Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
October 30, 2016

Unprincipled WaPo Editors Damned Comey Critics - Now Join Them

The Washington Post editorial page is staunchly neoconservative and early on endorsed Hillary Clinton for president. On July 7 2016 the editors pinned an editorial defending FBI chief Comey's decision to then close the Clinton email case:

Republicans attack Mr. Comey for doing his job

IF REPUBLICANS believe the FBI director is corrupt and political, they should have the gumption to say so. Instead, many have insulted James B. Comey with slimy implications and underhanded threats since Tuesday, when he announced that he would not recommend charges against Hillary Clinton relating to her use of a private email server while secretary of state.
...

A look at today's Washington Post editorial page seems to demonstrate a change of mind:


bigger

From the first piece headlined James Comey is damaging our democracy:

First, the FBI director, James B. Comey, put himself enthusiastically forward as the arbiter of not only whether to prosecute a criminal case — which is not the job of the FBI — but also best practices in the handling of email and other matters. Now, he has chosen personally to restrike the balance between transparency and fairness, departing from the department’s traditions.

From the second piece by notorious mud-slinger Dana Milbank:

I’ve long believed in Comey’s integrity. But if he doesn’t step forward and explain his October Surprise, he may inadvertently wind up interfering in the political process — perhaps even reversing the outcome of a presidential election — in a way that would have made J. Edgar Hoover gape.

And the third strike:

FBI Director James B. Comey’s stunning announcement that he has directed investigators to begin reviewing new evidence in the Clinton email investigation was yet another troubling violation of long-standing Justice Department rules or precedent, conduct that raises serious questions about his judgment and ability to serve as the nation’s chief investigative official.

Back to the July 7 editorial:

“It appears damage is being done to the rule of law,” Mr. Ryan said. He’s right, but the FBI director isn’t doing the damage. The wreckers are those who cast baseless aspersions on U.S. law enforcement in the service of their partisan goals.

I for one believe that Comey was wrong in July and is right today. He should have pressed for charges against Clinton early on. Using a "secret" private email server for confidential state business is not legal and would have been out of bounds for anyone else. Now possible new evidence was found and must be investigated. It is not Comey's job to ask if the timing of a renewed investigation is convenient for the potential culprit. He also had to inform Congress because he had reasonably promised to do so. (He also needed to save his ass before anyone else in his department talked to the media.)

The so called "election" of a U.S. president is always a sorry show. But this season's version has at least some amusing moments. Seeing the hypocrites at Fred Hyatt's Funny Pages™ squirm is one of them. It makes me smirk.

Posted by b on October 30, 2016 at 08:37 AM | Permalink

Comments
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What are the chances of the Greens disappointing their supporters if they get into government? High, if the experience of their sister parties elsewhere in Europe is anything to go by, suggests Joseph Healy:

http://www.redpepper.org.uk/when-greens-govern/

And... Hillary's "running mate":

DEVELOPING New headaches for VP nominee Tim Kaine as alleged mistress comes forward with tape of thr
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g95HySIhLrc

Don't you want somebody to love?

(Maybe NOT Tim Kaine.)

THINK AGAIN!!!

Posted by: blues | Oct 30, 2016 9:56:08 PM | 101

Is Comey trying to back the expected winner?

Paul Craig Roberts • October 29, 2016

The problem for the FBI, which once was a trusted American institution, but no longer is, is that there is no longer any doubt that Donald Trump will win the popular vote for president of the United States. His appearances are so heavily attended that thousands are turned away by local fire/occupancy regulations. In contrast, Hillary has curtailed her appearances, because she doesn’t draw more than 30 or 40 people.

Americans are sick to death of the corrupt Clintons and the corrupt American media. The Clintons are so completely bought-and-paid-for by the Oligarchy that they were able to outspend Hollywood on their daughter’s wedding, dropping $3,000,000 on the event.

http://www.unz.com/proberts/the-director-of-the-fbi-reopens-the-hillary-case/

Posted by: virgile | Oct 30, 2016 9:57:27 PM | 102


Trump left off the part where Moore said that voting big "fuck you" would feel great but then be followed in days by post-Brexit-like excruciating buyer's remorse
Salon: Michael Moore: Donald Trump didn’t quote me fully --
Trump didn't really finish Moore's sentence before taking the praise
.
Because Trump is a liar and cheat ...

Never one to hold his tongue, Moore took advantage of his appearance on Kelly’s show to elaborate on his real views about Trump. “When you find out that your life isn’t going to get any better under President Trump and will probably get worse,” he explained, “that’s when you’re going to realize what the Brits have realized [post-Brexit].

“If we elect Donald Trump as president of this country, it won’t be the same country after four years,” he added. “I’m absolutely convinced of that. This is the most vile, disgusting candidate that’s ever run for office in this country.”

Moore also used this opportunity to communicate with Trump supporters themselves.

“I understand why you’re angry,” he explained. “You have every right to be angry. The system has failed you, but he is not the solution to this.”

Hilarious story of Trump crashing a charitable dinner, mounted the stage and commandeered the seat of a major donor, enjoyed the entertainment, and having his photo taken ... and then leaving ... never having given a dime ...
wapo: Trump boasts about his philanthropy. But his giving falls short of his words..

So they warbled into the first song on the program, “This Little Light of Mine,” alongside Trump and a chorus of children — with a photographer snapping photos, and Trump looking for all the world like an honored donor to the cause.

Afterward, Disney and Buchenholz recalled, Trump left without offering an explanation. Or a donation. Fisher was stuck in the audience. The charity spent months trying to repair its relationship with him.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 9:58:26 PM | 103

@ Susan Sunflower 86

It's hard to imagine what "bombshell" could involve the Family Foundation unless they's paying for the upkeep of Bill's baby-mamas and kiddy-farm ... would anyone care?

Soon, more facts will be revealed - there is the probe of the Clinton Foundation that the DOJ tried blocking but there is the mutiny.

One of the 7 appetizers before the main course:
via ZH:

Doug Band To John Podesta: "If This Story Gets Out, We Are Screwed"

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-30/doug-band-john-podesta-if-story-gets-out-we-are-screwed

Until the Friday blockbuster news that the FBI was reopening its probe into the Hillary email server, the biggest overhang facing the Clinton Campaign was the escalating scandal involving the Clinton Foundation, Doug Band's consultancy firm Teneo, and Bill Clinton who as a result of a leaked memo emerged was generously compensated for potential political favors by prominent corporate clients using Teneo as a passthru vehicle for purchasing influence.
In a section of the memo entitled "Leveraging Teneo For The Foundation," Band spelled out all of the donations he solicited from Teneo "clients" for the Clinton Foundation. In all, there are roughly $14mm of donations listed with the largest contributors being Coca-Cola, Barclays, The Rockefeller Foundation and Laureate International Universities. Some of these are shown below (the full details can be found in "Leaked Memo Exposes Shady Dealings Between Clinton Foundation Donors And Bill's "For-Profit" Activities")

~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Do read the article and embedded links within.

