They and their Godmothers had arrived earlier in the week to build their ceremonial lodge and other preparatory work. They had fasted from solid food for several days before we got there to honor and witness and participate in the final 48 hours of their ordeal.
After we arrived their process moved into fasting from water and sleep deprivation for the last 24 hours. Each member of our community participated in their last water ceremony and individually shared water with each girl in turn. Later that afternoon the young initiates emerged from their lodge in the forest and were greeted by our approximately 200 friends and relatives where they ran the sun down. Their stamina and fortitude from a years preparatory work shown brightly and we cheered and shouted our support until the sun had set.
That night we gathered across the river from the woods where they remained awake to pray and offer blessings to the Great Spirit. Our part was to sing and chant for most of the night to offer our encouragement and reaffirmation of our support and love through their dark night of the soul. Before sunup we gathered again in the field and awaited their emergence to run the sun up as they had run it down the night before. The spirited and heart felt shouting and cheering again urged these beautiful beings to reach deep within for the strength and determination for this next step in their journey. Later that afternoon the community entered the girl’s lodge, one at a time to individually receive their personal blessing, again each in turn. Their was nary a dry eye nor unfilled heart. Their blessings came from a source seldom experienced in a human lifetime. It was as if their ego’s had dissolved and only spirit flowed through them on their words of blessing. Later after all the community had received their blessings we gathered by the river to ceremonially pull them back to us from their journey into the depths of the soul and then gathered to share their first water and welcome them back to us and our community. This was eventually followed by their first food and later a gathering to honor them and for the parents and Godparents to receive hand made gifts from them that they had worked on for months. My daughter presented me with a beautiful shawl that she had woven from wool that she had hand spun while telling her life story to the wool.
This group of young people were the fifth group to have navigated this process over the past five years alternating from young ladies to young men each successive year. There were two girls from England and one from Minnesota that had prepared in their own communities and came here to participate in this final initiation. Every single initiate from the prior five years was there this year.
I felt inclined to share this occasion with this MoA community because I and most all others that shared this event felt that there is indeed hope for the future and the flowers. Most of us grew up with little or no thoughtful initiation into adulthood and our culture is sorely deficient and perverted from that lack. But the good news is that this important process for young people is again finding it’s way into our lives. I used to think maybe I could make a small difference in this battle for righteousness. But I realized this past weekend that it will be these young people who have gleaned a power and strength that I missed. They are the ones who will be leading the way back from the depths of darkness that has descended on our country, our world. Not that I can step back into acquiescence or apathy but that my job is mainly to be a source of support for these new more enlightened members of culture and community.

Posted by: Juannie | Jul 21 2005 11:35 utc | 14

The end is near? Or am I the only one to expect with interest the outcome of “China unpegging the yuan from the allmighty$”? Of course, the new “currency basket” wouldn’t include the Euro, would it 😉

Posted by: CluelessJoe | Jul 21 2005 12:17 utc | 15

juannie, wow, it gives me great hope that these initiation ceremonies are still being practiced on turtle island

Posted by: annie | Jul 21 2005 15:32 utc | 16

@b
Cpt Greens ‘Blog’ struck me as niether interesting or moving.
Anger, contempt and yes, pity, meant abandoning further reading of his vacuous posts. They being bereft of sincere compassion or the most basic insights given his station. A sad, little man, and by his own choosing …
It is a small tragedy that such a self-absorbed egoist has responsibility for the lives and well-being of troopers and Iraqis.

Posted by: Outraged | Jul 21 2005 16:30 utc | 17

@catlady et al
The geopolitical and domestic situations evolving as they are … things may well deteriorate for some time … before they get better … Inner strength, hope and faith.

Posted by: Outraged | Jul 21 2005 16:39 utc | 18

@CP, Debts, Outrage – uch – wrong descriptor and wrong word.
Checked and its “revealing” what I was thinking of, not “moving”.
Sorry, it’s still a foreign language and sometimes the words are not what I think they are (I thought of “den Vorhang zurückziehen” – “moving the curtain” in German).

Posted by: b | Jul 21 2005 16:55 utc | 19

Time to make a prediction:
If the Repubs can win 2006 and 2008, we will see them start restricting gun rights, but keep NRA support. They’ll call it homeland defense.

Posted by: citizen | Jul 21 2005 17:19 utc | 20