April 25, 2016
Syria - Russia Rejects Kerry's New Attempts To Shield The Terrorists
The U.S. admits that the upcoming Aleppo offensive by the Syrian government and its allies is designed to hit al-Qaeda and associated terrorist forces and not primarily the "moderate" unicorns the U.S. propaganda blushes about. But the openly U.S. supported forces will also be hit as they are very much integrated with al-Qaeda. The U.S. has for long considered al-Qaeda a secret ally in its attempt to destroy the Syrian state. The French magazine L'Orient Le Jour sees the U.S. relation with al-Qaeda in Syria as part of the attrition strategy the U.S. is waging against Syria (and Russia).
Secretary of State Kerry tried to convince the Russian that al-Qaeda should not be attacked during the cessation of hostilities. But the Russian's did not agree. Al Qaeda is a UN recognized international terrorist organization which, under UNSC resolutions, must be fought. The U.S. only succeeded in downgrading the permanent ceasefire the Russians had preferred to into a temporary cessation hostilities. It thought to use the time to rearm and to regroup its proxy forces.
But then thing went wrong. An offensive along the Turkish border to push away the Islamic State and to seal the border between the Islamic State and Turkey failed. Al-Qaeda convinced other groups, including directly U.S. supported CIA assets, to prematurely attack Syrian government forces south of Aleppo on Tal el-Eis. The attack mad only little progress before it was stopped.
Now al-Qaeda and the U.S. proxies are heavily targeting the government held western arts of Aleppo city:
Elijah J. Magnier @EjmAlrai 13h13 hours ago
#Aleppo observed the most violent day in d history of d war in #Syria causing 21 killed & 95 wounded. Every single street was hit by rebels+
Since the announcement of the cease-fire, over 492 killed & wounded were registered in the only 2 hospitals in regime held area in #Aleppo.
Rebels hell bombs fell on all streets w/o exception while a group of rebels were trying 2infiltrate d city in West #Aleppo, trapped n sewage
This continued today
Elijah J. Magnier @EjmAlrai 2h2 hours ago
17 killed and 92 wounded in #Aleppo regime controlled area today following rebels Hell cannon bombing. #Syria.
These attacks on the population are designed to bait the Syrian government forces into an immediate all-out attack into the al-Qaeda held parts of Aleppo city. I doubt that they will fall for it. The response for now will be more intense bombing in preparation for a well thought out attack later on.
Kerry recently again tried to convince the Russian government of partitioning Syria into "zones of interest". This would shield terrorist forces form further Syrian and Russian attacks:
“We’ve even proposed drawing a line, an absolute line, and saying, ‘You don’t go over there, we don’t go over here, and anything in between is fair game.’ And they are considering that, and I think we will get there in the next week or so.”
The rather harsh public response to that Kerry nonsense came in today:
MFA Russia @mfa_russia
#Lavrov: Splitting Syria into zones of influence is a simplistic idea; the main objective must be to route terrorism @mod_russia @RussiaUN
#Lavrov: US has not fulfilled its promise made two months ago to move “good opposition forces” away from the terrorist front lines in Syria
#Lavrov: The US State Dept. may shy away from cooperation with Russia, but there is no place for shyness in the fight against terrorism
#Lavrov: The UNSC declared Jabhat al-Nusra a terrorist group. Those who want to distance themselves from this group should do so physically
Translation: Get your proxies out of the way or they will get hurt badly.
The U.S. "plan B" of splitting Syria into statelets has been rejected by the Syrian government and its allies.
The Syrian government and its allies are convinced that they can beat al-Qaeda and its various associates on the battle field. They are preparing a large attack against al-Qaeda and anyone nearby. There is little the U.S. can do to help the designated terrorists of al-Nusra in west Syria. But it continues its attempts to split Syria by inserting more of its special forces into north east Syria. These and their Kurdish proxy fighters have the task to take as much of eastern Syria from the Islamic State and others as possible before the Syrian government forces can do so. The thinking is that any captured town will be an asset in future negotiations. It will be interesting to see how the Syrian government and its allies will counter that move.
Posted by b on April 25, 2016 at 02:09 PM | Permalink
The U.S. "plan B" of splitting Syria into statelets has been rejected by the Syrian government and its allies.
how coy framing plan A as a back up solution.