Influence – peddling. I do recall some congress critters being charged and sent to the other big house. This is more than pay-for-play


Added to what has already been exposed about the Clinton Foundation, here also ZH via WSJ:

[650,000 emails found…..] DOJ blocked the Foundation probe
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-30/fbi-scour-through-650000-emails-found-weiners-laptop

~ ~ ~ ~
Oh wait, there was this meeting on the tarmac. It is said the discussion was about the grand kids.

A charitable entity for the Clintons and their cronies.

Posted by: likklemore | Oct 30, 2016 10:03:12 PM | 104

@jdmckay | Oct 30, 2016 9:43:00 PM | 99

You may very well be right. I do find it very odd that Gore has been absent throughout this entire election, as far as I know. Maybe a comment here or there, but no huge endorsements or climate related support for the Democratic Party. Quite odd given the record temperatures and other related observations of the planet. But as you state, it is academic.

Posted by: Tobin Paz | Oct 30, 2016 10:19:34 PM | 105

@Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 9:58:26 PM | 102

I accept Michael Moore genuine remorse. My questions, why liberal, progressive, NeoCon, Neoliberal, The Democratic and Republican Party united against Donald Trump... They knew Hillary violated the laws, Lied, a warmonger candidate, beside being a crook and at the end of the day in November 8 vote for Hillary.

Something missing here, like to share you views?

Posted by: Jack Smith | Oct 30, 2016 10:21:59 PM | 106

I had heard (sorry no memory of where and no cite) that the meeting on the tarmac was actually about the Foundation probe ... it was ridiculous. That video is certainly "partisan" but I had wondered who initiated the meeting and whose plane they met on ... (as I recall those details somehow never made it into any article I read). So, if accurate, Bill Clinton is an overbearing intimidating azzhole -- to his loyal long-term "protégé" ... so what else is new. She can commiserate with the ex-Clinton-friend club

FWIW, I read today Huma was also getting paid by Tedeo ... she is always described as "like a daughter", working for clinton since SHE was a 19 year old intern ... she's now 40 ... shudder ... meaning 21 years or 1996 ...

wiki:

The Lewinsky scandal was an American political sex scandal that came to light in 1998, referring to a sexual relationship between 1995 and 1996 with then 49-year-old President Bill Clinton and a 22-year-old White House intern, Monica Lewinsky.

I've always wondered how Chelsea feels about the oh-so-elegant like-a-daughter Abedin. I saw a picture of her on the phone "on the tarmac" in 4-5 inch stilettos ... Even when slender and glammed up, Chelsea looks just like her "rather dumpy" mother ... blech... forgive me. Weiner, by reports, is whip smart and very funny, very well read and delightful company ... he's just a compulsive wanker -- apparently in need of constant re-assurance and praise and attention ... blech.

Still, while Bill was destroying long-term Clinton family relationships via Lewinsky (and demands that people lie for him), Hillary had "Huma" to lean" on and "mentor" ... It sounds so co-dependent. (and I suggest zero other impropriety) I've witnessed some very dysfunctional boss/assistant relationships ... shudder.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 10:25:49 PM | 107

This is what I like about Donald Trump... (not exactly the same words) If I'm elected you will go to jail and to Ford's executives in Detroit. If you move productions to Mexico, I'll impost a 35% on all vehicles from Mexico and no one will buy Ford!

Posted by: Jack Smith | Oct 30, 2016 10:28:33 PM | 108

The #1 meme about Donald Trump is his racism ... and the racism of his supporters ... this has been the drumbeat since last Spring ... daily, constant, unrelenting and without exception ... and unfair and ridiculous, without nuance, rejecting all other explanations and flatly rejecting any number of contradicting Trump rally witness reports ...

The meme has been: Support Trump and you are a racist ... full stop. That all Trump supporters want to go back to pre-Civil Rights, pre-Women's liberation, and support for Trump is a rage-induced quest regain lost "white privilege" ...

It's not true ... but that's the drill... utter ostracism, forever, long past the election ... it's very destructive and dangerous ... it's a red-line, unforegivable ... Moore's movie challenged that mindset and he was criticised for his "tolerance" of and reaching out to Trump voters... to the point that the "claim" more was supporting Trump has been widely repeated (sliming Moore) ... Sorry I was so emphatic, it's just I supported Moore's outreach (because it's humane and reality-based) ... and I hated seeing him slimed by the intolerant ... ghastly election.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 10:34:50 PM | 109

As you have heard, the 30% inport tax is an absolute non-starter ... in that the president does not have that power and there is probably still too many automotive jobs and the auto lobby too strong for congress is spank them in that way ... Driving the auto industry into bankruptcy isn't good for "America's bottom line" either.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/09/16/news/economy/mexico-imports-trump/

It's like the wall ... It's a when pigs fly "feel-good" nonstarter

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 10:44:35 PM | 110

Before Nov 6, will decides either Donald Trump or Jill Stein. I'm from the freaking State of California. Study carefully all pro and con analysis on 17 initiative Propositions from 51 to 67.

I'm voting against the Democratic Party and big business. My one vote will make the difference. Last midterm election, The Democratic party House of Representative won on recounted by a few hundred votes.

Posted by: Jack Smith | Oct 30, 2016 10:51:46 PM | 111


@Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 10:34:50 PM | 108

Watch your mouth... Support Trump and you are a racist.

I am a senior and minority and you are a racist what you meme..... I've tolerates all my life ppl like you.

A classic example how a fake progressive, leftist, independent, democratic apologists etc spew trash and attack anyone who happens to disagrees...

YOU should NEVER play the racist or gender cards!

Posted by: Jack Smith | Oct 30, 2016 11:11:00 PM | 112

@Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 10:44:35 PM | 109

PIG?

If you put lipstick on an old pig it is still a corrupted warmonger old pig!

Posted by: Jack Smith | Oct 30, 2016 11:20:08 PM | 113

I didn't say that ... I said that was the liberal meme about Trump .... I said it was false ... I argued that that "perception" was unhealthy and divisive and contradicted by any number of on-the-ground reports from Trump rallies ... I said that I supported Moore in reaching out to Trump voters ... you need to read more carefully ...

It has been constant on sites like Salon, even Slate has been all about Trump supporters racism and misogyny.

This effective silencing is part of why Moore is so concerned that Trump will win ... because so many Trump supporters have been forced, shamed into silence.


Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 30, 2016 11:21:09 PM | 114

Strange how worked up some people get over the Greens. A Party that has virtually no chance of winning.

A vote for Jill is a protest vote. A vote for sanity. A vote that you can feel good about. And a vote AGAINST the corrupt 'Third-Way' Democratic Party that has sold us all out to the highest bidder.

<> <> <> <> <> <> <> <> <>

I say: Vote Trump in swing states. Vote Jill Stein everywhere else. (Alternatively, don't vote.)

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 31, 2016 12:17:58 AM | 115


First it was Rambo of Riyadh yesterday, now just called the late great Rambo, now today some higher-up we'll just call Rambo II.
Obviously they're eliminating all of them up the chain to Rambo XLVII, just like the movies count.

Sun Oct 30, 2016 7:13
ISIL's Emir of Euphrates, Close Aides Killed in Anbar Province IRAQ
http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13950809001389
Sheiban al-Ani, a close aide of Abu Ons al-Shami who is ISIL's second man after Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, was killed when Iraqi fighter jets struck a gathering of the terrorists in the city of Aneh in Western al-Anbar," Major Kazzem al-Jugheifi said.

