Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 02, 2017

Iraqi WMDs Anyone? Washington Post Makes Unfounded Claims Of Iranian Supplies To Insurgencies

The Washington Post falls back into its 2005 mode of blaming Iran for the capabilities of a local insurgency. This time it is not Iraq where Iran is allegedly providing to insurgents, but Bahrain.

Old and debunked claims are hauled up and propaganda from the U.S. proxy Sunni dictatorship is cited as "evidence". It is a top-right front-page story in the Sunday edition and thereby "important". It is also fake news.

The headline: U.S. increasingly sees Iran’s hand in the arming of Bahraini militants.The core:

The report, a copy of which was shown to The Washington Post, partly explains the growing unease among some Western intelligence officials over tiny Bahrain, a stalwart U.S. ally in the Persian Gulf and home to the Navy’s Fifth Fleet. Six years after the start of a peaceful Shiite protest movement against the country’s Sunni-led government, U.S. and European analysts now see an increasingly grave threat emerging on the margins of the uprising: heavily armed militant cells supplied and funded, officials say, by Iran.

The authors insert caveats:

While Bahraini officials frequently accuse Tehran of inciting violence, the allegations often have been discounted as exaggerations by a monarchy that routinely cites terrorism as a justification for cracking down on Shiite activists.

But after noting that Bahraini authorities notoriously lie the authors regurgitate approvingly the claims of exactly those authorities:

... the country’s investigators said in a confidential technical assessment ... a copy of which was shown to The Washington Post ...

That is supported, the authors say, by:

... interviews with current and former intelligence officials ...

Surly, "current and former intelligence officials" are paragons of truth and veracity and whatever they claim MUST be true.

At issue is the detection of one basement workshop in Bahrain where someone is using "$20,000 lathes and hydraulic presses" to produce shaped charges and also stored a pile of C4 explosives.

A $20,000 lathe is at the lower end of low-quality professional tooling. Hydraulic presses can be made from car jacks. How to make hollow charges and explosive formed penetrators (EFPs) is described in the CIA's Explosives for Sabotage Manual which the U.S. translated and distributed for decades in Afghanistan and elsewhere. C4 explosives of various origins, including from Iran, are available on black weapon markets throughout west-Asia.

Source: CIA Handbook

Nothing of the above points to the conclusion that these are "cells supplied and funded .. by Iran". The only connection to Iran the Bahrani police found and which is noted in the piece is:

One of the six caches “involved C-4 in its original Iranian military packaging,” the report said.

The piece does not note where the C4 in the other five caches came from. A detailed chemical analysis will be able to find the "signatures" of the chemical production facilities. If only one of six explosive caches comes from an Iranian manufacturer the problem Bahrain has on hand with the C4 is hardly of Iranian origin. So why are the manufacturing origins of the other five caches of explosives not mentioned at all? Did those caches come from the U.S. or from Saudi factories?

But the problems with the piece do not end there.

After noting how unreliable Bahrain official claims are, it discussed at length such Bahraini claims.

After describing the cheap equipment used to make shaped charges in Bahrain it goes on to explain how Iran, and only Iran, gives those to insurgencies. It quotes some guy from the Zionist propaganda shop Washington Institute who:

saw echoes in Bahrain of Iran’s practice of supplying tank-crushing EFPs to Iraqi Shiite militias, which used the devices in an effort to create no-go zones around Shiite strongholds.

Iran did not and does not supply EFPs to Iraqi insurgents. The Iraqis made those themselves. That was documented here and elsewhere even ten years ago:

For quite a while this story has been debunked by reports about EFP manufacturing in Iraq. These were substantiated, while the "Iran provides EFPs" meme was never proven by any evidence.

There were pieces in the Wall Street Journal, Los Angeles Times and by Reuters. Doubts about the Iran origin of EFPs have also been raised in the New York Times. NBC news had U.S. officials at least partly walking back their claims. The Columbia Journalism Review, Inter Press Service and Newshogger Cernig ran good summary stories including many sources. We also discussed the 'evidence' here.

The WaPo story, though on today's Sunday paper's frontpage, has a (web-)dateline of April 1. That is probably the only reliable claim it carries.

There is no evidence that Iran provides for a Shia insurgency in Shia majority-Sunni ruled Bahrain just as there is no evidence that it supplies Zaidi fighters in Yemen who fight Al-Qaeda and its Saudi sponsors.

But there is by now a steady stream of Saudi and U.S. propaganda that makes such claims. These claims sound awfully similar to the claims made before the war on Iraq of (non-existing) Iraqi weapons of mass destruction. To find such again on page one of the Sunday edition of a major newspaper is more than disturbing.

Posted by b on April 2, 2017 at 10:40 AM | Permalink

Comments

The presstitute is alive with reports like these this morning. . .

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-yemen-iran-houthis-idUSKBN16S22R

'Cruisin' for a bruisin'.

Moar War appears to be a chant with the western power elite.