Posted by: annie | Apr 25, 2016 3:26:05 PM | 2
The prospect of an alternative to Erdogan's blackmail/protection racket was tempting ... It's a typical neoliberal deal -- Erdogan "gets the deal," fails to perform, and demands even more accommodations to (in theory) fulfill the original contract ... wash, rinse, repeat.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 25, 2016 3:38:35 PM | 3
Little mistake.L'Orient-le-Jour is not a french newspaper. It's a lebanese one, but written in french.
Posted by: Souriyâm | Apr 25, 2016 3:50:28 PM | 4
No partitioning according to his leaked report.
President Bashar al-Assad should remain in power in the immediate aftermath of Syria's war, as the Damascus government, opposition and civic society groups form a transitional authority, according to the UN envoy's peace plan, The New Arab can exclusively reveal.
Assad would, however, be stripped of authority over the military and security apparatus as the first step in a multi-stage transition designed to draw a line under the war that has killed at least 400,000 people in the past five years.
The proposal is mentioned in a draft communique from Geneva, believed to have been authored by UN envoy Staffan de Mistura as the framework for negotiations. The document has been leaked exclusively to The New Arab and its sister Arabic-language publication.
Posted by: Daisee | Apr 25, 2016 4:20:13 PM | 6
kerry and the west have lost all legitimacy as far as i and many others are concerned...
as for the usa/west tactics in eastern syria, ttg at sst provided a great video with a pretty good overview that can all be found here, for anyone who missed it.. the approx 30 minute vid is definitely worth watching.. i dig the guy saying the wahabbi whack jobs have been at it for the past 100 years and that is who they have a problem with - isis / wahabbi - name it what you will - i notice how the usa/west still refused to confront the monster squaring in the eye, becuase they need their good friends saudi arabia, the gcc's and turkey i guess...
nothing will prevent the empire for trying to break up syria as they see fit... not sure how it fits in with erdofanatics plans though and how the usa/west will succeed in playing the kurds and ayatollah erdo for fools while they see what is happening.. i have no idea what syria's response can be on this when the usa continues to add fuel to the fire with more troops on the ground, while supplying their moderate wahabbis and etc with more military gear... from the video it would appear the kurds or many of the kurds wish to work with syria.. they will be sold down the river by the west - of that one can be pretty sure - unless they can find some kleptomaniac like barazi in iraq kurd area - a complete rip-off dictator one - who the west always love dealing with, so long as they tow a certain line...
Posted by: james | Apr 25, 2016 4:28:15 PM | 7
>> Assad would, however, be stripped of authority over the military and security apparatus as the first step in a multi-stage transition
I don't understand this. Strip the democratically elected leader of authority over the military?
For which other countries' "benefit" has this been suggested? Turkey? KSA? USA?
I suspect "none of the above". So, is the "UN" looking after the interests of Syria or of someone else?
Posted by: dumbass | Apr 25, 2016 4:36:38 PM | 8
re my link to the sst article, i tend to agree with laguerre who i have copied and pasted here
" Laguerre said...
In spite of all this optimism about the Rojava Kurds, I'm still waiting to see if they are capable or wish to carry the battle forward to territories not mainly occupied by Kurds. This seems to me the critical issue. It's always been said of the Syrian Kurds (or indeeed the Iraqi) that they are mainly interested in establishing control of Kurdish territory. Thus not in taking Raqqa in solidly Sunni Arab territory. Back after 2003 the Iraqi Kurds were fine with occupying Sunni territory. But then they got a bloody nose from ISIS, and I rather think they are more cautious now.
However, to be the US puppets they are supposed to be, they need to move forward to Raqqa. Or even close the gap with Afrin. I'm still waiting to see that happen. There's somewhat of a dissonance between US and Rojava Kurdish interests here."
Posted by: james | Apr 25, 2016 4:37:40 PM | 9
US Military axiom - When in __________* do as in Nam.
*fill in the blank
The Wall Street Journal is reporting that tomorrow (Monday) President Obama will announce that he is quintupling the number of US troops inside Syria. From the current 50 troops the US admits are operating in Syria, the US will raise the total to 300 under the guise of increasing efforts against ISIS in the country.
