Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 16, 2014

This "Putin Isolated" Nonsense Is Dangerous

These headlines are silly:

Even more silly then those headlines was the German prime news Tagesschau which used a picture of Putin seemingly sitting alone at a lunch table to prove his "isolation". But news service pictures show that he is sitting with the Brazilian president Dilma Rousseff waiting for the other lunch guests to sit down next to them. These were simply not visible in the frame Tagesschau selectively used.

And do these headline writers, TV correspondents and politicians know what the 20 in G-20 means? The people who publicly miffed Putin in Brisbane were Obama, Cameron, Harper, Abbott and Abe. I count five out of twenty.

Those leaders who did not "isolate" Putin by grandstanding in front of the media were from Argentina, Brazil, China, France, Germany, India, Indonesia, Italy, Mexico, Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Republic of Korea and Turkey. Many of the leaders of those countries had one on one talks with Putin. Merkel alone had a three hour talk with Putin. Did that make him feel lonely?

Fact is Putin is about as isolated as the Pope.

Fact is also that those "world leaders" who "isolated" Putin represent a minority of people, military and economic power of the world. As Putin himself correctly pointed out before the G-20 meeting:

Incidentally, the combined GDP of the BRICS countries calculated using purchasing power parity is already bigger than that of the so-called G7 countries. As far as I know, the BRICS countries have more than $37 trillion calculated using purchasing power parity, while the G7 has $34.5 trillion. And this upwards trend is in favour of the BRICS, not vice versa.

Now all this silly isolation talk would be funny if the people in power would recognize it for the bullshit it is. Unfortunately a lot of stupid people in Washington DC, politicians as well as media folks, believe in their own propaganda bullshit and therefore tend to miscalculate in their assessments of global policies. This is dangerous as it often has bloody consequences.

Posted by b on November 16, 2014 at 12:12 PM | Permalink

Comments
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How can anybody isolate the biggest country in the world full of nat resources. An idiot maybe.

Posted by: Victor J. | Nov 16, 2014 12:32:55 PM | 1

I find the MSM media coverage of the APEC and Brisbane meetings so false that I wonder if any honest journalism remains in the west. And I wonder if the Obama's, Harper's, Abbots, etc. simply see the media as the new/real reality..

I am depressed that so few of my typically quite smart and insightful friends are clueless that what they are hearing on NPR or reading in the FT about Ukraine, Putin, APEC and Brisbane is pretty much worthless..

Posted by: Joe100 | Nov 16, 2014 12:59:52 PM | 2

UK media watchdog Ofcom has threatened RT with “statutory sanctions,”
http://rt.com/op-edge/204439-uk-ofcom-tv-channel/

I must say that the hate against Russia will not end good..

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 16, 2014 1:04:18 PM | 3

"...stupid people in Washington DC, politicians as well as media folks..."

Here's a MAP for them, that shows:

• the world (about 40 countries)
• isolated Russia
• not the world (about 185 countries)

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2014/09/20140901_isolated_0.jpg

Posted by: John T | Nov 16, 2014 1:08:44 PM | 4

Many of the leaders of those countries had one on one talks with Putin.

Leaders? That's a laugh. Countries? Another laugh.

Mexico is not a country. It's a dump. It's an embarrassment. But it is assuredly not a country despite protestations to the contrary.

I'll tell you what, Mexico, if you like Russia so much, send your immigrants to Russia and get your remittances from Oscar Putin rather than the creative and entrepreneurial Gringos immediately to your North. Mexico is a joke. Mexico is a slob and a whore. Mexico can kiss my ass. Mexico and Russia deserve each other, just not on the North American continent please.

Posted by: Cold N Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:08:52 PM | 5

How can anybody isolate the biggest country in the world full of nat resources. An idiot maybe.

Well, if you believe in NTE (Near Term Extinction) like this suicide cult, then it's imperative Russia be isolated and those "nat resources" stay put. Climate Change dictates that the exploitation of "nat resources" must be abated, and abated significantly and soon. Unless you're China of course. If you're China, you get a grandfather clause that never expires and you become the manufacturer to the world and can pollute to your cold heart's desire.