Posted by: kgw | Apr 2, 2017 11:12:26 AM | 1

The WaPo is a major newspaper only in the sense that it is the official mouthpiece of the Washington consensus/perpetual war machine. Its veracity has long since disappeared and they will print anything that advances the cause of the Clintonite/Wall Street nexus.

Posted by: WorldBLee | Apr 2, 2017 11:42:33 AM | 2

The same claims were made about the Iraqi insurgency, that Iran supplied them with EFPs. But today, it was Syrians that supported the insurgents in Iraq, hence the need for revenge against Assad.

It is amazing how the narrative keeps shifting to suit the policy...

Posted by: Oab | Apr 2, 2017 12:08:56 PM | 3

Great, if these idiots in the western msm cant scare people with Russia they turn to Iran, I cant believe why people read this sh't everyday, these journalists are having a salary that is sometimes 5 times more than the regular american and their job is pure lies and desinformation.
Shows the propagandized western people of today..

Posted by: Anon1 | Apr 2, 2017 12:15:16 PM | 4

Why do the elite continue to sell war as a solution to our economic issues instead of their past mantra of growth? At least with the mantra of growth, infrastructure would be included.

With war, infrastructure can't be afforded.

What is interesting today is that the tools of brainwashing are both being used on steroids and being exposed as less than forthright, given their "duty". The cognitive dissonance this causes in the public mind is growing and this will force more reliance on "trusted sources" and "wars" between them. The possibility of the public benefiting from this process is slim to none, IMO...because the incentives are still centered around God of Mammon.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 2, 2017 12:22:59 PM | 5

Weapons manufacturer labels are a poor proof for anything, unless one states the date of manufacture as well as origin.

Last year BBC showed video of ISIS ammunition manufactured in Bulgaria in the EU in 2015. The Conflict Armament Research (CAR) investigators say they have seen U.S. provided munitions in ISIS hands only two months after manufacture.

An example of poor attribution is from East Aleppo. After the rebels left, the SAA found 81 mm mortar shells with an American flag on them. Pro-Syrian media touted this as proof of the U.S. arming al-Qaeda. They may be, but in a different manner. The box markings:

From USA for mutual defense
Procured in Yugoslavia by Ordnance Corps United States Army
Ammunition for cannon with explosive projectiles
R4HQA
Lot E-KRI-1-9

The mortar shells are from the World War II era. The boxes use the Ammunition Identification Code (AIC) that was abandoned in 1958. It seems that the U.S. gave them to Tito. Most likely these came from Croatian weapons dumps as part of CIA's airbridge in 2012 or 2013.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 2, 2017 12:27:05 PM | 6

Gotta love those Martini glasses. Them are now treated as the WMD?

Posted by: laserlurk | Apr 2, 2017 12:28:35 PM | 7

meanwhile, more fodder is being prepared for the cannons.

Posted by: dan of steele | Apr 2, 2017 12:29:25 PM | 8

The diagram appears to use a "Rocks Glass" instead of martini glass. That makes more sense. More volume for chards.

Posted by: Skip | Apr 2, 2017 1:20:55 PM | 9

Even if the accusation against Iran is true, so what? The real scandal in Bahrain is not the protests against the government but the tyranny of the government against its citizens. Are we allowed to discuss the sins of that government? Are the same standards applied to everyone? Are all victims equal?

Posted by: Edward | Apr 2, 2017 1:32:18 PM | 10

I read that article this morning and was left wondering where and when I was meant to adopt a sympathetic view of the government of Bahrain?

Posted by: IhaveLittleToAdd | Apr 2, 2017 1:48:46 PM | 11

Yes, yes. All those Iranian TOW missiles and Manpads. All that ammo with USA stamped on it. All those other weapons funneled through Saudi Arabia from the USA in the largest purchase ever. How clever of the Iranians.
Shame on the Iranians for looking the other way for three years while ISIS/Daesh stole Syrian oil and trucked into Turkey. Shame on them for bombing holes in the desert, pretending to fight terrorism.
It's the neocons favorite ploy; blaming someone else for their sins/crimes. If US foreign policy 'mental giants' and their minions (including but not limited to the WaPo) are accusing another nation/individual of doing something untoward, you can bet your last dollar it's precisely what they are up to. A smoke screen for their own, even worse behavior, usually timed to coincide with an upcoming wikileaks/whistleblower revelation.

Posted by: CD Waller | Apr 2, 2017 2:21:49 PM | 12

The current administration is not going to tell if there are troop deployments in order to surprise ISIS. Well, I do not know if it will surprise ISIS but I am sure it is going to surprise some next-of-kin in our country.

Posted by: Rex | Apr 2, 2017 2:28:02 PM | 13

I remember those accusations against Iran over ten years ago, then the machined copper discs found in Iraq, [according to US General's] could only have come from Iran. Not mentioning that the Iraqi's have been involved in such simple engineering for a long time in service to its oil industry. At the same time America was spending millions on way's to stop EFP's and IED's they never suceeded because the Iraqi's just used a length of string to defeat the US technological wizards.