The Journal reports that Obama has been “persuaded by his top military advisers and others that additional U.S. personnel would allow the Pentagon to extend recent gains against Islamic State.”
source - https://www.globalresearch.ca/obama-to-announce-major-us-escalation-in-syria/5521699
Posted by: ALberto | Apr 25, 2016 5:21:47 PM | 10
The US plan to destroy the 'arc of resistance' one state at a time, Syria being the low hanging fruit, is taking longer than expected. Assad has overwhelming support from all sections of Syrian society, but that will not deter the US. Backing the Sunni dictators and Israel is more important to US designs in the region [see https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2007/03/05/the-redirection] The proxy forces employed by the US and allies are no match to the forces the 'arc' can put into the battle, and they will if push comes to shove, make no mistake, Iran and Hezbollah and probably Russia know the US will target them with ever increasing sanctions and those same proxy forces. This is a case where the 'arc of resistance' must hang together or they will certainly be hung separately.
Posted by: harrylaw | Apr 25, 2016 5:46:36 PM | 12
Not only Russia rejecting the proposal of a safe zone. It appears Kerry is at odds with POTUS:
During a press conference with Merkel before the meeting, Obama acknowledged that the influx of migrants, the biggest since World War II, was politically challenging but said the German chancellor was on “the right side of history” for welcoming more than a million refugees into her country.
He also said he opposes proposals to impose a “safe zone” for refugees in Syria.
“As a practical matter, sadly, it is very difficult to see how it would operate short of us being willing to militarily take over a chunk of that country,” Obama said Sunday. “And that requires a big military commitment” to protect refugees from attacks.
with some truthiness Pentagon spokesman Peter Cook says it is expected they will lose some personnel:
WH Explains the Send-Off of 250 troops to Syria
To which The Pentagon adds:
• Defense Dept. spokesman Peter Cook briefs reporters at Pentagon
• Cook says 250 include special forces and support personnel
• Cook says 'they will not be engaged in direct combat'
• Cook says 'they will be in harm's way,' can defend selves
* Cook says a goal is to help expand syrian arab forces
Posted by: likklemore | Apr 25, 2016 6:24:47 PM | 13
One thing I can't help but notice is that the American definition of safe zone is one created and maintained, administered and defended by the USA ... the idea that Syria might define a safe zone, administer and defend it with the help of, say, Russian and Syria and even humanitarian aid workers for elsewhere, solely as a haven for refugees within Syria ... apparently that's "impossible" "unthinkable" and "too costly" ...
Obama seems to suggest that he's not going to risk American lives (and his political capital) for a safe zone (or, for that matter, some definitive actions on either forcing Erdogan to open the border for the thousands of Syrians who have been massing there ... or declaring it closed and finding some place safe(r) for those people to shelter.
The USA might provide satellite surveillance and early warning or sumthin'
The situation at the Turkey/Syria border isn't static ... and with the drumbeats and preparations for new battles, the situation is likely to get worse ... that was the situation I thought prompted Merkel's new proposals ... I certainly understand that there is no "good faith" and reason to suspect opportunistic exploitation (including trying to implement defactor division of Syria) ... but ... damn, Erdogan needs a comeuppance.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 25, 2016 6:57:34 PM | 14
I think Syria and Russia should reject the additional US troops reportedly being sent.
It should be obvious to all that their intention will be to further the US agenda and not Syria's.
And the US intentions are even more suspect given the link fro ALberto about Russia and Syria stiffing the IMF (aka private finance) from redevelopment debt rape. I would feel better if China was the banker but I welcome their intention. IMO, if we are to move forward as a species, private finance must be eliminated.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 25, 2016 7:45:31 PM | 15
It looks like the old 'foot-in-the-door' trick to me. Hillary will probably push for Rojavan independence and the US will get a new base.
Posted by: dh | Apr 25, 2016 7:52:03 PM | 16
It probably is, but there's also a shock doctrine opportunity being set up if the crowds get bigger and the border remains closed ... and the guards have an opportunity to shoot some more "desperate people" rushing the fence.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 25, 2016 9:08:04 PM | 17
Some things never change. The US and it's predecessors have been doing the same old same old for ever. It is no surprise. American rhetoric may sound good from time to time, but reality dictates that if it sounds good it is probably a lie.
Interestingly enough to me, it seems some people are just now beginning to realize that the system was designed to be undemocratic if not blatantly anti-democratic.
I read a lot, and even our critics seem to want to believe we, the citizens of the U$, are not evil. Well, that is NOT true. We only care about ourselves. As long as we can take we will. So far no one has had the grit to try to stop us. If they have they have rapidly been placed at least six feet under ground.
Posted by: rg the lg | Apr 25, 2016 9:11:14 PM | 18
Time to bring in Lord Mountbatten.
He split India and created West Pakistan and East Pakistan.
