So who did get away?
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June 29, 2005
Open Barndoor
So who did get away?
Comments
Revolution, geopolitics and pipelines
So where is he ? Posted by: DM | Jun 29 2005 12:50 utc | 3 Both the WSJ and the WaPo carried stories yesterday on the DSM Posted by: John | Jun 29 2005 13:06 utc | 4 Perhaps I should move the following request towards Outraged into this thread, with the original one soon receding from sight. Jeesus H, John, words mean whatever anybody wants them to mean, and whatever is legal, or sovereign, or whatever the hell, is a matter of power, which, as you know, stems from the barrel of a gun. Memo? Minutes? We know they are liars, but they will get away with it for as long as it suits the Fourth Estate. I doubt that any nuanced differences between a memo and a minute is going to make a big impact on New York Times or Washington Post readers. Posted by: DM | Jun 29 2005 13:59 utc | 7 Well, Bernhard, nursing his pimple undoubtedly, has missed the real story of last night and this morning: Posted by: FlashHarry | Jun 29 2005 15:29 utc | 9 @FlashHarry Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 15:51 utc | 11 Well, it’ll be funny if China buys Unocal. All these glorious plans of world domination are soon gonna come crashing down, and it won’t be pretty. Posted by: Clueless Joe | Jun 29 2005 15:53 utc | 12 outraged Posted by: slothrop | Jun 29 2005 16:05 utc | 13 outraged Posted by: slothrop | Jun 29 2005 16:12 utc | 14 DM, you’re correct. Next the Pentagon will distribute more “food aid” BSE-tainted beef to the Iraqis, and more smallpox-infested blankets, exactly what the Custer-era colonialists did to the American Indians. Posted by: tante aime | Jun 29 2005 16:17 utc | 15 @Slothrop Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 16:24 utc | 16 Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari, who met with Bush last week, was quoted as saying in Wednesday’s edition of the London-based Arab newspaper Asharq al-Awsat that he discussed the issue of troop withdrawal with the U.S. president:
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 16:30 utc | 17 Outraged: Ok, if Afghanistan’79-’89 was the Soviet Unions ‘Vietnam’, then comparitively Iraq is America’s ‘Soviet Afghanistan’ equivalent. Those are good questions outraged. I’m left with the neocons’ only option being to stay the course and avoid the shame of failure. Posted by: rapt | Jun 29 2005 16:56 utc | 20 Further Lupinian reflections on Da Speech: Posted by: Lupin | Jun 29 2005 17:03 utc | 21 Of course the end game will be a catastrophe, which is why people like Rove are already starting to blame the “liberals.” Posted by: Brian Boru | Jun 29 2005 17:13 utc | 22 They done gone a couple of bridges too far and there is no way out but failure. Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 17:21 utc | 23 Well, Kerry and co could call for withdrawal. How would that play in the media? If you pretend for a moment that there is some chance of getting a slightly normal government in place in the US next year then they need to avoid giving the republicans a chance to paint them as calling or defeat. The Democrats aren’t much better than the Republicans, but they don’t appear to be quite as batshit crazy as the current admin. @Outrage – In the meantime there’s Venezuela and North Korea to consider while this lot is busy breaking the Army and Marines whilst contributing to the ruin of the US economy.
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 18:09 utc | 27 @b Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 18:24 utc | 28 @Outraged – oil is sold on markets. If oil gets scarce or demands increases above supply the price goes up. If Venezuela sells to China, China will not have to buy elsewhere and the US can buy that chunk. As long as markets work its free for all. I think Colman is right about the Dems, and while I dont agree with the tactic, it does force Bush deeper into the corner by seeming to be more aggressive (allbeit rhetorically). For the reasons stated, Bush can’t escalate troop #s without a draft (political suicide) and he can’t get tougher on the ground without inflaming the resistance, I think they call this leaving him to “twist in the wind” with the descisions as already made and now locked into. Posted by: anna missed | Jun 29 2005 19:06 utc | 31
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 29 2005 19:11 utc | 32 @Anna Missed: Posted by: FlashHarry | Jun 29 2005 19:32 utc | 33 DM@9:59am Posted by: John | Jun 29 2005 21:02 utc | 34 Conspiracy JUST FOR THE HELL OF IT. Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jun 29 2005 22:44 utc | 35 “The problem with the US elite is that they don´t believe in markets and therefore think they have to have direct control of the goods. The Sowjets tried that too – it didn´t work.” Posted by: sm | Jun 29 2005 23:01 utc | 36
This statement implies that armies from democracies may not be as effective as armies from other states, as though faith, stubborness, individualism and patience is stronger in armies from non-democracies. I think it is much simpler than that. An army that knows why it is fighting and believes in that cause is far more motivated to fight than one that does not. The Iraqis are fighting against US domination and for their way of life. Most American soldiers don’t feel a real connection to their way of life back home and their mission in Iraq. For Iraqi fighters, it is personal and connected to a larger purpose; for Americans it is much harder to feel personal connection to the slogans offered as the war’s justification and, when the real motivations are understood, natural to feel bitter resentment over the way they are being used. There will always be the super patriots, but their motivations are far more abstract than personal. Posted by: lonesomeG | Jun 29 2005 23:09 utc | 37 lol…..like anyone actually listens to kerry and dems. bushco will make things worse and worse. then he’ll pass on power to the dems. when the shit hits the fan, the corpmedia will blame the dems. Posted by: lenin’s ghost | Jun 30 2005 0:12 utc | 38 A (10 second) NPR report just said there was another Redcon air Whitehouse evacuation today, I searched the internets but found nothing, anybody hear anything? Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jun 30 2005 0:50 utc | 39
Yes, they’re deadly serious — emphasis on the deadly. They know failure in Iraq is an option, and I’ve no doubt they’re willing to walk over the dead bodies of an awful lot of Iraqis to try to stave off an outright Vietnam-style defeat.