Posted by: harrylaw | Apr 2, 2017 2:33:14 PM | 14

The US is working up courage/backing for military strikes on Iran, kicked off by Votel the other day.
I am picking missile strikes, perhaps a bombing campaign if SAM sites cam be taken out, but no attempt at invasion or occupation. To occur during Trumps presidency.

Posted by: Peter AU | Apr 2, 2017 2:49:47 PM | 15

Fear = herding the sheep

Question Authority!
>> Question 1: Where's my 'peace dividend'?

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 2, 2017 2:51:19 PM | 16

Iran was found guilty by a US court of being involved in the 9/11 attacks. There is nothing they won't pin on Iran.

Posted by: Bob | Apr 2, 2017 2:57:34 PM | 17

What about the US hand in arming the Bahrain terrorist government?

Posted by: paul | Apr 2, 2017 3:02:42 PM | 18

I can repeat what I said before - US wont attack Iran directly, they cant win, and loss would be beyond massive. The plan was "Iran spring" aka Libya 3.0 after defeat of Syria. The project got stuck, they are running out of jihadis fodder, and geopolitical situation wont allow to execute it in Iran.

In other words, other than few unilateral sanctions, demonization campaign and more weapon sales for Arab monarchies, nothing else will happen against Iran anytime soon.

Posted by: Harry | Apr 2, 2017 3:07:20 PM | 19

I'm somewhat amazed the WaPo is actually publishing this BS, given the increasing skepticism of even the US newspaper reading public. Pretty ballsy of them to showcase such obviously faked news.

WTF?

Posted by: jawbone | Apr 2, 2017 3:08:52 PM | 20

Of course, given the publishing date of April 1 it may just be an April Fool's joke, eh?

Posted by: jawbone | Apr 2, 2017 3:10:04 PM | 21

@19 Harry. Correct..

Posted by: Lozion | Apr 2, 2017 3:22:33 PM | 22

Change Bahrain to Syria, Iran to United States/Turkey/Saudi Arabia/Qatar, and you have yourself a completely different story.

Posted by: Tobin Paz | Apr 2, 2017 3:24:18 PM | 23

US Ambassador Haley: No question Russia meddled in election
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/04/02/us-ambassador-haley-no-question-russia-meddled-in-election.html

This woman is pure nuts.

Posted by: Anon1 | Apr 2, 2017 4:16:17 PM | 24

Rex @ 13

yes indeed, the more lackadaisical, nuanced side of team Trump.

it's like pushing up daisies.

Posted by: john | Apr 2, 2017 4:32:40 PM | 25

I also recall those copper disk capped IED devices from a decade ago. Those were definitely not high tech. What is new in this story is the positioning of the shot glass at the apex of the copper cone. What does that accomplish? Anyone know?

Posted by: ToivoS | Apr 2, 2017 5:28:07 PM | 26

ToivoS 26

Directs the blast. Must be correct shape for the shaped charge.
A number of youtube videos on it but without the copper projectile.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmIwexhH1SA

Posted by: Peter AU | Apr 2, 2017 5:35:39 PM | 27

you needn't have a scribd account to read this cia terrorist manual.

@18 paul. 'What about the US hand in arming the Bahrain terrorist government?'

interesting ... the dateline on b's wapo story is april fools' day, the date line on press-tv's story, Rights groups condemn US sale of weapons to Bahrain, is april fools' eve.

this is just amazon - with their $500 million cia contract - knuckling their brow to the washington terrorists who butter their daily bread. bezo's blog in service to the empire.

24 anon1, 'these journalists are having a salary that is sometimes 5 times more than the regular american and their job is pure lies and disinformation .. '

not only journalists, but right down the line. it's the people profiting from death, devastation, destruction, and deceit vs the rest of us. they project their images into our cave ... but there's no reason for us not to stride out into the moonlight and note that they're just a band of misshapen dwarves dancing around their campfire.

'Surly "current and former intelligence officials" are paragons of truth and veracity and whatever they claim MUST be true.'

and they are surly, too. whether they drink their martinis shaken or stirred - pretending that it's texas medicine, when it's really just railroad gin. how typical that their manual uses martini glasses, so ready to the surly spook hand, to murder civilians. their paychecks come from the death, devastation, destruction, and deceit that they have made the us' chief remaining export.

Posted by: jfl | Apr 2, 2017 5:41:25 PM | 28

@21 They're fools year round.

Bahrain story to disperse attention from backdoor dealing with Flynn/Nunes secret meetings at WH story, perhaps. Surprisingly, not leaked yet, so it must be damaging to someone with shut-up power.

As long as the Bharainis etc. stay bought nothing changes.

The Parisian police are doing that police training thing with the IDF? Spreading the joy to the Chinese immigrants? No love from US press, except RT.