Then he split French Indochina in half just above Danang in 1945, that morphed on schedule into N Vietnam and S Vietnam. Oh! You didn't know that?
Etc. with him and his Royal family. Using proxies, of course.
Think what they did/will do in the Middle East.
Posted by: chu teh | Apr 25, 2016 9:51:08 PM | 19
Lord Mountbatten in the original German ...
The House of Mountbatten is a European dynasty originating as a branch of the German princely Battenberg family. The name was adopted during World War I by family members residing in the United Kingdom due to rising anti-German sentiment amongst the British public. The name is an Anglicisation of the German Battenberg, a small town in Hesse. The title of count of Battenberg, later prince of Battenberg, was granted to a morganatic branch of the House of Hesse-Darmstadt, itself a cadet branch of the House of Hesse, in the mid 19th century.
Posted by: ALberto | Apr 25, 2016 10:19:19 PM | 20
Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, the son of Princess Alice of Battenberg and grandson of the 1st Marquess of Milford Haven, took the name Mountbatten when he became a naturalised British subject. Lieutenant Philip Mountbatten married Princess Elizabeth, daughter of George VI of the United Kingdom, on 20 November 1947. In 1952, on the accession of his wife as Queen Elizabeth II. etc., etc.
Posted by: ALberto | Apr 25, 2016 10:24:40 PM | 21
Chu Teh please pardon my redundancy ...
Mountbatten-Windsor is the personal surname of some of the descendants of Queen Elizabeth II and Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh under an Order in Council issued in 1960, which has not been applied consistently. While the Order specifically applies the surname "Mountbatten-Windsor" to male-line descendants of the Queen not holding Royal styles and titles, "Mountbatten-Windsor" has been formally used by some descendants of Queen Elizabeth II who do hold Royal styles. The surname was first officially used by The Princess Anne in 1973, in the wedding register for her marriage to Captain Mark Phillips. The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge used the names "Monsieur et Madame Mountbatten-Windsor" when filing a French lawsuit against the French magazine, Closer.
Mountbatten-Windsor differs from the official name of the British Royal Family or Royal House, which remains Windsor. The adoption of the Mountbatten-Windsor surname applies only to members of the Royal Family who are descended from the Queen, and not, for example, to her cousins, or descendants of her sister, Princess Margaret.
Posted by: ALberto | Apr 25, 2016 10:29:04 PM | 22
@14 More special forces to help sunni rebels fight isis helps Russia. If the problem with isis is serious enough to demand these advisors, that means Russia's assistance to the Syrian government in fighting isis is above reproach.
We know what they'll really be doing, but in the world of image and rhetoric, it's good.
Posted by: Cresty | Apr 25, 2016 10:34:53 PM | 23
More on mines from voice of america VOA.
Kobane (liberated 01/2015) is also infested and more than 100 returnees have been killed and 20 sappers... there are mines, IEDS, and boobytraps everywhere ... a bit more info on Palmyra and Ramadi ...
I wonder whose mines (assuming they are commercially made) they are deploying... given the mine treaty and all. I was looking into whether the USA was still manufacturing mines (given that we have said we are only going to be using them in Korea) and found some sort of declaration that we were going to be stopping production (with other info that suggest that declarations don't mean much) ... We're still making and selling clusterbombs.
It's really unconscionable that 40,000 Iraqis were allowed to return to Ramadi given a year's worth of experience and deaths with mines in Kobani .... oh well, good night.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 25, 2016 10:52:14 PM | 24
Alberto- Thanks your posts.
I just returned to ZH after some steak n wine n have 2X'd your posts. Lot to digest! But I will read them once more for their great content.
I recall the name Lord Mountbatten n had only his unclear connection w the Windsors,
Near end of WW2, at '45 Potsdam Conf w HSTruman, agreement was to have British take Jap. surrender south of Danang [16th parallel?] n China's Chiang KaiShek take Jap. surrender north of that line
As neither were operating in that area, Gen. Gracey serving under Mountbatten requested permission from Annamite leaders in Saigon to enter for that specific purpose. He got permission, then landed and entered Saigon w his troops, took the surrender n immediately rearmed the Jap. soldiers with orders to hold the area until return of the French Civil Service. That's what happened.
The American Edgar Snow was there, told the Annamite leaders they were double=crossed and that now, if they wanted their independence, they would have to fight a long, bloody war to get it. Snow was right, the Annamites did fight n got their Indy 30 horrific years later.