Posted by: Cold N Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:16:35 PM | 6

Cold, I'm not Mexican. But you sound like the kind of guy whose ass I'd love to kiss. The next time you're through Minneapolis, please give me a call.

Posted by: DakotaBoy | Nov 16, 2014 1:25:28 PM | 7

b - you are right to call this dangerous... labeling someone else as isolated is a negative characterization.. i think this is the point of the propaganda.. unfortunately these major western politicians are engaged in just this...

the sanctions idea is the same thing.. ordinarily one gets sanctioned because they did something wrong.. this is (again) the message that is being communicated here - russia has apparently done something wrong so they are being 'sanctioned'.. it is complete propaganda bs, but it is effective and as you point out - dangerous..

it's not based on any international body, but instead a gang of thugs led by the usa at present.. unfortunately this is what international politics has come down to - a pack of yes or hench men politicians siding with what the bully dictates... any thinking person can see thru it, but it is extremely dangerous none the less for the world scale it is being expressed on with nuclear powered players...

Posted by: james | Nov 16, 2014 1:26:52 PM | 8

mexico has first hand knowledge of the 2 faced bullshit the usa represents.. world power my ass.. it is a world power with a group of bozo's running it and hoping for subservience from everyone else... and, they have some serious losers to swallow this superiority complex they have cultivated in the culture of 'we are the greatest' bs too - you being a prime example of it..

Posted by: james | Nov 16, 2014 1:29:24 PM | 9

Mexico is not a country. It's a dump. It's an embarrassment. - Colden

Perhaps, if the USA left Mexico to its own devices, by ceasing to manipulate its elections, for example, Mexico could be blamed completely for its failings - perceived or otherwise.

Posted by: fast freddy | Nov 16, 2014 1:32:04 PM | 10

All this animus and war mongering propaganda towards Putin who wants Russian resources to be a long term benefit for Russian people and not just provide profits and reserves for US Corps. Sick.

Posted by: Steve | Nov 16, 2014 1:33:14 PM | 11

Perhaps, if the USA left Mexico to its own devices, by ceasing to manipulate its elections, for example, Mexico could be blamed completely for its failings - perceived or otherwise.

Agreed — but "perhaps" is the operative word. There's no guarantee, but I agree Mexico's illegitimacy is at least part and parcel due to America wanting and liking it that way and intervening and taking measures to keep it that way. The Drug War is front and center as an example of said measures, I'm sure you'll agree.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:44:17 PM | 12

From the NYT:

"Mr. Putin left before the other leaders gathered for lunch, and before they issued the group’s communiqué, saying that he needed to be rested for work on Monday, according to The Associated Press.

He said he did not leave as a result of pressure from other nations."

Rats, I was looking forward to seeing Tony Abbott get tossed off a balcony.

The march to war is then puncuated with this nonsense:

"With the American economy currently outperforming those of Europe and Japan, Mr. Obama came into this meeting with a stronger hand than he has had in past meetings. Administration officials said they had succeeded in pushing a message of growth-oriented policies in the communiqué issued by the countries at the end of the meeting. The statement is usually more balanced between the virtues of growth and austerity."

Sorry I see no virtues on display here from the G7, just a moral void eager to suck the world into oblivion.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/17/world/asia/obama-close-to-calling-russian-action-in-ukraine-an-invasion.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

Posted by: Nana2007 | Nov 16, 2014 1:56:35 PM | 13

This is an interesting quote, from a Serbian fighting with the Novorussian forces.

Backs up my long held theory that the US has direct tactical control of (at least some) the Kiev forces.

"So I’ll be brief right now. I came to help our Orthodox brothers and fight against the NATO criminals who bombed our land, just as more than anyone they have saber-rattled and threatened to attack Crimea. I had forgotten then the fact that NATO and the countries supporting this organization are the usual cowards.

They can enter a conflict only where there’s the possibility of bombing from afar, if possible against 90% civilian targets to sow fear and panic.