Posted by: schlub | Oct 31, 2016 12:20:10 AM | 116

http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13950809001546

Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:25
Still a Bad Idea: Britain to Resume Training Syrian 'Rebels'

Only 12 months after a similar plan was suspended, British troops will resume training what their government calls “moderate Syrian rebels” fighting ISIL. A year after the costly US-led program collapsed having trained almost no one, around 20 British personnel will join the revived mission to teach basic infantry drills, battlefield medicine and skills to avoid mines and booby-traps.

It is understood the troops will work at bases in Turkey and Jordan. American commanders have asked Britain to re-join their Train and Equip Program, which folded in October 2015. On that note, all that matters should be this:

Posted by: schlub | Oct 31, 2016 12:24:43 AM | 117

http://www.tasnimnews.com/en/news/2016/10/30/1226353/terrorists-shell-escape-routes-in-aleppo-take-300-bribe-per-fleeing-civilian-russia

the Russian Ministry of Defense noted that on Saturday night only 12 Syrians had managed to flee east Aleppo. The MoD noted that terrorists in Aleppo continue to intensively shell the residential areas and humanitarian corridors.

“According to refugees, it [the escape] became possible after a bribe to one of field commanders at a price of 150,000 Syrian liras (around $300) for every person. In order to collect 1.8 million liras, the three families had to sell all their belongings,” he noted.

Posted by: schlub | Oct 31, 2016 12:28:22 AM | 118

I have voted Green many times ... I'm very disappointed by their failure to "do better" in 2016. I have found them tepid and fuzzy for so long. I saw a Greens tweet today. They really really want to reach 5% and more federal $$$$, but they haven't -- to my knowledge -- moved the needle off 2% since BEFORE the Democratic convention ... Nuf. I'm probably going to vote for whichever socialist party candidate is on my ballot. Clinton is dangerous to children and other living things (and has a high likelihood of winning). Trump is -- to put it simply -- both loathsome and is increasingly being revealed, imho, be an utter fraud.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 12:29:05 AM | 119

searchable Podesta e-mails from wackyleaks horde (almost 40000):
http://wlsearch.tk/

Posted by: schlub | Oct 31, 2016 12:51:31 AM | 120

something planned...remember it's OCT 31 is Samhain.

15 hours ago October 30, 2016
US Expels Family of Istanbul Consulate Staff

The United States ordered the relatives of staff members in its consulate in Istanbul to leave the country Saturday, warning that “extremist groups” are targeting American citizens for attack.

The order was announced in the second travel warning that the State Department issued for Americans in Turkey in less than a week, reflecting US concerns about “increased threats from extremist groups.”
http://english.almanar.com.lb/82139

Posted by: schlub | Oct 31, 2016 12:57:12 AM | 121

Our rebels are now (almost) being accused of war crimes by the UN and reports they are using gas are going unrefuted.

The glorious advance on Mosul seems to have stalled or slowed considerably ... as predicted .... mines everywhere. 5000 civilians refugees here, 5000 civilian refugees there ... they add up with American claims of thousands and thousands of "Human Shields" -- also known as civilian residents of a besieged city.....

All this Clintonian election hysteria is a great smokescreen ... but there's little to no news even when you go look for it. Reports of 650,000 e-mails on this newly discovered computer ...

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 1:28:11 AM | 122

I read this comment at ZH, LOL and had to share.....grin

"I love the smell of scurrying cockroaches on Sunday night."

So if you get Weinered, and you scurry about the place in panic at having been seen, we call you a cockroach. Got it!

It's been a schlong time coming.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Oct 31, 2016 1:32:03 AM | 123

oh, and I read someplace "respectable" that Huma has no idea how her e-mails ended up on Weiner's computer ... ha ha ha ha ha

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 1:52:28 AM | 124

@108 SS 'utter ostracism [for supporting Trump], forever, long past the election ... it's very destructive and dangerous ... it's a red-line, unforgivable'

This is an application of the Zionist's assertion of the 'anti-Semitic' nature of asserting a 'moral equivalence' between Israeli and Wahabist terrorism to the US election. Given Hillary's top five contributors, can we be surprised? Israeli terrorism is morally superior! And - therefore? - so is Hillary's!

They'll get no further here than they did there, with thinking individuals. Most of the non-thinking individuals don't vote. Although this year more and more formerly thinking people are advocating a non-participatory, non-thinking makeover.

Posted by: jfl | Oct 31, 2016 1:56:46 AM | 125

- Is James Comey fearing for his job when Trump becomes president ? It certainly looks like that Comey is changing sides.

Posted by: Willy2 | Oct 31, 2016 2:53:11 AM | 126

If the FBI discovered an email discussion about fixing voting machines they would certainly be compelled to not wait until *after* the election to investigate.

Posted by: JustAthought | Oct 31, 2016 4:53:42 AM | 127

Dang! Why are 'americans' so dumb as not to recognize that there's a civil war at the top factions of the 'u.s''uling the world?

Posted by: Nur Adlina | Oct 31, 2016 5:32:37 AM | 128

Washington is tying itself up into frightening knots over this election. About 90% of the 2,000 or so individuals running this joint in D.C. appear to be severely mentally defective. Perhaps the Pentagon's Joint Chiefs of Staff are attempting to retain a little scrap of sanity.

{quote} National Security and Military Operations Defense Secretary Ashton Carter and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chair General Joseph Dunford testified at a hearing on military budget needs, particularly as it related to readiness across the world.

[....]

Dunford tells Wicker controlling airspace in Syria means war with Russia. McCain throws tantrum. Dunford refines answer. Sen. Wicker pushes Carter and Dunford about a enforcing a no-fly zone in Syria but calling it by a different name ("more palatable terms"). Carter stammers while giving his answer. Dunford tells Wicker that controlling the airspace requires going to war with Russia and Syria. Sen. McCain throws a small tantrum. Dunford says a no-fly zone wouldn't require a war. {end quote} -- C-SPAN, September 22, 2016 (includes video clip of the hearing):
https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4621738/dunford-tells-wicker-controlling-airspace-syria-means-war-russia-mccain-throws-tantrum-dunford


Now, Eric Zuesse at RINF Alternative News has this to say:

{quote} President Obama Threatens President Putin with Nuclear War

[....]

“It’ll be at a time of our choosing,” says U.S. Vice President Joe Biden, on NBC’’s “Meet the Press,” to be aired on Sunday, October 16th.

Interviewer Chuck Todd had asked him, “Why would he [Obama] send a message out to Putin?” Biden pursed his lips, paused, and said, with a grim look on his face, “We sent him the message.” Of course that didn’t answer Todd’s question, which was “Why?” Biden and Todd both remained silent for another tense moment. Then, Biden picked up again: “We have the capacity to do it, and, uh,” and Todd interrupted him there with “He’ll know it?” Biden replied: “He’ll know it, and it’ll be at a time of our choosing, and under circumstances that have the greatest impact. Uh, the capacity to do, to fundamentally alter the election, is not what people think; and, uh, I tell you what: to the extent that they do [‘do’ presumably meaning: fundamentally alter the election], we will be proportionate in what we do. And, uh,” Todd again interrupted his interviewee, and said, “So, a message is going to be sent. Will the public know?” Biden replied, “Hope not.”