It's a longer story, perhaps best filled-out by memoirs of OSS' top man on the scene, Archimedes Patti, who was w Ho as Ho read his Decl. of Independence in Hanoi, only to be shortly overwhelmed by arrival of French troops n Civil Service. After Jap. surrender, Pattipacked n left while observing the French re-takeover. He had not been told of the Potsdam agreement about Indochina. [His papers were collected n packed-up n shipped to WashDC by OSS employee Julia McWilliams, later Julia Child, the famed American TV chef!]
HSTruman was no friend of self-determinism for the colonies and, in a whopping coincidence, had just taken over from FDRoosevelt. FDR had demanded self-determinism for colonies n had violent arguments w Churchill in earlier conf.s regarding post-WW2 plans.
I'll stop here n reread your posts which i appreciate.
Posted by: chu teh | Apr 25, 2016 11:55:53 PM | 25
To my fans:
I will take a break now, see you in a couple of hour. Patience....
Posted by: Susan Assflower | Apr 26, 2016 2:26:10 AM | 27
Hillary will probably push for Rojavan independence and the US will get a new base.
No, she won't, because Rojava is not a viable independent country, and the US won't want to subsidise it for ever (or indeed at all). That's not the American way.
Thanks by the way to James @8 for re-posting my comment on Rojava.
Posted by: Laguerre | Apr 26, 2016 4:16:00 AM | 28
This war was confusing enough when it was in its zenith, but at least everybody with a little literacy could tell what the Empire was doing. Now, when they make it seem as if they are pushing for peace, I cant read the motive. Damage control maybe? Plausible deniability? Why not just continue the barefaced lying and throw everything they have into it? Its not like anybody who has swallowed their bullshit up until now is suddenly going to do an about turn. "..hey, I think they've been stringing us along the whole time!". So why not just really go balls to the wall and finish what they started? They dont have any credibility left either way...?
Posted by: dan | Apr 26, 2016 9:08:20 AM | 29
The rift with Saudi Arabia -- perhaps wishful thinking -- has opened the possibility of (more) independent action/policy based on American priorities less weighed down by appeasing the Saudis. There has been such a disconnect (intentional or not?) between public statements and inertia on either reining in the Saudis or acting "assertively" ... not that I want to see the latter. A couple of years there with Obama saying no one should be arming the Syrian conflict ... while pretty much everyone, notably the SAudis and Gulf States were doing just that ... a couple of years of suggesting American intervention was imminent, possible, etc.
Current front pages make it look -- alternating days -- like some loosening of involvement/control versus (on even days) more boots on the ground. Yesterday say that Iraq might attempt to liberate Mosul "by the end of the year" ... when last week, it was allegedly "imminent" (as it has been off-and-on for what feels like a year)
Read somewhere that this incoherence of "alternate days, different narratives" is an intentional distraction technique. We're left being an audience ... just days ago, Obama "ruled out" more boots in Syria ... voila, there you go.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 9:53:26 AM | 30
@27 You're probably right. But I bet Samantha Powers would like to free the poor downtrodden Kurds. Hard to tell what the Kurds themselves want. Which Kurds?
I also liked your comments about the Rojava Kurds not being in a big rush to take Raqqa @8.
But I still think the US is looking for a permanent toehold in Syria.
Posted by: dh | Apr 26, 2016 10:08:03 AM | 31
It was speculated we wanted a toe-hold in Afghanistan and permanent bases in Iraq ... iirc to make up for the loss of our Saudi base (toe-hold) and we got permission to toe-hold in Yemen in support for KSA, Saleh in Yemen, and now (I think) have another drone base in KSA ... and we've never completely "lost" of those toe-holds in any of those countries. (Remember when we "left" Iraq and all that talk about the mass embassy-as-military-base and our loss of staging capacity) --twttin that was then, this is now, who knows what the reality has been in the meanwhile. I wonder what happened to our other toe-hold and staging facilities in the various -stans.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 10:28:51 AM | 32
@29, suzie, 'The rift with Saudi Arabia -- perhaps wishful thinking -- '
Obama Demands Democratic Reforms for Saudi Arabia, sounds like a color revolution to me. That's how they all start.
This one will end with USraelians in the Saudi oilfields.
Posted by: jfl | Apr 26, 2016 10:39:27 AM | 34
Posted by: dan | Apr 26, 2016 9:08:20 AM | 28
The chickenshit Yankees are peeing their pants at the prospect of a direct military confrontation with Russia for 3 reasons...