So they haven’t directly participated, but their influence is clearly visible here. And so several American officers were wounded here. They weren’t in battle – they’re located a bit further from the frontline and explain how important it is to destroy civilian targets. I’ve heard this from more than one Ukrainian POW, with a multitude repeating the same words. "

http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com.au/2014/11/a-serbian-fighters-story.html

Posted by: Lisa Formally OldSkeptic | Nov 16, 2014 2:04:19 PM | 14

Yeah the isolation of the Russian Federation talk vis dangerous and smacks of tomfoolery. If the empire isolates Russia the empire is potentially isolating South America, Central Asia and China.

Btw, look what the bbig bad Russian Federation is up to.

Posted by: really | Nov 16, 2014 2:07:23 PM | 15

Nana@13 according to the FAZ

Ukraine-Krise auf G-20-Gipfel: Putin möchte lieber schlafen als weiterreden - Ausland - FAZ

Auch die übrigen Staatsoberhäupter blieben nicht bis zum Ende. Bundeskanzlerin Merkel reiste ebenfalls zeitig ab - wenige Minuten nach Putin.

Putin was not the only one to leave early, Merkel left also a few minutes later, as well as some other who are not named.

b is right, this is getting scary.

Posted by: Fran | Nov 16, 2014 2:27:26 PM | 16

b is right, this is getting scary.

But according to b's analysis, which I agree with by the way as it relates to the Western media painting a picture, Putin was not isolated, the "Free Press" just made it appear he was. So if he wasn't really isolated, then what's so "scary" about it?

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 2:45:37 PM | 17

Tony Abbott's motto is deeds not words

Posted by: Nana2007 | Nov 16, 2014 2:57:57 PM | 18

"... therefore tend to miscalculate in their assessments of global policies. This is dangerous as it often has bloody consequences."

This has been a consistent theme from the west. "Russia is aggressive (the new USSR/Nazi Germany/etc)" BUT "Russia is weak, isolated and a paper tiger".

This is a narrative that guarantees a showdown, which is why it is being pushed. There are many in the US who really want a showdown, economically and militarily and soon.

The consensus between the ‘hawks’ and ‘doves’ on strategy seems to be (IMHO):
(1)Separate Russia and Europe economically, which means the end of gas sales. This will crush the Russian economy and, they hope, provoke an oligarch overthrow of Putin and end democracy in Russia.
(2)Get the whole of the Ukraine into NATO and then take over Crimea (militarily if necessary). Make Sevastopol into a huge NATO base.

After that their ultimate wet dream is Russia, economically crushed and militarily humiliated, then breaking up into separate countries.

Posted by: Lisa Formally OldSkeptic | Nov 16, 2014 3:04:54 PM | 19

Note that the difference between the USS 'hawks' and 'doves' is that the 'doves' want Russia to be economically crushed first, before military operations.

The 'hawks' want NATO troops in Ukraine now (with the gas pipelines 'accidentally' being blown up no doubt) ....

Posted by: Lisa FOS | Nov 16, 2014 3:17:50 PM | 20

The Cold War 2.0 has started. Vladimir Putin is a target of regime change like just Syria and Iran since he refuses to kowtow to the Western Plutocrats. I was raised and lived through all of the first Cold War. That was a dangerous time but both sides more or less saw the world the same and the propaganda was somewhat based on reality. The goal of the USA was containment of communism.

Today is extraordinarily scary because the West has gone off its rocker and is pushing Russia into a shooting war with NATO which will inevitably end in WWIII. By ignoring climate change and fighting a forever war from the Ukraine to Somalia with government austerity at home, the only goal is to get rich and screw everyone else. No one gives a damn about the next generations’ future. The purpose of the news is to promote war and increase the corporate bottom line.

Today’s reporting in the West is no different than in Germany during WWII as their “victories” on the Eastern Front marched West, nearer to the homeland.

Posted by: VietnamVet | Nov 16, 2014 5:07:08 PM | 21

I thought I was living in some parallel universe, yesterday, when I was forced to watch the Australian (government funded) ABC news service. It was full of "Putin isolated" rubbish - lots about Putin leaving early but no mention that Merkel left only a few minutes later. Much about Russian responsibility for MH17 - the ABC has decided that the case is closed. "Awkward interactions between Putin and other world leaders" - but as b says if that was indeed the case it was only with a small group -maybe 5 eyes plus Japan. And then ABC criticizes Russian media for being biased!