Of course, that “Hope not” could mean many things. It might mean: A blitz nuclear attack in line with our government’s belief that we now enjoy Nuclear Primacy (an idea that was first published by the Council on Foreign Relations in 2006, and which has never yet been renounced by the U.S. government, during the decade since). That would be very much a public response, which Biden would “hope not” to be ’necessary’. In other words: Biden might have meant, there: “I hope it won’t have to be that.” But, clearly, Biden isn’t wanting the public to understand anything, other than that President Obama has threatened President Putin, with something, and that it will be “proportionate,” and the excuse for it will be — if it will happen — that Putin had done something which Obama thinks caused Hillary Clinton to lose the election to Donald Trump.

[....]

This Biden-interview is really intended, in that sense, to be a threat aimed at America’s voters, telling them, telling each one of us: Vote for Hillary Clinton, or else! He’s not telling us what that “or else!” is going to be — and maybe he himself has no accurate idea of how far it will ultimately cycle and go. Ultimately, whatever he thinks it would be, might not turn out to be the last step in this cycle of escalation — unless it’s going to go directly to a blitz attack against Russia.

Obama is thus coercing us, before he coerces Putin. He’s telling us: If we vote against Hillary Clinton — if she loses this election — then President Obama has something in mind that we won’t like — and he won’t wait until the next President is inaugurated on 20 January 2017 to do it, whatever ‘it’ might be. Obama here is threatenting not only Vladimir Putin, but the American people. Even if Obama truly believes that he alone possesses all the power, he does not, unless he possesses the power to terrorize America’s voters to elect Hillary Clinton, even if we otherwise would not. {end quote} -- RINF Alternative News -- By Eric Zuesse -- Oct 15, 2016:
http://rinf.com/alt-news/breaking-news/president-obama-threatens-president-putin-nuclear-war/

= = = = = = = = = =

Here is my take on the matter. Because we are saddled with single-bid ("plurality") voting, we are stuck with "Duverger's law" (which has been very poorly defined), which mandates that single-bid voting inexorably leads to the establishment of an entrenched two-party system. If we had strategic hedge simple score voting we could, for example, give 10 votes the Stein, and from 5 to 9 votes to Trump (and then simply add them all up). But since we are stuck with a two-party system from which there is no possible escape, it is futile to vote for anyone but Trump if we wish to avoid death by nuclear fire. Hopefully if Trump wins the military will immediately begin taking orders from Trump, and ignore Obama.

Posted by: blues | Oct 31, 2016 6:23:49 AM | 129

The Washington Post editors add to their hypocrisy with three new anti-Comey op-eds today:

Eric Holder: James Comey is a good man, but he made a serious mistake
The costs of Comey’s appeasement
Comey’s mistaken quest for transparency

I interpret that as naked fear that their candidate may now loose.

Posted by: b | Oct 31, 2016 7:45:25 AM | 130

jfl says:

Most of the non-thinking individuals don't vote

so, non-voters tend to be non-thinking people, implying that voters tend to be thinking people, even if they're voting red or blue, in which case i guess they're just lousy thinkers, nest-ce pas? which would leave voting green as the only really thoughtful strategy for serious thinkingish people, like you.

pat yourself on the back, you arrogant twerp.

Posted by: john | Oct 31, 2016 7:48:59 AM | 131

Most of the non-thinking individuals don't vote

Actually from what I can see US voters seem to some of the most accomplished Non-Thinkers in the world, and have been for quite some time.

Posted by: Killary PAC | Oct 31, 2016 8:08:13 AM | 132

Is this true that if Hitlary withdraws then the (s)election is cancelled and Obama stays?

Posted by: ProPeace | Oct 31, 2016 8:10:27 AM | 133

Susan Sunflower@ 102

Moore also used this opportunity to communicate with Trump supporters themselves.

“I understand why you’re angry,” he explained. “You have every right to be angry. The system has failed you, but he is not the solution to this.”

The system has failed you....so then we are supposed to trust the same system that did that to us.....I used to like Michael....now I think he is just a stupid pig.....

Posted by: notlurking | Oct 31, 2016 8:20:04 AM | 134

Having stumbled onto fresh evidence involving Clinton e mails on Weiners computer, Comey had no alternative but to probe further. Investigators would have had a peek at them and decided that they did indeed deserve further scrutiny. He has been accused of political interference so close to the election, but to have delayed till after the election could have been worse political interference.

Posted by: harrylaw | Oct 31, 2016 9:03:12 AM | 135

Jackrabbit 10;Yes,that though crossed my mind later,it might be the demoncrats attempt at calling the election fixed,as the poll numbers must be Trumping the serial liars lies.
These zionists are the most malevolent actors on our planet,put nothing past them.

Posted by: dahoit | Oct 31, 2016 9:32:29 AM | 136

SS;102;Quoting serial lairs is an exercise in gullibility.Salon?Wapo?Two of the worst sites on the planet,full of hell bots.
Trump is the best breath of fresh air in American politics since?
Go Donald.
Michael Moore is a fat man dripping with the excesses of fame.Anyone with a fond attitude to the corrupt and criminal HRC needs their brain examined for mad cow disease.

Posted by: dahoit | Oct 31, 2016 10:17:40 AM | 137

Al Gore would have had a likudist VP.There is absolutely no doubt the Gore administration would have followed the same zionist inspired path of the shrubs.
Trump is hated by the zionists,no matter illiberal screeds to the opposite.
WTF does anyone need?
Trump 2016,and if he goes awol,we'll call him on it,as we aren't Obots or hellbots,just American patriots,like Donald.

Posted by: dahoit | Oct 31, 2016 10:43:49 AM | 138

Michael Moore made an excellent case for Trump upending the money-changers' tables at the temple. He cannot back-peddle away from it now. His argument favoring Clinton and the system diametrically opposes the crux of his argument - an argument which favors Trump against a grossly corrupt system.

Moore fucked up. Too stupid by half.

What Hillary did as SOS was pure evil. Libya, Somalia, Honduras, Venezuela, Yemen, Iraq, Syria...

Hillary proudly boasted that she directed Billy Banana to bomb civilians in Kosovo. Pure evil.

Posted by: fastfreddy | Oct 31, 2016 10:58:06 AM | 139

I forgot Ukraine. Another important "Hillary and Friends" blood-soaked nightmare.

Posted by: fastfreddy | Oct 31, 2016 10:59:50 AM | 140

Outrage at Comey is a diversionary tactic, shielding Clinton (endlessly) and Abedin who are the people responsible for the ongoing server "farce" of an investigation ... See also the ongoing outrage at (the loathsome) Ken Starr whose was -- in fact -- operating within (a very broad interpretation ) of his "mandate" ... Swimming with sharks!!! Oh gosh. Danger!! Clinton has gone so far as to apologize while stil blaming "bad advice" and "misunderstandings" -- which are not credible "excuses" or mitigation.