1. They will very likely be outgunned and outsmarted by the Russians.
2. Whether they are or not, China will be obliged to stand with Russia (given all the recent childish slagging directed China's way by the Christians).
3. No matter the outcome AmeriKKKa's Superpower Myth will be in tatters and they'll never be taken seriously again.
Syria isn't worth the risk to AmeriKKKa but it is worth the risk to Russia/China.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26, 2016 10:48:41 AM | 35
Syria is apparently strategically too important for Russia and China also perhaps to let it go with the PNAC Yinon Plan murderous "remapping" of MENA.
Posted by: fastfreddy | Apr 26, 2016 11:18:31 AM | 36
I've seen a lot of second guessing of the decision wrt nonintervention at the redline moment, but I don't think the nation's attitude has actually changed ... push comes to shove ... so it's just "make America great again" because "we're #1" election cycle posturing ... Most folks really seem to be willing to disengage, don't even care about ISIS and/or suffering Syrians or Iraqis ... or even refugees
The demonization of Putin and Russia is very deep and virulent. Remarkable scoffing at the suggestion of some danger of a nuclear war. Most born today have never lived in fear of a "real" Atomic bomb, although given ignorant hysteria over a "dirty bomb" (which would cause social disruption and panic, but little structural damage, possibly no deaths -- just sudden steep drop in some real estate prices and lots of fear, bad commutes).
Probably of more significance to more people is when the 28 pages will be released or what the backlash will be (even if they are empty of genuine significance) ... Obama's going to veto the bill allowing suits against the Saudi -- when that might happen and what the backlash will be -- again??? .. will anyone get off their couch for either issues or will candidates be able to make it an issue, given oil, will they?
Obama's got all the time in the world to make a move (or not) -- protecting Hillary probably looms large.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 11:47:08 AM | 37
@30 dh - i meant to say i agree with you in your comment earlier and here " US is looking for a permanent toehold in Syria." that seems fairly obvious.. they were using the airport up in that northeast syrian corner a month or more ago which was discussed previously. for me personally it is hard to impossible to read any american actions as trustworthy.. they have done too much to destroy any trust i could have in them..
@33 jfl.. in reading that article it sounds like business as usual for headchopping country...these fuckers will not change and obama isn't interested in them changing... the key comment in that article which definitely sums it up - "“I have substantiated the US policy of safeguarding our core interests in the Gulf Region in terms of utilizing all elements of our power, to counter any external aggression against our allies,” Obama characterized the purpose of his visit." - all elements of our power meaning siding with the headchopper cult among other oh so democratic blather and bullshite...
Posted by: james | Apr 26, 2016 11:59:16 AM | 39
These attacks on the population are designed to bait the Syrian government forces into an immediate all-out attack into the al-Qaeda held parts of Aleppo city. I doubt that they will fall for it.
This would facilitate more PR campaign of "evil Assad attacking his own ppl".
Western Media Stenographers eat this up. Interesting how many ways "The West" uses the "human shield" meme to spin war propaganda.
Posted by: fastfreddy | Apr 26, 2016 12:10:36 PM | 40
The prospect of a manufactured crisis is ever present ... Assad "attacking his own people" has been tried before ... what reason to believe it will be more effective as a re-run now? They've softened the audience with the scenes of starvation and massing at the border ... but does anyone care? Enough that Obama (or someone else way off in January) will be able to garner support? At this point, how BIG a massacre would it take, after a couple of years of regular blood baths?
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 12:24:32 PM | 41
@40 - susan.. telling a lie repeatedly is part of the propaganda process... the thought being if enough people tell it, it is somehow considered more true... sorta like bush 2 and saddams weapons of mass destruction... add in colin powells bullshite at the un and all the rest of the lather and you get the idea... just keep on repeating the lies and you will eventually convince yourself of your own bullshite and anyone stupid enough to believe it too... helps to have the western msm in tow..
Posted by: james | Apr 26, 2016 12:48:59 PM | 42
I'm fascinated by the lack of concern about the refugees I'm seeing here in the USA ... they're viewed as Europe's problem, not ours ... in a media obsessed with race issues and "islamophobia" ... crickets Aside from "rising anti-immigrant sentiments" in Europe, since they do not look at -- say Geneva -- through red/white/blue glasses, does Europe have Syria-fatigue ... or is a NATO final-push-to-oust-Assad even possible?