Posted by: stumpy | Apr 2, 2017 5:45:58 PM | 29

b,

what a great article along every possible dimension is that one from 2007, from ten years ago. i honor you with a noble prize for blogging, untarnished by nobel explosives delivered by peace prize laureates and vicious clowns of the first and third water.

thanks for this article today, and for the long, long winding string of articles that you've provided over the course of the past decade and more, delivered straight to my door, to myself in my armchair, for my edification and 'delight' ... and the check's in the mail :)

Posted by: jfl | Apr 2, 2017 5:54:56 PM | 30

These EFP's are very simple here...
The charges are generally cylindrical, fabricated from commonly available metal pipe, with the forward end closed by a concave copper or steel disk-shaped liner to create a shaped charge. Explosive is loaded behind the metal liner to fill the pipe. Upon detonation, the explosive projects the liner to form a projectile.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explosively_formed_penetrator
These projectiles could penetrate the latest US tanks from front to back.

Posted by: harrylaw | Apr 2, 2017 6:35:58 PM | 31

>> Gotta love those Martini glasses.

That's Austin Powers' design contribution. Yeah, baby. Yeah!

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 7:03:21 PM | 32

Dumbass @ 32:

What I want to know is whether the plastic explosive in the container behind the martini glass is shaken or stirred just before it actually explodes.

Posted by: Jen | Apr 2, 2017 7:17:26 PM | 33

harry @ 19

>> wont attack Iran directly,
>> they cant win, and loss would
>> be beyond massive.

Conclusion: Can't "win" but can inflict even greater losses on any who oppose or who depend more on Iran and ME oil.

For the sake of eliciting smarter dialogue from better-educated commenters, I will speculate -- as ye shall see naively so -- for a moment what might happen if Oceania were to attack Iran.

- The Straits are blocked.
- ME oil stops flowing to China and EU.
- Oil jumps to $150/barrel overnight.
- Oceania fares better than China thanks to homegrown fracking and relative reliance on South American oil.
- Loss of substantial energy supplies weaken China and EU.
- Frackers suddenly become wildly profitable and hire many domestic workers. Trump claims credit for hiring boom. ("Hiring boom"... could be a pun for the attack.)

In sum, by interrupting the flow of ME oil with an attack, wouldn't Oceania hurt one of its main rivals far more than itself? (It's like sacrificing a toe to take out an opponent's leg.) If so, might it not be tempted to do it?

If Oceania were to have attempted this when oil was already $150/barrel, it would've stung really hard. But, oil is cheap and there's spare fracking capacity now. If Oceania wants to "do something stupid", timing it now would be "not the dumbest thing they've ever done". Oh...if they succeed(ed?) in recapturing Brazil and Venezuela governments and then work out long-term oil export deals at current prices, then Oceania will be in even a better position to weather the storm it might create.

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 7:30:29 PM | 34

jen @ 33

LOL! :D

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 7:33:54 PM | 35

yeah, remember those detailed schematic drawings of Bin Laden's mountain lair? Good times!

Posted by: ruralito | Apr 2, 2017 7:47:42 PM | 36

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 7:30:29 PM | 34

unintended consequences

- China stops buying US goods - they are the third largest market for the US apart from Canada and Mexico
- therefore unemployment rises in the US coupled with rising consumer prices because of course the US will stop buying comparatively cheap Chinese goods
- Russian income rises and Europe will become completely dependent on Russian energy therefore
- NATO will dissolve and European defense will be supplied by Russian weapons which will increase US unemployment further
- China will find themselves in a position where they actually have to defend Iran to secure their energy supply
....

Posted by: somebody | Apr 2, 2017 9:21:35 PM | 37

Pure baseless Psyops for the sheeple. FEAR the Evil Iranians!

Hohum.

Fancy names for the last couple of decades, however, the basic principle has been known for almost 90 years. The Munro(?) effect.

First widely used in primitive hollow-charge anti-tank rifle grenades in the 1930's. Used with devastating effect by Fallschirmjaeger as 'Hollow-Charge' explosives to penetrate and destroy the domes of pop-up Turrets on the Belgium fortress of Eben-emal(?) at the start of the invasion of France (1940). The basis of the vast majority of portable anti-armor weapons, anti-armor grenades & some mines, as well as explosives for assaulting bunkers/fortifications, see bazooka, panzershreck(?), etc, thru WWII and beyond.

EVERY military in the world and any insurgent, even the most primitive, would be aware of and how to manufacture hollow-charge explosives, given the basic means.

Israeli terrorists used them frequently against the British troops armored vehicles in Mandated Palestine 30's-'47. Disguised them as roadside stone caissons (road distance markers), for example, long before the insurgents(Freedom Fighters(?)) in occupied Iraq ...

EFP is simply a refinement to reduce deformation of the plasma stream as much as possible and extend its range as effectively as possible. The larger the diameter of the explosive charge, given the optimum concave angle re diameter, the further the distance the plasma stream will travel, with greater effect.

This info re backyard manufacture and usage instructions was widely available in multiple forms throughout the forties/fifties/sixties, pamphlets/comics/xerox/mimiographs/samizdat re 'conflicts' and widely distributed in such as publications as the 'Anarchists Cookbook', etc, including how to cook your own kitchen made C4, detonators, etc.

The image used is of an basic IED for direct placement against a structure or vehicle, the legs are to allow minimum sufficient stand-off distance for the plasma stream to form.