The Band memo destroyed a great deal of "we didn't realize" claims to benefit of the doubt with regard to Foundation practices ... the memo lays out recognized liabilities, like Clinton's apparent obvious transgressions wrt to the fire-wall agreement she signed to keep her Secretary of State versus Foundation business "separate."

It's all Comey fault. He's the parental figure who serves as a safe consensus whipping boy here.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 11:05:45 AM | 141

Moore was fighting back against the demonization of Trump supporters by the liberal media. He was saying -- hey, they are your neighbors -- they have been your neighbors all along, they will be your neighbors after the election (regardless of outcome).

Yes, he well understands Trump's appeal. His concern is that people are naively believing that Trump is offering "solutions" or a plan ... they are being seduced by his "medicine show."

I have argued that Trump's public persona is a cross between Calvin (of Calvin and Hobbes) and Harold Beale (I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more) of the movie Network ... Much of Trump's outrage harkens back to those characters virtually iconic outrage/nose-thumbing.

I was responding to the claim -- on these pages -- that Moore had endorsed Trump the candidate -- that Trump was urging people to vote for Trump or indicated he intended to do so ... because this is what Trump (the liar) had claimed. As with Clinton supporters who "fell in love" with the woman back in Little Rock in 1992 during Bill's first campaign and still, stubbornly, believe they are supporting that year's model in 2016. Little Rock Hillary left the building more than 20 years ago (if she ever really existed). Hillary Clinton was widely seen as the more liberal, more honest and arguably smarter "better half" of that marriage ... that was then, this is now.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 11:23:05 AM | 142

TG at 16 is right. The e-mail scandal is shoved forward to detract from the Clinton Foundation. For many ppl ‘a private server’ and ‘classified info. privately communicated’ and so on means nothing, they themselves (those few who have a good job!) have Biz and private e-mail, it can all be passed off as vicious attacks by Repugs. And hey! Killary is a VIP! And has experience!

Not so the total corrupt sleaze of the Clinton Foundation (and others), which if revealed fully would literally have ppl’s hair stand on end. I’m serious. Blood in the streets.

The US political, judicidary, structure is disintegrating, dissolving (not to mention its international relations power.) When the rule of law breaks down, or rather the pretense of it shatters in the public eye - the sh•t hits the fan, the dam breaks. One can cover it up for a long time with handouts, aka bread and circuses, and 4th Estate pandering and upholding.

The stage is still standing but with a tattered, moth-eaten, background. Local revealed conspiracies, disgusting bad apples, sex scandals, blame for some minor financial fraud, eliminating locals in elections with gossips, can serve for a time to remove the troublesome or dangerous, the shafted (the losers who didn’t perform right) and the threat of disapearance keep ppl in check, but only for so long, until some major thing hits.

The PTB are in total panic mode and different factions are at logger-heads with each other, as they were used to power-moves between themselves behind the scenes having some resolution, figuring they control all and one can agree what has to be presented to the public. That is no longer so.

Comey has to be judged within such a landscape.

Posted by: Noirette | Oct 31, 2016 12:14:50 PM | 143

Comey is a Putin puppet
so obvious

Posted by: mauisurfer | Oct 31, 2016 12:17:03 PM | 144

So now we (the voters and the elite) have two candidates who are unsuitable. Seems to be the best way out if the voters won't go third party is for the State governments to appoint their own electors ( some have to go with how the voters want but a lot can choose with out any guidance)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/03/17/if-no-one-else-stops-trump-the-electoral-college-still-can-its-in-the-constitution/?utm_term=.793887de3d31

Trump doesn't get the number of votes he needs and so gets tossed but Clinton gets tossed as well on account of the law breaking the somebody else steps forward a James Baker III type.

Posted by: heath | Oct 31, 2016 12:40:44 PM | 145

>Thomas Frank says:

. In one now-famous email chain, for example, the reader can watch current US trade representative Michael Froman, writing from a Citibank email address in 2008, appear to name President Obama’s cabinet even before the great hope-and-change election was decided (incidentally, an important clue to understanding why that greatest of zombie banks was never put out of its misery).
> Of course Hillary Clinton staffed her state department with investment bankers and then did speaking engagements for investment banks as soon as she was done at the state department. Of course she appears to think that any kind of bank reform should “come from the industry itself”. And of course no elite bankers were ever prosecuted by the Obama administration. Read these emails and you understand, with a start, that the people at the top tier of American life all know each other. They are all engaged in promoting one another’s careers, constantly.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/oct/31/the-podesta-emails-show-who-runs-america-and-how-they-do-it

Posted by: mauisurfer | Oct 31, 2016 12:46:29 PM | 146


You can the Washington Post every day for a thousand years and continue to be misinformed about foreign policy, wars in the Middle East, neoliberalism and everything else...OR if you prefer to eliminate the neocon propaganda and BS you can simply read the Yinon Plan


A Strategy for Israel in the Nineteen Eighties (aka the Yinon Plan) almost blows your mind in the way its recommendations have become reality since its publication in 1982.

In essence the plan suggests fomenting endless war (intra-national and international) among Israel's “neighbours'”with a view to rendering them devastated, divided, impoverished and powerless, and thus easy prey for Israeli expansionism. I

Incidentally the document provides a chilling insight into the mind of a textbook psychopath, one utterly devoid of morality and empathy, casually proposing the death and impoverishment of millions of innocent civilians.

Here are are a few illustrative excerpts

full text here:

http://cosmos.ucc.ie/cs1064/jabowen/IPSC/articles/article0005345.html

"The Western front, which on the surface appears more problematic, is in fact less complicated than the Eastern front, in which most of the events that make the headlines have been taking place recently. Lebanon's total dissolution into five provinces serves as a precedent for the entire Arab world including Egypt, Syria, Iraq and the Arabian peninsula and is already following that track. The dissolution of Syria and Iraq later on into ethnically or religiously unique areas such as in Lebanon, is Israel's primary target on the Eastern front in the long run, while the dissolution of the military power of those states serves as the primary short term target. Syria will fall apart, in accordance with its ethnic and religious structure, into several states such as in present day Lebanon, so that there will be a Shi'ite Alawi state along its coast, a Sunni state in the Aleppo area, another Sunni state in Damascus hostile to its northern neighbor, and the Druzes who will set up a state, maybe even in our Golan, and certainly in the Hauran and in northern Jordan. This state of affairs will be the guarantee for peace and security in the area in the long run, and that aim is already within our reach today.

Iraq, rich in oil on the one hand and internally torn on the other, is guaranteed as a candidate for Israel's targets. Its

dissolution is even more important for us than that of Syria. Iraq is stronger than Syria. In the short run it is Iraqi power which constitutes the greatest threat to Israel. An Iraqi-Iranian war will tear Iraq apart and cause its downfall at home even before it is able to organize a struggle on a wide front against us. Every kind of inter-Arab confrontation will assist us in the short run and will shorten the way to the more important aim of breaking up Iraq into denominations as in Syria and in Lebanon. In Iraq, a division into provinces along ethnic/religious lines as in Syria during Ottoman times is possible."