Finally listened to Zizek on RT ... he wants the Saudis and other instigators of the crisis to be held accountable and I guess "made" to take refugees (which sounds cruel and unusal but might send many back to their countries of origin) ... I discovered from Wikipedia that KSA has taken estimated 420,000 (wiki: Syrian refugees
May be "too small a number" but it beats a number of other countries ...
European Migrant Crisis. People keep complaining that the Saudis have taken none.
He complains that the EU is using the smaller baltic countries including his own Slovenia to do what Turkey is "supposed" to be doing ... acting as stoppers ... so Germany and the other richer northern countries can keep the "high moral tone" and clean hands.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 1:00:34 PM | 43
(I meant Brussels, not Geneva -- the peace negotiations, ceasefire, etc. )
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 1:01:27 PM | 44
Re @ my Post – 12. Today, following MoA’s lead, Sputniknews goes there:
Fair Game? What Kerry’s ‘Absolute Lines ‘in Syria Really Mean
[.] Interestingly enough, it seems that there is no concordance in Washington regarding what to do next in Syria.
US President Barack Obama said Sunday that he does not support the idea of creating so-called "safe" or "buffer" zones in Syria as it would need Washington's deeper military involvement in the region.[.]
= = = =
And my chuckle of the week from a previous Sputniknews' article; NSA Advisor, Susan Rice wields a mighty veto pen!
Russia’s intervention in Syria splits U.S. Administration
[.]Some officials in Washington genuinely believe Russia has armored ground forces in Syria, claiming Russia moved its own artillery towards Aleppo — unproven information based on anonymous sources in Pentagon, published by Wall Street Journal. These persons believe that if the US fails to react with force, this will be viewed by Moscow as a sign of American timidity, which will further encourage Russia to perform risky and aggressive actions.
These people also believe Washington's inaction will further damage US relations with Gulf states and Turkey (despite Turkey recently hopped on the train of drubbing Daesh in Northern Syria).
On the other hand, National Security Advisor Susan Rice, together with other some other officials, have vetoed any significant escalation of US involvement in Syria. This position is backed by President Barack Obama who continuously refused to be "drawn into a ‘proxy war' with Moscow."[.]
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
No kidding. Barack Obama has a pen. Susan Rice has a pen. John Kerry has a pen. Not to mention, Valerie J also has her pen.
Anyone taking notice that " Confusion" is the new confetti…it’s raining down in D.C.
Posted by: likklemore | Apr 26, 2016 1:15:55 PM | 45
Sometimes I wonder whether all the minutiae is real. Surely Russia & the US must be united in the intention to depose Erdogan. And at least US/EU desire Turkey's partition. But who will undertake the costly war to accomplish it? A good-sized Turkish civil war may not be enough. The proxy of everyone's choice? Iran of course-- but how to involve her? Erdogan must be enticed into open quarrel w NATO. So far he hasn't openly invaded Syria in support of ISIS, but his head is visibly swelling.
Just my speculations. Not a particle of evidence.
Posted by: Penelope | Apr 26, 2016 1:23:12 PM | 46
hilarious ... from Joanne's link @48
At a news conference here Sunday, with German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Obama reiterated his reluctance to create a "safe zone" inside Syria for the thousands of people fleeing the 5-year-old conflict because it would require a large military commitment and ground troops.
“Sadly, it is very difficult to see how it would operate short of us essentially being willing to militarily take over a chunk of that country,” he said.(1)
He pointed out his concern about a safe zone is practical, not ideological, because it would require ground troops and need to be monitored to determine who would be allowed to enter or leave the zone.
Merkel has previously expressed approval of the idea of a safe zone. !!! She said Sunday that she believes these zones could be carved out without foreign military intervention, and the concept should be part of the peace negotiations in Geneva. !!!
"Perhaps because she once lived behind a wall herself, Angela understands the aspirations of those who are denied their freedom and seek a better life," he said.
!!! Merkel spent her youth in East Germany, then part of the Communist bloc.!!!
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 1:37:09 PM | 48
... as if Erdogan's closed border doesn't count as a "wall" ... Obama comes across as even more condescending than usual ...
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 1:40:02 PM | 49
as much as I honestly respect John Kerry even despite the Syria debacle which is just unfathomable from my standpoint like many westerners I still like the guy but with all that said , Sergei Lavrov is really the man, much respect for Lavrov.