I’m not really being judgemental about this. You could argue that it was better to kill 500 Serbian civilians (roughly the death toll for the Belgrade bombing) than to allow Milosovic to repeat the Bosnian genocide in Kosovo. Not the kind of argument I would want to make, but there it is. War is hell. Posted by: billmon | Jun 30 2005 1:08 utc | 40 Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 30 2005 1:09 utc | 41 It might be a joke, but this is an approach I think could be very valuable. Posted by: Monolycus | Jun 30 2005 2:29 utc | 42 A Joke? Hope not. He could raise the money in a flash simply by putting up a website & it’d be an instant liberal & conservative shrine. Further, if they don’t ok it, why couldn’t the people in New London sue for discrimination? Obviously the sad part is that it wouldn’t devastate Souter’s life – he could magnanimously let the city have it for a song with no ill effect. Posted by: jj | Jun 30 2005 4:17 utc | 43
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 30 2005 4:30 utc | 44 Weren’t the other options using the forbidden ground troops? Posted by: razor | Jun 30 2005 4:32 utc | 45 OT: Is this the most efficient Airport security can get?
There is more… Posted by: Fran | Jun 30 2005 6:24 utc | 46 A prediction. Posted by: Lupin | Jun 30 2005 6:28 utc | 47 There have been reports that King Fahd died. Then someone said that wouldn’t be announced til the battle of succession was over. Big news from IHT is that Bandar Bush is 2nd in line to the throne – he’s the Crown Prince’s chosen successor, and the Crown Prince is in his 80’s – and he’s pulled up stakes in DC & returned to S.A. link Posted by: jj | Jun 30 2005 6:46 utc | 48 From Raed in the Middle:US War Crime in Baqouba
Posted by: Fran | Jun 30 2005 7:27 utc | 49 Reporter shot to death in Iraq
No, Wiliam, I disagree on that point. Posted by: Werner Dieter Thomas | Jun 30 2005 9:28 utc | 51
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 30 2005 10:21 utc | 52 Did anyone catch this? Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jun 30 2005 10:25 utc | 53 Juan Cole wrote Thursday, June 30, 2005
The following links explain what these systems are and how they are used by guerilla forces, especially the RPG-7 reference for the Mujahedeen in Afghanistan. It is worth noting that due to the elevated risk re MANPADS in Afghanistan, Coalition forces are now largely restricted to using Helos only at night in many locales … this may yet become the case in parts of Iraq:
Posted by: Outraged | Jun 30 2005 12:06 utc | 54 not really relevant to anything here, but this google 3D map is way cool Posted by: b real | Jun 30 2005 15:10 utc | 55 Holy Shit…Talk about a nation committing suicide… Posted by: jj | Jun 30 2005 22:01 utc | 56
Posted by: DM | Jul 1 2005 3:54 utc | 57 eva golinger points out that u.s. psyops is looking south toward venezuela:
treadwell 2001 interview quoted in the La Nacion article
here’s an article from WaPo june 11 on some broader psyops budgeting
Posted by: b real | Jul 1 2005 4:06 utc | 58
This is obscene. Compare this (and some of the other horror stories with the cost of prescription medicine to the elderly) – with the Australian PBS scheme. The US is government of the rich, for the rich .. and you keep voting them in ! Posted by: DM | Jul 1 2005 5:14 utc | 59 Riverbend on the Bush speech: Unbelievable…
There’s more… Posted by: Fran | Jul 1 2005 5:43 utc | 60
Posted by: Outraged | Jul 1 2005 14:15 utc | 61 From The Dimplomatic Times Review
and here’s a June 2005 update on how NOT to win ‘Hearts and Minds’. The bankrupt, self-defeating, doctrine of “You’re with us, or you’re our Enemy” …
Posted by: Outraged | Jul 1 2005 14:32 utc | 62 WaPo OpEd: The Stain of Torture
From B’s link to the WaPo’s OpEd piece (above): Posted by: Monolycus | Jul 1 2005 21:11 utc | 66 The invincable Taliban are taking over Afghanistan – again:
@Monolycus – It is not the “civilian leadership” that has implemented the policy of torture .. this policy was explicitly condoned by both the Pentagon and the Oval Office. Know your friends:
Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 2 2005 5:28 utc | 69 Bush administration to keep control of internet’s central computers
I hope that there really be a uproar and that an alternative will be build outside of the US. Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 2 2005 5:51 utc | 70 Ooops, that was me again. I don’t know why it doesn’t remember my name anymore. Posted by: Fran | Jul 2 2005 5:53 utc | 71 b, Posted by: citizen | Jul 2 2005 6:02 utc | 72 @b Posted by: Monolycus | Jul 2 2005 6:54 utc | 73
Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 2 2005 12:03 utc | 74 There is a story on Spanish teletext today. A rough translation Posted by: Anonymous | Jul 2 2005 15:19 utc | 76 @Fran, et al Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jul 2 2005 15:48 utc | 77 Goddamn it, the links worked in preview. Anyway, Posted by: Uncle | Jul 2 2005 16:01 utc | 78 John Dean.at FindLaw’s Legal Commentary (October 10, 2003): Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jul 3 2005 9:39 utc | 79 |
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