A dustbin sized EFP would be able to project a jet over 25-50m and penetrate an Abrams MBT, in one side, and out the other. Just sayin'

So, maybe the Evil Iranians will transfer advanced arms in future to the GCC dictatorships 'insurgents', such as bayonets, crossbows and spears, perhaps ?

Posted by: Outraged | Apr 2, 2017 9:32:03 PM | 38

Netanyahoooooooo anointed zionist proconsul is in the proverbial legal scrap heap back in this colonial outpost known as occupied Palestine. He needs a war and needs one fast. Last year this time he went and visited Putin the crypto ashkanazi jew and was testing the waters with regards to Lebanon. Putin flately said NIET. So viola pays Putin another visit last month to further test the waters this time with regards to IRAN. Publicly we all know the Kremlins response. The Persian kingdom was ancient history. To put it mildly. So do the anglo-zionist and their puppeteers do Bomb Palmyra and Damascus. Loose a F-15 and possibly 2 at that and Liebermeann the bouncer from Moldova threatens to disable all of Syrias air defence systems and for the first time admit to the Syrian incursion. They need a war and the need a war at all costs tempest fugit be it for Netanyahoo or the illegal colony of occupied Palestine.

Posted by: falcemartello | Apr 2, 2017 9:49:10 PM | 39

The owner of the WaPost owns Amazon. Boycott Amazon and encourage others to do same. Bezos must be hit in the pocketbook, which is where his heart lies.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 2, 2017 10:01:28 PM | 40

@30 jfl.. nice sentiment to which i fully agree..

@40 karlof1.. yes - boycott amazon... i am doing that for this reason and more..

Posted by: james | Apr 2, 2017 10:28:01 PM | 41

@ 38:

No "plasma stream" involved. EFP? That stands for Explosively Forged Penetrator.

The concave disc gets turned into a VERY fast moveing SOLID projectile...

Otherwise, yes. Everyone and their brothers know how. Youtube videos I have watched show amateurs makeing shaped charge liners from hammered flat Copper water pipe and firing them driven by home brewed high explosives.

http://www.sciencemadness.org/whisper/files.php?pid=385406&aid=36339

http://www.sciencemadness.org/whisper/files.php?pid=385406&aid=36341


http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?action=printable&tid=10575&page=10

Posted by: Whyawannaknow1 | Apr 2, 2017 10:30:32 PM | 42

so the wallstree journal all by itself makes up the case for war, and the republican held congress, senate and presidency will do what the wall street journal says?

really?

really?

nothing to do with the fact that there is a group of people in the US that has been itching to go to war with Iran since at least the eighties?

cause it can't be trumnp and his evangelic nutcases and fellow money bags that would be itching to go to war for a bit of a smoke screen and mirrors?

Holy shit, and i thought the world dodged a bullet with the unmentionable loosing and the great peace maker and deal maker winning. Yeah, must be the Wall Street Journals fault.

Posted by: Sabine | Apr 2, 2017 10:35:46 PM | 43

Bahrain is rotting. It has been invaded by the Saudi virus with no cure.

Posted by: virgile | Apr 2, 2017 10:55:35 PM | 44

@ Posted by: Whyawannaknow1 | Apr 2, 2017 10:30:32 PM | 42

Was still thinking in terms of original Munro effect 'off the top of my head' ... somewhat conflated, even so, hence the 'refinement' of EFPs ...

Posted by: Outraged | Apr 2, 2017 10:59:19 PM | 45

well never mind,

according to this tweet, Jared Kushner is in Iraq right now and surly he will bring peace. Or maybe just securing the oil? or buying some nice nubile slaves for his fathers in laws pleasure? Or something? I mean it would be wrong to speculate?
https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/848725811423313920

Posted by: Sabine | Apr 2, 2017 11:05:17 PM | 46

somebody @ 37

>> unintended consequences
>> China stops buying US goods - they are the third largest market for the US apart from Canada and Mexico

What do they buy?
- Agricultural products: Not like they can cut that out.
- High tech products: Even in the baseline scenario, they're going to reduce that, since they increasingly possess all the know-how.

>> Russian income rises and Europe will become completely dependent on Russian energy therefore

Yes, was thinking that. But, Europe increasingly has nothing to offer Russia in exchange for the oil, because Russia gets more for their oil by trading with China. Won't that incite European leaders to grow ever more desperate and aggressive towards Russia? (I don't know.)

>> NATO will dissolve

Hypothesis: US/UK want to extricate the UK from EU and then NATO, so they can foment another war between Germany and Russia without being obligated to join in.

>> China will find themselves in a position
>> where they actually have to defend Iran
>> to secure their energy supply

True. They'll learn that, but probably belatedly. And it'll take years for them to implement that once a lot of Iran/ME oil infrastructure is destroyed.

Anyway... I'm not making a prediction. Just exploring the unpossible.

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 11:52:44 PM | 47

>> Hypothesis: US/UK want to extricate
>> the UK from EU and then NATO, so
>> they can ...