Now compare this to what Gen. Wesley Clarke revealed about the lead-up to the Iraq War:

Six weeks later, I saw the same officer, and asked: “Are we still going to attack Iraq?”   He said: “Sir, it’s worse than that. He said – he pulled up a piece of paper off his desk – he said: “I just got this memo from the Secretary of Defense’s office. It says we’re going to attack and destroy the governments in 7 countries in five years – we’re going to start with Iraq, and then we’re going to move to Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran.”

This document, and the events which have followed its publication, should lay to rest once and for all any illusions we might have harboured in relation to the various wars in the Middle East.

The depths of the associated treason and treachery are simply breathtaking and with so many Republican neocons and architects of the Iraq War (Bill Kristol, Paul Wolfowitz, David Frum, etc) supporting Hillary and expressing an almost irrational hatred for Trump, we have to assume the neocon wars will continue in overdrive should Hillary Rodent Clinton be elected President. 

Posted by: Fontana | Oct 31, 2016 1:19:36 PM | 147

typo above, the first sentence should have started

You can READ the Washington Post...

Posted by: Fontana | Oct 31, 2016 1:21:09 PM | 148

@129 b.. thanks.. i think you're right.

@142 noirette.. thanks and thanks for pointing out @16 tg's post. i think you're both correct as well. i smell fear from the establishment.. brexit, and now trump winning just ain't going to go over well with those who like to always call the shots.. clinton is their candidate.. i suspect they will pull out all the stops to make a win for her this nov 8th, but they are anxious..

Posted by: james | Oct 31, 2016 1:28:14 PM | 149


@ 147

“In a world that has REALLY been turned on its head, truth is a moment of falsehood. ”

― Guy Debord

Posted by: Fontana | Oct 31, 2016 2:35:48 PM | 150

To follow on from my previous at 143, illustrate. Just one ex. pointed to one specific corruption scandal, at the US Navy.

Published by the WaPo no less. Long. Chose an MSM article on purpose. Worth a read.

Such exposés turn up from time to time in the MSM, touting and outing the bad apples, the foreign / rogue infiltration, the covert dirty dealing -- how-dismaying line, sort of limited hang-out. Ppl read and and yawn and forget the next day, even if it is alarming and astonishing -- ‘just’ some ‘minor glitch’ because USA USA rah rah.

The Man who seduced the 7th Fleet. May 2016.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/2016/05/27/the-man-who-seduced-the-7th-fleet/

snippet:The evidence remains under a protective order to prevent it from being made public. But, occasionally, new details emerge that illustrate the scope of Francis’s penetration of the Navy.

All this is considered so normal or usual nothing is ever done, etc.

Posted by: Noirette | Oct 31, 2016 2:42:58 PM | 151

One for the road….

In Memoriam: JSorrentine

“We did not seek the formula for overturning the world in books, but in wandering. Ceaselessly drifting for days on end, none resembling the one before. Astonishing encounters, remarkable obstacles, grandiose betrayals, perilous enchantments — nothing was lacking in this quest for a different, more sinister Grail, which no one else had ever sought. And then one ill-fated day the finest player of us all got lost in the forests of madness. —

But there is no greater madness than the present organization of life.”

Posted by: Fontana | Oct 31, 2016 3:10:35 PM | 152

I find it interesting that those bitching about Comey now are basing their argument on the alleged fact that it is "protocol" and "procedure" for criminal investigations of persons involved in an election are to be kept secret until the election is over in order to avoid "influencing the election."

Frankly I'd want to KNOW if an electoral candidate is being investigated. I don't care if the investigation "influences" the election - that is what it SHOULD do IF the investigation is legitimate and not a witch hunt.

I wonder if all the people wanting this investigation to be kept secret ALSO want the lawsuit against Trump for allegedly molesing a 13-year-old girl kept secret.

Didn't think so.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Oct 31, 2016 3:11:02 PM | 153

re 153

Frankly I'd want to KNOW if an electoral candidate is being investigated.
If something doesn't come out in the next couple of days, it will be being concealed. Modern software is very fast. Today's algorithms can detect something even in 650,000 emails. 650,000 means probably everything was copied to that computer.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 31, 2016 4:37:04 PM | 154

@152 Fontana

In Memoriam?

Posted by: jfl | Oct 31, 2016 4:45:51 PM | 155

@151 Noirette

I 'read and and yawned and forget the next day' the story that you linked, 'even though it was alarming and astonishing', not so much thinking it "‘just’ some ‘minor glitch’ because USA USA rah rah", more like "tip of the iceberg, because the USA is a massive, corrupt iceberg, but we only get to glimpse its tip".

But the two are functionally equivalent, aren't they?

Posted by: jfl | Oct 31, 2016 5:01:21 PM | 156

@131 j @132 KP

You're both right. I should have written 'Most of the non-voting individuals don't think. Most of us voting individuals don't think either.' Most all of us don't think enough to discover that we don't have to vote for column A or column B - or perhaps not vote at all in revulsion at the non-choice on offer - but that there are 'unconventional', real choices that can be made, and acted upon.

Posted by: jfl | Oct 31, 2016 5:11:14 PM | 157

Jacobin: Fool Me Once:: Many white workers aren’t voting for Democrats this November. And not for the reasons you think..

Why do so many (white) voters not bother ....

""If every adult living in the United States turned out to vote on every Election Day, and was forced to choose only between the two parties, it is almost certain that the Republican Party in its current form would lose not only the presidency but every state legislature and congressional race.""

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Oct 31, 2016 5:21:13 PM | 158

@ 157

Is it possible conflation of belief and reason may have occurred? Don't most people operate on what they believe, or are we speaking of the same species? What fraction of that population between Mexico and Canada are even aware of the qualities of human nature? It seems most likely some Disney cartoon is the operative software and beliefs are the input. I realise your milage will be different.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Oct 31, 2016 11:25:04 PM | 159

|Since no reply is at hand, it is not with reason voters cast their ballots but under the spell of their beliefs they do so and is the basis of the need of revision to your original statement. Those beliefs have easy access to manufacture and manipulate through the use of emotional materials, sight and sound being the most directly effecting the substance of consciousness. Consider the daily exposure to visual and auditory stimulation most are exposed to throughout their lives, so much so, without that exposure the subject becomes virtually into a state of stimulatory deprivation - imagine if you can walking down a street without people engrossed with their devises and actually paying attention to their surroundings. All, every last bit of that stimulation constantly received requires some manner of editing; everything IS edited, notice if you will, the credits, even of 'News Shows' an editor ranks up there with the director and producer of the event. Nothing nowadays has not gone through the filter of the editor in the manufacture of stimulus of every sort of narrative. Accomplished editors are ubiquitous for everything, particularly for political persuasion of their audiences, their importance is to manage the emotional impact on that audience for their clients. You are the audience - period. Everything you retain to base your behaviour on is a product of edited, filtered production, whether buying products or voting for presidents - everything. Do you actually trust that input into whatever belief-holding software you are programmed with? Thinking outside that box (paradigm) is exceedingly rare.