Posted by: Au | Apr 26, 2016 1:42:44 PM | 51
Safe zones = camp for all your favorite acronyms Terrier Group with so-called and moderate rebels (anyone who will take a $300 monthly state department paycheck).
Posted by: fastfreddy | Apr 26, 2016 1:43:12 PM | 52
@penelope #45 - Interesting speculation - I don't see the U.S. being united w/ Russia in going after Erdogan and I don't know why they would be. I think if anything, that nato alliance w Turkey presents a real path towards world war based simply on the nato treaties contractual policies. Of course, civil war in turkey would be an option and it looks viable right now unfortantly the u.s. looks like the acting military arm of Turkish / Arabian foreign policy so I don't know why we would encourage such a disruption. didn't erdogan just invest in a big mosque in maryland w/ the presidents approval? I think they are tight and we will use Turkey against Russia. Sad.
Posted by: Au | Apr 26, 2016 1:48:43 PM | 53
The alternative -- natural progression -- to the development of some "safe zone" is a gradually, possibly rapidly, enlarging pool of Syrians massed at the border ... unless someone/thing can force Erdogan to open it ... and then there will a fresh tide of unprocessed Syrians to Turkey's already poorly managed millions.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Apr 26, 2016 1:54:25 PM | 54
Anger: What The Heck Is That
Joy: That's Broccoli On Pizza
Disgust: That's Sit
Disgust: I'm Done
Anger: What The Heck Is That Screaming
Joy: That's Broccoli On Pizza
Disgust: That's Sit
Disgust: I'm Done
Mary Jane Watson: (Screaming)
Mary Jane: (Screaming)
Posted by: jennyscreams | Apr 26, 2016 4:12:40 PM | 55
Roxy Ryan: We Having Spend Today Together And Year
Maddie Parker: Hey Look There's Brad Pitt
Maddie Parker: Hey Look There Is Brad Pitt
Maddie Parker: Hey Look
Maddie Parker: There's Brad Pitt
Maddie Parker: Hey Look
Maddie Parker: There Is Brad Pitt
Abby Parker: We Can Get Some Ice Cream
Abby Parker: We Can't Get Some Ice Cream
Maddie Parker: (Maddie Screams)
Maddie Parker: Maddie Screams
Abby Parker: (Abby Screams)
Abby Parker: Abby Screams
Maddie Parker: (Maddie Screaming)
Maddie Parker: Maddie Screaming
Abby Parker: (Abby Screaming)
Abby Parker: Abby Screaming
Mary Jane Watson: (Screaming)
Mary Jane: (Screaming)
Posted by: jenny screams | Apr 26, 2016 4:18:43 PM | 56
Re my post@25: referred to Louis Mountbatten, aka Earl Mountbatten of Burma and Lord Mountbatten, who was 1943-46 Allied Commander, Southeast Asia. Later, he was British Viceroy of India and was assassinated 1979 in Ireland. He was born 1900 in England [with a given name so long I omit it] and was an uncle to Prince Phillip [per Wiki].
In WW2 he had no senior-status over America's OSS , and particularly Archimedes Patti, whose orders came only from OSS chief Wm. Donovan who ,in turn, reported only to Pres. FDRoosevelt.
Note an error in my post @25: "return to ZH" should be "return to MOA". Thanks your data on the Mountbatten/Windsor line.
Posted by: chu teh | Apr 26, 2016 5:29:43 PM | 57
45;Uh,isn't regime change by outsiders a root of our international dilemma of terror?
Of course,we do it all the time,and I'm sure the impulse by Russia for friendly regimes currently ZioUS stooges against them is strong,but most of these regimes will collapse of their own corrupt weight eventually,even Erdogan,if they are that corrupt.
Now,if the donald(I just saw somewhere?his statement of friendly relations with Putin and Russia-hooray!)can make it past the Zioliars disgusting coverage,we might see a better future for US,and the world.
Putting these troops in Syria,with possible Russian or Syrian govt attacks (mistakes) on them,shows that the zionists and their gumby puppet,Obomba,want no part of good relations with Russia.
In harms way.
Posted by: dahoit | Apr 27, 2016 12:39:10 PM | 59
ha sounds like you've reached a real breaking point jfl - totally understand.
Posted by: Au | Apr 28, 2016 8:42:58 AM | 62
@60 DH - Wow! fake story, had to pay libel? very interesting.
Posted by: Au | Apr 28, 2016 8:44:04 AM | 63