Setting aside the "speculative squared" issue of "why?", I do think it's possible the US/UK wanted Brexit and, in turn, want to distance themselves from an EU that they will set up to weaken (thus ensuring no chance of the member states coming out from under the Anglo Empire thumb).

(It's possible Obama was deployed as "reverse psychology".)

Why would I even entertain such a nonsense idea? Because I think it's extremely unlikely Brexit would've happened if TPTB didn't want it. For comparison, in this country, the Republicans and Democrats steal elections from each other, point fingers afterwards, and mostly get away with it. On anything "bi-partisan", there wouldn't be any fingerpointing. The more I think about it, the more unlikely it seems that the elites/globalists would let Brexit happen when they could instead easily tip the close vote.

But, Brexit without UK exiting NATO doesn't sufficiently distance them from EU. (Could Trump's agitation towards NATO be related?) So, unless that happens, too, I struggle to make this divergent narrative of mine plausible... ;-)

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 3, 2017 12:05:40 AM | 48

@40 Karlof1

Agreed. Along with netlfix for producing white helmet propaganda and taking heavy investment from George Soros, amazon prime members should at least not renew their subscription and find different avenues for online shopping. There are a ton of sites that are trying to win market share away from amazon with very comparable pricing. My toddler might not like every kid show ever made no longer at her fingertips without subscriptions to these streaming services, but it will be a +1 for your brain and family-time.

Posted by: NemesisCalling | Apr 3, 2017 12:12:50 AM | 49

Re: Posted by: dumbass | Apr 2, 2017 11:52:44 PM | 47

Hypothesis: US/UK want to extricate the UK from EU and then NATO, so they can foment another war between Germany and Russia without being obligated to join in.


Um, well that certainly won't work. Do you think Germans and Russians are innately stupid or something? Or do you just think those in the US/UK think that?

Fool me once, shame on you etc. etc.

Posted by: Julian | Apr 3, 2017 3:07:22 AM | 50

NemesisCalling 49 "My toddler might not like every kid show ever made no longer at her fingertips without subscriptions to these streaming services, but it will be a +1 for your brain and family-time."

Scrap the nut box. Best thing you can ever do for your kids.

Posted by: Peter AU | Apr 3, 2017 4:10:05 AM | 51

dumbass 48
A 'Quadrant ' magazine (better quality neo-con discussions )from Australia clearly signaled in a special Brexit themed issue that Brexit was on the cards . I was surprised by their tone of support months out from the vote . The tone made me feel -that somehow - it was a set-up. Certainly in line with 'dumbass 48's analyses .

Posted by: ashley albanese | Apr 3, 2017 4:19:13 AM | 52

@49 NemisisIsCalling
That train of thought should not only be reserved for bezos, Netflix and Amazon, but is a blueprint for the responsibility we should take in every unit of currency we lay down. Wherever the will of a population is subverted by rampant capitalists, collectively voting with your wallet is the last line of defence and the only real language TPTB understands.

Posted by: MadMax2 | Apr 3, 2017 5:12:44 AM | 53

So says the terrorist state which started the wars in the first place, all for Zionism and its new master race. America will start the war that kills a billion people.

Posted by: Michael McNulty | Apr 3, 2017 6:07:25 AM | 54

From an April 2003 Haaretz article:

The war in Iraq was conceived by 25 neoconservative intellectuals, most of them Jewish, who are pushing President Bush to change the course of history. Two of them, journalists William Kristol and Charles Krauthammer, say it's possible.

This is a war of an elite. [Tom] Friedman laughs: I could give you the names of 25 people (all of whom are at this moment within a five-block radius of this office) who, if you had exiled them to a desert island a year and a half ago, the Iraq war would not have happened.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/features/white-man-s-burden-1.14110

Why Tommie F thinks the illegal and immoral invasion of Iraq is funny is beyond me.

Posted by: Greg Bacon | Apr 3, 2017 7:23:17 AM | 55

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 3, 2017 12:05:40 AM | 48

Britain's elite does not want the EU to control their banking and the working class does not want the EU impose immigration. It is as simple as that.

Russia (and Ukraine) own an incredible space of arable land they do not use so China is safe without the US. US farmers might bite the dust in a trade war.

China has a rare earth monopoly needed for technology.

The majority of people contributing to US technological edge were not born in the US.

An so on and so forth. Nobody knows how a trade war would end. China's chances to "win" are pretty good

In the end they are over a billion people compared to the US 300 million. And no, India would not fight on the side of the US.

The US has a trade deficit with India, too.