Earlier today the ABC website had a photo of a demonstrator outside the G20 meeting holding a placard with a photo of Putin with the caption "Dr Evil" below it. Well if you read only Australian media that is the impression you would get. It seems to have pulled that at least.

Posted by: dinkyd | Nov 16, 2014 5:40:55 PM | 22

This video below shows exactly what is happening today and what will happen if west keeps on harassing Russia.

Fat kid beats up bully
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQNCgGCrf4k

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 16, 2014 5:54:25 PM | 23

Poroshenko talk tough on Russia
http://presstv.com/detail/2014/11/16/386313/i-am-not-afraid-of-war-with-russia/

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 16, 2014 6:01:50 PM | 24

@1
Try Holefield: he is the man!

Posted by: Scan | Nov 16, 2014 6:03:55 PM | 25

Poroshenko talk tough on Russia

http://presstv.com/detail/2014/11/16/386313/i-am-not-afraid-of war-with-russia/

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 16, 2014 6:01:50 PM | 24

What is Poroshenko smoking? That is crazy talk even if he has convinced himself that nato truly has his back, which when the rubber meets the road in the realm of reality, nato would never start a shooting war with the Russian Federation. To do such would be the beginning of the end of humans existence on the planet.

Posted by: really | Nov 16, 2014 6:50:32 PM | 26

Putin under attack by the MSM...who only confirm they arent free and independent
India Times -
Yahoo -
LA Times -
NY Times
Vice -
Reuters -
Guardian -
------
eve Vice proves its part of the network of establishment press linked to the power elites

Posted by: brian | Nov 16, 2014 9:15:22 PM | 27

and the MSM wonder why their readersship is falling

now is the time for alternatives
Mint Press News shared a link.
November 13 · Edited
Our editor in chief, Mnar Muhawesh, exposes how the media disenfranchises alternative voices like herself and Seymour Hersh on issues like Syria, and manipulates conflict narratives to drive public support for war. Full transcript ---> http://bit.ly/1B9fGG9

Posted by: brian | Nov 16, 2014 9:26:29 PM | 28

Posted by: Cold N Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:08:52 PM | 5

hes back and at his 'white mans burden' worst

Posted by: brian | Nov 16, 2014 9:34:20 PM | 29

@14 lisa and etc.. thanks for all those posts and viewpoint/s..

Posted by: james | Nov 16, 2014 10:15:16 PM | 30

Fareed Zakaria this morning talked about "even more" Russian military entering Ukraine... no evidence, no critical thinking... Just repeat the lie over and over and over. Goebbels was right...

One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. The bamboozle has captured us. Once you give a charlatan(s) power over you, you almost never get it back. --Carl Sagan

Posted by: chuckvw | Nov 16, 2014 10:22:49 PM | 31

@31

So true. The western msm is saturated with state dept. packaged "news". The msm has necome a govt. propaganda cesspool.

Posted by: really | Nov 17, 2014 12:33:38 AM | 32

Goebels was not quite right. Repeat the lie over and over, and it persists, yes, but eventually natural wisdom - which is innate and cannot be controlled - will add its voice.

"The bamboozle! The bamboozle!"

Do you see? We see ourselves, we see the lie in ourselves. The natural self-parsing action of life dissolves the lie. And so all evil is futile, given enough time. And if we live in short pieces of that time, I suggest that it still makes sense to fight for the eventual, eternal victor.

Posted by: Grieved | Nov 17, 2014 12:47:27 AM | 33

@ 2 @ joe100

Its actually worse than useless. MSM lies and propaganda have a kind negative value. They negate whatever they're added to and that's the whole point of it. I'm not much of a "punk rock" man. Post "post modernist" nihilism in general is no damn good. But no one ever had it more right than the Sex Pistols when they sang : "they made you a moron. Potential H-bomb"..

Posted by: nomas | Nov 17, 2014 1:42:52 AM | 34

It's becoming more and more unbelievable. This is from Today's ZEIT:

G-20-Gipfel: Putins Angst vor TTIP | ZEIT ONLINE

Der russische Präsident fürchtet das Freihandelsabkommen zwischen der EU und Amerika. Denn ein vereinter Westen könnte ihm die Stirn bieten.