Beliefs are simple to affect, rational thinking has a much higher threshold to meet - the engagement of the higher cognitive mental functions, a seldom exercised function for most although reason requires such involvement. Rationalisation is another animal altogether and is often confused with reason but always involves emotional and belief in its deliberations and often avoids the threshold required for rational thinking. A critical analysis is needed to differentiate the two. Philosophers have plied those fields and harvested their crops for a very long time now and they still produce an abundant yield. So take great care in attributing rational as rationalisation, particularly when political information is involved, you may be in a subject profoundly over your head - particularly given all such information a person has is the product of someone else's editing.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 6:13:52 AM | 160

|Numeracy ranks among the higher cognitive functions involved with reasoning and logical thinking and as such is a learned skill as are all such mental functions. Writing and reading are only recently acquired skills; as far as the species' experience is know, what predated those skills is currently lost, whether it is recoverable or not is uncertain.

In prior remarks I had maintained there was a numeracy question that was not being observed about casting effective votes. There was an unstated presumption of rationally voting one's interest. It was maintained the only effective voting was for either of the heritage parties, which one most closely supported the voter's interests; only one of these parties is in any position to win. I divided the electorate into participants and non-participants as original division. The non-participants have more the historical review significance. The participants are further divided into partisans for either candidate and the protestant vote. It is important to note these remarks pertain ONLY to the voting process within each state jurisdiction to command the electoral college ballots as they are currently configured. To 'win' the electoral college for the voter's preference require 50% +1 of the effective vote being cast. When there is a significant but ineffective protest vote involved, this REDUCES the number of voters the winning candidate must persuade for their support, e.g. a 2% protest vote negates by 4% the votes needed for the winning candidate; try the numbers out - 100,000 votes cast, 98,000 effective votes, 2,000 ineffective votes. The candidate needs 49,000 +1 votes to win. The 2,000 votes are effectively removed from both candidate's partisan support groups thus 4% (2k divided by 50k) of the needed vote required, making it easier to win with fewer support voters. It is in neither effective candidate's interest to dissuade the natural protest vote by even addressing those voters as is evidenced by debate participation. Rather, there is a unstated welcome of alternative candidates that will act as 'stool pigeons' to attract as large a 'flock' as possible without endangering their own 'flock' of supporters needed to prevail. Have any 'carrier pigeons' been seen lately - evidence that 'stool pigeons' are an effective attractant to the 'wild' voter, supplying the hunters with the sustenance of power (and/or wealth). If by rational calculation an alternative candidate actually meets your self interest by allowing either of the effective candidates to win, then by all means go ahead and support them, and allow either of the 'evil' candidates to take power. Otherwise consider what is really in your best interest and cast your ballot accordingly.

Since neither jfl or jdmckay have chosen to participate other than to interpose their beliefs as pertinent to the question of effectively voting in an election where both candidates are less than desirable and requiring the voter to seriously consider exactly what their best interests (those interests not subjected to external forces) are. Whatever may be the results, those voters participating will be directly responsible for the consequences; vote rationally if you are able. Facing one's self interests will be a frightening experience for those seldom encountering themselves directly.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 7:47:32 AM | 161

Finally, something must be mentioned about the use of 'evil' as in 'lesser of two ~'. This is nothing other than a completely fraudulent framing of the public discourse into a form of absolute closely associated with belief - it belongs only in churches, not in the public domain for political considerations. Whereas 'ethics' is a political term having a capacity of degree and shading, 'evil' is either is or not, same applies to pregnancy (both also have periods of being unknown or suspected - a state of ambiguity). When in the public discourse you encounter anyone using 'evil' in their discourse, immediately become suspicious and begin running away as fast as one can from those propositions that contain the word 'evil'.

The 'evil' being framed is far better framed for public discourse under style of management; which style better suits one's interests. In this election two candidates have incomparable pedigree. One is the 'squeeze' of another who has been at the public trough throughout their life, the other has managed private holdings, compounding those holdings into a great fortune without any more of a safety net than that provided by public law, available to all. One candidate has so mismanaged their affairs as to be subject to investigation into their exposure of the publics secrets to other interests not necessarily benign; the other has never held (or abused) any public office or the public trust. On just those two issues alone, there is a sure indication of which would better serve the public interests and that is without going into collateral issues of importance. To judge these candidates by any other measure, whether one wants a beer with, or the state of their eyebrows, or their face botoxed beyond ability to read are issues of the pointy headed and not considerations for the filling of the national office. To fail to frame questions of national import in terms of absolutes is a disservice to the responsibilities of citizens of a Republic entrusted with rational actions for its preservation.

Colour this one gone until after the election and the autopsy thereof, my interest has waned past endurance with the foolish.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 9:08:11 AM | 162

FTB @ 162

Since neither jfl or jdmckay have chosen to participate other than to interpose their beliefs as pertinent to the question of effectively voting in an election where both candidates are less than desirable and requiring the voter to seriously consider exactly what their best interests (those interests not subjected to external forces) are.

Why do you persist with this? Really, who appointed you God... not just firm in your support of a given candidate, but similarly casting judgment on voters? Plenty of others here would have similar "critiques" of someone voting for Hillary, and plenty of educated/aware HRC supporters on other forums do the same with Trump supporters.

The result is same: rocks are thrown at the "others, regardless with "other" group you are in... all with similar high-minded critiques in justification.

You even seem to dismiss my spoken "best interests", as I've expressed well enough around here last few weeks. So with all due respect, I think you're sounding like a broken record.

Whatever may be the results, those voters participating will be directly responsible for the consequences; vote rationally if you are able.

Oh please. Every reason to think either HRC/Trump will be a disaster in different ways. Whichever is elected, looking down the road and seeing nothing much changing (which means thing continue to get worse)... all those people are held responsible as well? Which means they are irredeemable by some standard of judgment... then applied again in 4 years, and on & on it goes? Even having this conversation (for sake of discussion, I'll call it unable to agree) is indicative or more fundamental problems then fighting over HRC <> Trump.

This won't go over well, but... I sit these conversations out because around here someone's a nigger if they can't see Trump is the only choice. Going after HRC for this mail server (and Weiner mails) has taken on mob mentality IMO. There's -0- indication what's in them if anything, and we're hearing forecast now if she's elected impeachment is imminent either before or after intergeneration, the only question.

If this was a matter of "rule of law", repubs on oversight committee were mostly there as bush supporters for everything he did in ME. Something like 50 million lost email in his admin, makes this issue look like child play. Trump's facing more litigation then Hillary.

Just looks like an angry mob to me, the way people go after HRC is not for "justice" it's to get their guy... who's just as fucked up as she is.

"What ends in anger, never ends"... is demonstrating itself well at work seemingly unbeknown to the angry.

Posted by: jdmckay | Nov 1, 2016 10:11:28 AM | 163

@ 163

I keep bringing it up because neither of you dingbats have responded to the issue, just gave interminable blather and responded like adolescent juviniles. Grow up. WHO APPOINTED YOU GOD AS WELL.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 10:28:21 AM | 164

I fully expect this to be deleted so I will finish with this:

I have hardly ever encountered such self-righteous turds as you two insisting on your opinions are superior to any other. Go pleasure yourselves, preferably elsewhere.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 10:42:52 AM | 165

@ 163

It just occurred to me, when you do your self-pleasuring you may be recreating the very first 'selfie'

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 1, 2016 11:46:16 AM | 166


@ 163

jdmckay is just another shill for the status quo

watching a turd roll around the toilet bowl before you flush it is TEN THOUSAND times more interesting than reading comments by jdmckay

The status quo shits out these turds by the billions

Posted by: anon | Nov 1, 2016 12:07:09 PM | 167

jfl, what I meant that some ppl have a ho-hum reaction, because the piece re. Navy is unrelated to their personal goals, interests of the day or week.. they probably don’t finish reading it.