In the end it comes down to US Americans consuming more than they produce. It is ok as long as there is confidence in the bank. When everybody tries to withdraw their money the world is in trouble.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 3, 2017 8:41:13 AM | 56

Bezos' WaPoo does it again. It's a tilt-a-whirl of "truthiness." As to Iranian weapons supplies, don't forget Iran was supposedly arming the Houthis in Yemen. It's part of the Iranian terrorists meme the MSM/govt/zio people push. And even if Iran did supply Iraqis fighting US forces, where were they supposed to get their weapons to resist? (I don't like dead Americans or anyone else but there is a logic here that is being denied. Isn't this the point where Hillary throws up her hands and says "What difference does it make?") But at least Bahrain made it on the radar if only to be used for the agenda. Maybe some will look deeper to see the small Sunni cronies ruling over majority Shia state - something Team Bush used as a reason to topple Saddam. Maybe they'll read about the violent putdown of the Arab spring protests in Bahrain by Saudi forces. It's a shame Americans only get a one-sided view of the world.
Speaking of Yemen:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyWJfqpx370

Posted by: Curtis | Apr 3, 2017 9:07:54 AM | 57

In that video, they say Obama stopped arms sales to the Saudis over the funeral bombing but while the US stepped back, the US still refueled Saudi planes and provided intel. So the US actions tend to be for show wrist-slapping exercises. It's like when the US realized Pakistan was a true WMD supplier to Libya, Iran, and others and had also siphoned off some of US money for Afghan mujahedeen to use with Saudi money for their nuclear bomb program. (see the book Deception) What did the US do about that? A bit of tongue lashing while the US went after Libya and Iran for having equipment to work with nuclear materials. Par for the course.

Posted by: Curtis | Apr 3, 2017 9:19:30 AM | 58

So, which group of terrorists will claim responsibility for the St. Petersburg Metro bombing? Was the group inspired by Bezos's WaPost and supplied with NATO material? Wonder what Nikki Halley will say at UN--probably blame it on Putin.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 3, 2017 10:39:41 AM | 59

Western fake news media working on new wmd's all day, here is the latest after the terror incident in St Petersburg.

'Serious' Journalists Already Blaming Putin For St. Petersburg Terror Attack
http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/serious-journalists-already-blaming-putin-st-petersburg-terror-attack/ri19427

Posted by: Anon1 | Apr 3, 2017 2:36:12 PM | 60

Flooding reported in one district of Raqqa.
Apparently the Tabqa spillway was recently opened, but it is uncertain if that's what caused the flooding in Raqqa.

http://syriadirect.org/news/flooding-reported-in-raqqa-city-amidst-struggle-for-euphrates-dam/

Posted by: Wwinsti | Apr 3, 2017 3:16:20 PM | 61

US would never ever ever supply arms to an insurgency...!

Posted by: brian | Apr 3, 2017 6:09:01 PM | 62

this one is about the wapo rummaging around in the trash found in the usual receptacles and then printing it ... michael hudson recounts bloomberg falsifying its own trash and then printing it: Bloomberg’s Hit Job on Venezuela – and Me. bloomberg is worse ... of course, at the heart of the financial fraud network, they probably feel they have more to lose, personally than bezo's does. he's an 'innovator' in the 'technical' arena.

Posted by: jfl | Apr 3, 2017 9:32:04 PM | 63

The Trump administration has told Congress it plans to approve a multibillion-dollar sale of F-16 fighter jets to Bahrain without the human rights conditions imposed by the Obama administration.

If finalised, the approval would allow the Gulf island to purchase 19 of the jets from Maryland-based Lockheed Martin Corp, plus improvements to other jets in Bahrain’s fleet. Though Congress has opportunities to block the sale, it is unlikely it will act to do so, given the Republican majority’s strong support.

The decision on Wednesday is the latest signal that the Trump administration is prioritising support for Sunni-led countries seen as critical to opposing Iran’s influence in the region, ahead of human rights issues that President Barack Obama had elevated.

Under Obama, the US withdrew approval before the deal was finalised because it said Bahrain had not taken steps it had promised to improve human rights.

Senate foreign relations committee chairman Bob Corker’s office said the committee was told on Wednesday by the state department that it plans to proceed with the sale. The state department declined to comment.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/30/trump-administration-human-rights-fighter-jets-bahrain

Meet the new boss; even worse than the old boss. Stinking Trump!

Posted by: Circe | Apr 3, 2017 9:57:13 PM | 64

I'll ask this rhetorical question again: Is Jared Kushner being groomed by Trump and his Zionist cohorts to run for President and succeed his father-in-law as the first Zionist President of the U.S.? Sure looks like it.

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/04/03/why-jared-kushner-iraq-trump-son-law-expands-shadow-diplomat-role

In case you didn't notice the last tweet in above article:

Effing Right on!!!

Posted by: Circe | Apr 3, 2017 10:12:58 PM | 65

Oh wtf! my link got messed up so here's a copy of the tweet:

Clara Jeffery‏
@ClaraJeffery


15 Fucking Years Later All We Have To Offer The People of Iraq is Jared Kushner, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

Exactly. Like they need a Zionist pretty-boy to make things right.

Posted by: Circe | Apr 3, 2017 10:17:54 PM | 66

Circe @65 -- I thought Prince William rather dashing in his role as Helicopter Pilot. Jared, well, maybe scouting for hotel sites?