Now they try to imply if you are against TIPP you are for Putin. I can only repeat my self, this becomes more and more scary. Especially since Poroschenko yesterday talked about *total war" and in a speach last night Gauck the German President called on the EU to unite behind Ukraina.

Posted by: Fran | Nov 17, 2014 2:58:57 AM | 35

Yep. President Gauck seems to be on a freedom tour in Bratislava, claiming Poroshenko as dissident freedom fighter - they have got no shame. Interestingly, Prague did not seem interested to host the venue.

Poroshenko got a different street reception in Bratislava.

Putin gave a full interview to tagesschau. Basically, it is a shift of the 1989 order. The solution is clear - an integrated economic zone between Russia and the EU. Of course, the TIPP complicates things.

Somehow, I don't think Russia is that interested in free trade.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 4:16:01 AM | 36

That display at the G-20 was quite something else. I expect more maturity out of the average 12 year old than what was observed in Brisbane by a few ostensibly adult pretenders. Not everything said there was a lie, but it surly was what they thought you wanted to hear, superbly abetted by the reporting media. The adults left early.

@ brian | 16 Nov 2014 9:34:20 PM | #29

He certainly is, with great gouts and billows of cheeto dust, but look, he's got new jammys with feeties. The tranquility of absence will be sorely missed. ;-P

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Nov 17, 2014 4:40:53 AM | 37

Poor Mexico, so far away from God,
so close to the United States of America

Posted by: astabada | Nov 17, 2014 4:51:09 AM | 38

Uh so now Poland (Germany did it some days ago) have expelled russians diplomats, what the hell is going on?

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 17, 2014 4:51:48 AM | 39

@Anonymous #39:

At least Germany only expelled one Russian diplomat. Poland expelled several.

Russia orders out Polish and German diplomats in tit-for-tat expulsions

If you are going to refer to news stories, you really should give a link. Despite Rufus's talk of barflies, this is a Web site, not a bar.

Posted by: Demian | Nov 17, 2014 5:56:59 AM | 40

More fun on strange German behaviour - by Anne Applebaum.

Merkel and her Cabinet are now caught in an odd trap. France and Italy are struggling to fix their weak economies. Britain is struggling to decide whether it wants to stay in Europe at all. There isn’t a strong EU foreign policy, in part because Germany hasn’t wanted to create one. This makes Merkel the de facto spokeswoman for Europe—as well as the chancellor of a Germany that doesn't want to be the spokesman for anything. How long can that paradox last?

On the viability of sanctions - Saxony's enterprises hit - the president of Saxony's small to middle enterprise association

«Wenn man politische Lösungen will, helfen Sanktionen nicht weiter», sagte Bunsen der Nachrichtenagentur dpa. «Aus unserer Sicht bringen sie gar nichts.» Sie nützten eher den Amerikanern und schadeten der heimischen Wirtschaft. Insbesondere die kleinteilige Wirtschaft in den neuen Bundesländern habe traditionell enge Beziehungen zur Ukraine und nach Russland. Der Verband vertritt etwa 1000 vorrangig kleinere Unternehmen mit 15 000 bis 20 000 Arbeitsplätzen.

This is Angela Merkel's core constituency in the "New Federal States".

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 6:14:36 AM | 41

Coldhead:

b is right, this is getting scary.

But according to b's analysis, which I agree with by the way as it relates to the Western media painting a picture, Putin was not isolated, the "Free Press" just made it appear he was. So if he wasn't really isolated, then what's so "scary" about it?


Umm... because, as your own quote says, "the 'Free Press' just made it appear he was..."? The MSM made it appear... Because the same MSM has the power to "make things appear" any way they like or are directed, to sheep-minded people, as demonstrated by you yourself.

Posted by: Petra | Nov 17, 2014 6:17:49 AM | 42

somebody:

Of course, the TIPP complicates things. Somehow, I don't think Russia is that interested in free trade.


You are aware, I hope, that TTIP has got nothing to do with free trade? The "removing trade barriers [that barely exist] is but a smokescreen for a pack of far more nefarious intentions behind it.