Formerly T-Bear, belief, as seen under the light of this election seems to be a matter hingeing largely on tribal belonging aka a class war, but I get what you say. What is intruiging is that many seem to be changing their minds (in the mundane terms of which candidate to elect), and that seems to rest on reason (or so ppl claim!), which is really also being swayed by the tribe — or absorbing new information which ‘changes one’s mind.’

Descartes claimed that propositions (aka new info or some statement etc.) were judged true or false (leaving the inbetween shades aside) by ppl comparing the ‘new’ to their previous knowledge, and then either rejecting it or accepting it. Hyper rational!

Spinoza had a different hypothesis: he said all propositions are considered true until strong-ish internal or external reasons to reject that truth arise (= tribal aspect.)

They were both right in a way of course, yet modern psychology experiments have shown that for very short time spans Spinoza was correct, and Descartes was off the beam. Ok a bit of waffle in a dead thread. Btw, these exps. also show tht ppl react somewhat differently to info presented in images (static or kinetic) vs. linguistic content.


Posted by: Noirette | Nov 1, 2016 2:11:40 PM | 168

yesterday i posted that Comey is a Putin puppet,
i thought that was a joke
today Carville says it, and he is not joking!

“This is in effect an attempt to hijack an election,” Carville claimed. “It’s unprecedented … the House Republicans and the KGB are trying to influence our democracy,” he said.

“Comey was acting in concert and coordination with the House Republicans,” Carville said. “We also have the extraordinary case of the KGB being involved in this race and selectively leaking things from the Clinton campaign that they hacked,” he added.

Strange but nowhere does Carville mention the fact that Israel has influenced "our democracy" and also influencing Carville and the democratic party!

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/carville-melts-asserts-fbi-gop-kgb-cahoots/

Posted by: mauisurfer | Nov 1, 2016 4:42:58 PM | 169

This is about the NYTimes rather than the WaPO, but it goes into some detail on the mechanics of the 'modern' msm propaganda site, New York Times promotes war hysteria over Estonia, and its distortion of reality, past and present, in order to effect the distortion of the future. To lie, in other words, to forward the criminal activity of the empire.

Posted by: jfl | Nov 2, 2016 2:35:50 AM | 170

The democrats have completely lost their minds and appear in full panic mode. Their talking points are contradictory and incomplete. The Comey memo is insignificant and a total game changer and the FBI's needs to link Putin and Russia (and election tampering) to make things right because Comey's memo was an anti-Clinton gamechanger (even if it included no "findings" or judgment as to significance), apparently an so .... reminds me of overwrought 5 year olds. Who knows what tomorrow will bring. Almost no one is actually mentioning Hatch Act ... or suggesting that Lynch or Obama actually do -- or force Comey to do -- anything.
The MSM appears cowed by Clinton's wrath -- and -- carrying Obama/Lynch status quo supporting minimization.

TV report on very recent poll said that 30% though that Comey's memo was "bad for Clinton" but no one asked if it changed their vote ... y'know?

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Nov 2, 2016 2:54:03 AM | 171

|@ Noirette | Nov 1, 2016 2:11:40 PM | 168

I am unsure the word belief becomes fungible to meet any given situation such as you seem to suggest - this election. You have actually two forms; belief, a noun; and believe, a transitive verb. Highly recommend either the Compact Oxford English Dictionary or Collins Concise English Dictionary as reference although The Chambers Dictionary (13th Ed.) does an excellent job of disambiguation of the various meanings that have developed over time. Since I saw nothing remotely resembling tribes, belonging, class war, etc. among the definitions, I will leave it to yourself to check the developed meanings and find the one(s) best suited.

Just recently while looking for something else The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, Volume 4 had this re John Maynard Keynes (extracted): Keynes wrote only one philosophical work, A Treatise on Probability (London, 1921), but it is a philosophical classic. (…) For Keynes, only a proposition can be probable or improbable. A proposition has probability only in relation to some other proposition(s) taken as premise(s). Hence a proposition may have different probabilities on different premises. ~ and continues in developing the hypotheses. Compare that with either philosopher's thesis you quoted above; my inclination is to follow probability rather than 'truth' as being correctly stated.

Thanks for your reply, it was interesting to answer although its timing was as I was retiring causing a bit of delay in reply. Trust you might find this alternative useful.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 2, 2016 3:06:18 AM | 172

This won't go over well, but... I sit these conversations out because around here someone's a nigger if they can't see Trump is the only choice.

Posted by: jdmckay | Nov 1, 2016 10:11:28 AM | 163

WTF?

No it won't "go over well" - I'm just curious: in what universe would using the word "nigger" in some warped effort to actually defend this money-grabbing war-mongering psychopath (of all people), "go over well"? A "KKK universe" or a "Kosher Racist" universe?

Looks more like you just waiting for an opportunity to find some excuse to slip the word "nigger" into a conversation. You just couldn't help yourself, eh? Your subconscious just had force you to blurt it out


"Hyperbole" or "Out of proportion" wouldn't be an adequate description for completely unwarrantably slipping the word "nigger" into the conversation the way you just did.

"What ends in anger, never ends"... is demonstrating itself well at work seemingly unbeknown to the angry.

FFS, you're using the word "nigger" in a conversation about HRC and her emails, and doing so in some warped effort to actually defend this money-grabbing war-mongering psychopath AND then you go on to lecture about things being "seemingly unbeknown to the angry."?


At this stage I usually just skip over your comments because anyone that admits to taking 6 months off to help elect the O'Bomber clearly has no political instinct or insight worth listening to.

But when I saw that anon @ 167 said
"watching a turd roll around the toilet bowl before you flush it is TEN THOUSAND times more interesting than reading comments by jdmckay

Posted by: anon | Nov 1, 2016 12:07:09 PM | 167

I thought I'd go back an read what the alleged Turd wrote that provoked such a reaction.

"anon" was totally wrong - you are much worse than a turd, you are one sick puppy jdmckay.

Anyone that feels the need to throw the word "nigger" into a conversation, in order to defend the money-grabbing war-mongering psychopath Killary Clinton, of all people, has some serious psychological issues.


Posted by: Killary PAC | Nov 2, 2016 3:36:23 AM | 173

yesterday i posted that Comey is a Putin puppet,
i thought that was a joke
today Carville says it, and he is not joking!

Posted by: mauisurfer | Nov 1, 2016 4:42:58 PM | 169

Well at least he didn't feel the need to run around shouting out "nigger!" while trying to actually defend Killary, so I guess we should be grateful for that small mercy, at least

Posted by: Killary PAC | Nov 2, 2016 3:39:54 AM | 174

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