Posted by: stumpy | Apr 3, 2017 10:52:35 PM | 67

Posted by: Circe | Apr 3, 2017 10:12:58 PM | 65 & 66
(Jared Kushner > Iraq)

Xymphora was wondering about that, too.
After due consideration, he has concluded that there aren't enough slum lords in Iraq which, considering the highly destructive "liberation" of Mosul, and the fact that the Iraqi Govt was installed by AmeriKKKa (after demanding that the previous leaders of both Iraq and Afghanistan step down (within a fortnight of each other)), is probably closer to the truth than Jared would care to admit.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 4, 2017 12:53:09 AM | 68

somebody @ 56

>> Britain's elite does not want
>> the EU to control their banking

Why? Was that at risk? Didn't seem like it.

>> and the working class does not
>> want the EU impose immigration.

What the working class wants matters not a bit unless they threaten the capitalist state and, hence, the privilege of the state oligarchs. I didn't see that happen for Brexit.

I'm not confident of most of my other speculation. But, I actually do suspect this: The vote was close enough that the elites could've tipped it either way. I suspect they wanted this outcome. And what they want(ed) is all that matters.

As for your other responses, I consider them very persuasive. On balance, they make more sense than the speculative points I offered and which you addressed. ... Thanks!

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 4, 2017 12:55:41 AM | 69

Xymphora, April 3, 2017...

"Trump senior adviser Jared Kushner travels to Iraq". Iraq must be suffering from a lack of slumlords."

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 4, 2017 1:04:07 AM | 70

Posted by: dumbass | Apr 4, 2017 12:55:41 AM | 69

A part of London functions as a tax haven.

Not just a tax haven - exclusion from rules and law.

The EU would/could endanger this the more hackers/whistleblowers provide the data.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 4, 2017 4:49:41 AM | 71

Press TV Abadi interview

Turning to the Saudi-led war on Yemen, Abadi said Riyadh had been convinced that it needed to end the war, which has killed more than 12,000 Yemeni people since it began in March 2015.

“It is likely that this will happen soon,” he said, referring to an end to the war.

True?

Posted by: somebody | Apr 4, 2017 5:59:12 AM | 72

@72 sb

if you trust al-abadi. i don't. he literally follows the money. the saudis are his new best friends.

Posted by: jfl | Apr 4, 2017 7:15:01 AM | 73

Posted by: jfl | Apr 4, 2017 7:15:01 AM | 73

So that he should know?

Posted by: somebody | Apr 4, 2017 7:22:16 AM | 74

Circe 66
The take on last night's MSM was that Kushner was taking on many roles of Trump adviser, visiting Iraq, re-organizing government, etc and marveling at how much he was taking on.

brian 62
Always notice the hypocrisy! It's something you can use (as ammo) to point out to others. Russia interfered with US elections? It's not as though the US hasn't done this ... many, many times before.

Posted by: Curtis | Apr 4, 2017 6:07:26 PM | 75

The neolib values that the EU began buying into heavily from the 90's onwards are despicable but the best way forward wasn't for states to revert to their unsustainable former conflict ridden selves. There is a massive need for the EU to reform into a much more people focused organisation which interacts with communities that have become more powerful from the devolution of tax collection and regulatory powers away from those former nation states.
Europe remodeled that way would be successful beyond measure and create a genuine obstacle to amerikan hegemony - which is why D trump et al provided so much aid & comfort to the brexiters.
The same stunt that was pulled during the formation of the euro whereby england was carrot & sticked away from joining the eurozone by amerikan undertakings that the sterling would remain a reserve currency but the euro would not was used with brexit.
Sterling is exactly the sort of reserve currency amerika wanted - from too small an economy to provide genuine competition for the dollar but large enough so that tax cheating corporations and dodgy protected criminal enterprises could avoid pesky Fed regulations which are fine to lay on Joe/Jo Blow but cannot be invoked against 'us'.
The inclusion of UK in the euro would have enabled a greater spreading of risk within the eurozone plus it would have become much more established as a reserve currency obviating the need for european governments to lay off in amerikan investments which was the cause of european economies free-fall after 2008.
Another fine mess brought to the world by T. Blair.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Apr 4, 2017 9:05:58 PM | 76

Greg Bacon 55
It is so disgusting to think back on this. So many have reported and written about how Iraq was an obsession of this group before Bush ever took office. The obsession only increased once they got into power. I am re-reading Suskind's One Percent Doctrine (2006) where he comments about the early meetings of Team Bush discussing how to take out Saddam. That was also mentioned in The Price of Loyalty. And yet so few beyond these writers and the alt media have ever written about this obsession, its price, results, etc. One would think if the media really were as liberal and anti-war as claimed, they would focus on this. Diane Sawyer did an interview with the guy who wrote the PNAC document and basically dismissed it. Anyway the media has moved on ... more of the matrix of disinfo to construct.
How can anyone think it's funny unless they are twisted sadists?

Interesting point about white man's burden. Just before the Iraq war, British actor John Rhys-Davies was on some Fox (or CNN?) discussion and he pushed the same idea. He sounded good on this but I had to remind myself via libertarian beliefs and their BS that this was all wrong.

Posted by: Curtis | Apr 4, 2017 11:23:42 PM | 77

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