Posted by: Petra | Nov 17, 2014 6:27:28 AM | 43

Because the same MSM has the power to "make things appear" any way they like or are directed, to sheep-minded people, as demonstrated by you yourself.

But I take everything the MSM says with a grain of salt. I don't, unlike you and your friends here, go running to the opposition media, in this case Russian media, and use it as an objective authority for news and information. And you have the nerve to call me a sheep. I'm many things, granted, but sheep is not one of them. That label is reserved for you and your ilk who are a special kind of sheep — the kind that carry not only sweaters on their backs for their masters, but also water — and lots of it. Get lost. You don't have what it takes to challenge me. Russian propaganda trolls cannot detect nuance and subtlety, and you are no exception. You do know you look foolish when you try to decipher my message, don't you? Of course you don't otherwise you wouldn't look so foolish. My tact is intended to snuff Russian propagandist quail like you and your ilk out of the bush. Thanks for cooperating. If you want to reach the next pay grade, you'll have to get better. Right now you're pretty much a lowly propaganda spammer. It's a sad, sad...mad world as Charlie informed.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 6:30:08 AM | 44

@17: "So if he wasn't really isolated, then what's so "scary" about it?"

It's "scary" because the people who claim that Putin is "isolated" may delude themselves into thinking that - heh! look at this! - they are correct in that estimation; Putin is isolated, ergo, everyone will applaud us as/when we push him around.

It wouldn't be the first time that a propagandist comes to believe their own propaganda, and the history of such self-delusion is usually written in blood.

Lots and lots of blood.

Posted by: Johnboy | Nov 17, 2014 6:34:06 AM | 45

At least Germany only expelled one Russian diplomat. Poland expelled several.

Russia orders out Polish and German diplomats in tit-for-tat expulsions

If you are going to refer to news stories, you really should give a link. Despite Rufus's talk of barflies, this is a Web site, not a bar.

These half-hearted quarter measures for show are quite transparent when you give it just a cursory examination. If Poland and or Germany were even somewhat serious, they would have concomitantly recalled their diplomats from Russia when they gave the Russian diplomats the boot. But they didn't and that is very telling. Come on folks, you'll have to do better. Must I think of everything?

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 6:37:42 AM | 46

The "removing trade barriers [that barely exist] is but a smokescreen for a pack of far more nefarious intentions behind it.

Oooh — now that's scary. Let me guess, this "nefarious" has something to do with Reptilian Jewish Bankers and their proclivity to feast upon the toddling Goyim. It gives me the shivers just thinking about it. I don't think the lamb's blood painted over and around my windows and doors is enough to keep them out, do you?

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 6:42:40 AM | 47

Btw: It takes 319 people to move Putin around the G20 and his hotel were well aware of his "... mid-afternoon departure had been on the agenda the entire time." [... & Mexican First Lady Angelica Rivera needs her own large make-up mirror]

Link to story

Posted by: x | Nov 17, 2014 7:01:32 AM | 48

Posted by: Petra | Nov 17, 2014 6:27:28 AM | 43

Basically any agreement of this sort means local governments lose the control of trade regulations (already handed to the EU in the case of Germany). It also means they use control of protecting home industries by tariffs. So if your industry is non competitive you lose.

The list of US free trade agreements basically lists its economic backyard.

The TTIP would greatly help Germany's car manufacturers and they are an important part of this economy ... but not the only one. And Europe is very diverse. The TTIP has the potential to split Europe, just like Russian gas.

Anyway, buried in this Die Welt article is the following information:

Auch Außenminister Frank-Walter Steinmeier (SPD) sagte der "Welt am Sonntag": "Vielleicht müssten wir nach neuen Ansätzen suchen, die Anspannung im Verhältnis der EU zu Russland zu reduzieren." Ein solcher Ansatz könne sein, "Vertreter der EU und der Eurasischen Union zu ersten Kontakten zusammenzubringen", meinte Steinmeier: "Eine Begegnung beider Organisationen auf Augenhöhe könnte ein Beitrag zur Entkrampfung des Verhältnisses werden."

Brief translation: Germany proposes a meeting of EU and Eurasian Union representatives.

This was clear right from the start of the conflict. Now, who is responsible for all those dead people and destroyed property.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 7:21:59 AM | 49

The US has been meddling in Mexico for well over 150 years.

Among the more egregious examples: US marines' multiple month occupation of Veracruz in order to prevent a German freighter from landing ammunition to one side in the Mexican Civil War/Revolution - a move which was condemned by both sides of said conflict!

Do we really need to debate the effect the US has had on Central and South America - given the origin of the term "banana republic"?

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 17, 2014 7:40:26 AM | 50

total rubbish, here's a non western eyes view

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article40239.htm

also interesting to see what Putin said in his speech as he left about Ukraine:

"Frankly speaking, we are very concerned about any possible ethnic cleansings and Ukraine ending up as a neo-Nazi state. What are we supposed to think if people are bearing swastikas on their sleeves? Or what about the SS emblems that we see on the helmets of some military units now fighting in eastern Ukraine? If it is a civilised state, where are the authorities looking? At least they could get rid of this uniform, they could make the nationalists remove these emblems.
That is why we have fears that it may all end up this way. If it happens it would be a catastrophe for Ukraine and Ukrainian people.

Self-defence fighters, [who] were supposed to leave some of the towns they had surrounded [under the Minsk agreement still] haven’t left. Do you know why not? I will tell you plainly, this is no secret: because the people fighting against the Ukrainian army say, "These are our villages, we come from there. Our families and our loved ones live there. If we leave, nationalist battalions will come and kill everyone. We will not leave, you can kill us yourselves." You know, it is a difficult problem. Of course, we try to convince them, we talk, but when they say things like that, you know, there is not much that can be said in response."

Today there is fighting in eastern Ukraine. The Ukrainian central authorities have sent the armed forces there and they even use ballistic missiles. Does anybody speak about it? Not a single word. And what does it mean? What does it tell us? This points to the fact, that you want the Ukrainian central authorities to annihilate everyone there, all of their political foes and opponents. Is that what you want? We certainly don't. And we won't let it happen."

Posted by: johhny johhny | Nov 17, 2014 7:58:31 AM | 51

Do we really need to debate the effect the US has had on Central and South America - given the origin of the term "banana republic"?

In hindsight, the occupation of Veracruz in accordance with the Monroe Doctrine was a presciently brilliant success. Had America not meddled, Germany may well have gained a foothold in Mexico, and considering Hitler and his intentions, well, the Nazis would have been in America's backyard when they rose to power, and that would have made WWII even more tragic than it already was.

a move which was condemned by both sides of said conflict!

Too funny. As if a condemnation from "both sides" carries any weight or credibility. Hitler condemned D-Day. Condemnations of this sort, or any sort really, are empty and feckless gestures.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 8:09:45 AM | 52

Watch out, Coldy. A few decades from now, the US could very well turn into a Mexico with a winter.

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | Nov 17, 2014 8:22:50 AM | 53

Watch out, Coldy. A few decades from now, the US could very well turn into a Mexico with a winter.

Oh, no doubt — it's already more than half way there.

When that time finally arrives, America will be Russia. Thankfully, I'll be Six Feet Under.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 8:31:39 AM | 54

Bernhard, I have followed you for years, when I lived in Europe and now that I'm back in the belly of the beast. You have written hundreds of posts about the "stupid people in D.C." I get it and even got it before I started reading your excellent analyses.
However, I was watching the re-play of Putin's interview on Erste and the Gunther Jauck program, with the discussion following. The German defense minister reputed every issue in the interview, trying very hard to isolate Putin. I had to blink my eyes to make sure I was not listening to Madelyn Albright or Condalezza Rice or even Ptaki. She even said "we have to look forward, not backward" and denied any influence of neo-naziism in the Ukraine.
The intentions of the "stupid people in DC" are clear, they have never been subtle about them; but what about those of the people in Berlin, whose words are echos of those in DC. Could you do a post on the long and short term foreign policy intentions of EU-Germany as they differ from the US? Does Germany believe that Russia is so weak that they can risk a war in Ukraine? Are there really no economic consequences to Germany in sanctions and isolating Putin?

Posted by: mrd | Nov 17, 2014 10:13:57 AM | 55

Short video on the history of the G-20:

http://therealnews.com/t2/component/hwdvideoshare/viewvideo/78380

Posted by: ben | Nov 17, 2014 11:01:44 AM | 56

From last week on Putin's "isolation".....not!

http://www.truthdig.com/avbooth/item/american_sanctions_on_russia_backfire_as_putin_partners_with_china_20141114

Posted by: ben | Nov 17, 2014 11:32:36 AM | 57

Posted by: mrd | Nov 17, 2014 10:13:57 AM | 55

I watched the same. Apart from distancing herself from Putin's point of view she emphasized two points: There will be no break down of communications with Russia, we will keep talking. And, there is no military solution (she is the minister of defense).
In the discussion afterward there was said something very matter of factly in a half sentence by Putin's interviewer, and none of the guests contradicted it: Let's not talk about Russian troops in Ukraine, of course this is a geopolitical conflict, and of course there are US military advisers there, too.
The whole thing was very scripted. What they agreed on is that Putin has to be treated with respect. So it was a kind of roll back.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 11:59:49 AM | 58

@55 mrd.. thanks for that.. hopefully 'b' will be motivated to discuss this..

Posted by: james | Nov 17, 2014 1:16:36 PM | 59

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:44:17 PM | 12

"Herr KaltArscherBiss: Tear down this border!"

Posted by: Matt | Nov 17, 2014 1:31:50 PM | 60

Poll

The post-Communist developments since 1989 have not met the expectations of 54 percent of Czechs and 70 percent of Slovaks, according to a poll conducted by the Median polling institute for Czech Television and Slovak Television and Radio and released today.

German president Gauck - on his liberty tour - got an egg on his face in Prague. It probably was meant for the Czech president, however, he deserves it. He should stop pretending the time has stopped in 1989.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 2:25:11 PM | 61

The troll said: "In hindsight, the occupation of Veracruz in accordance with the Monroe Doctrine was a presciently brilliant success. Had America not meddled, Germany may well have gained a foothold in Mexico, and considering Hitler and his intentions, well, the Nazis would have been in America's backyard when they rose to power, and that would have made WWII even more tragic than it already was."

If by what you mean by hindsight - you really mean the sight of a horse's ass, then perhaps you are correct.

In reality, the rationale for that move was to ensure that Britain's naval oil sources - including Mexico - would not be interdicted as even the mercenary army which sat on the oil fields could hardly do both that and control port access in the midst of a civil war.

But keep on trucking with your inanities - they are as amusing as they are wrong.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 17, 2014 2:46:40 PM | 62

Good to have Cold Holefield back for one reason: You gotta admit the guy has good grammar.
He knows, for instance, that A skunk lifts its tail when it's cornered.

Posted by: Captain Cook | Nov 17, 2014 2:47:05 PM | 63

Not mention that the Australian PM, Tony Abbott, threatened to "shirt-front" Vladimir Putin... using a koala.

Posted by: Scan | Nov 17, 2014 3:18:53 PM | 64

the rationale for that move was to ensure that Britain's naval oil sources

My point is not about the rationale at the time, but the effect of the occupation well into the future, and if you think the occupation didn't fall under the auspices of the Monroe Doctrine, you're a bigger fool than I originally thought — and that's pretty damn big. America's meddling in Mexico, regardless of any example you contrarily provide, is the Monroe Doctrine in action. It's still ion effect and going strong today. I don't suspect it will change anytime soon.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 4:08:49 PM | 65

He knows, for instance, that A skunk lifts its tail when it's cornered.

I sure do — and Putin's tail is perfectly erect.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 17, 2014 4:10:39 PM | 66

Russophobia has become the new xenophobia of the Western elites...

Posted by: from Moscow wiith love | Nov 17, 2014 4:37:32 PM | 67

As b's stated, this stupid quest by western leaders to "isolate" Russia(whatever that means) is very dangerous and won't end well. With the media in the West all singing the same tune from the same sheet, one only wonders what these media organizations make of us average folks.. They must really believe we're all stupid!!!

I keep saying had the average Europeans known the true story behind the outbreak of WW1/WW2, NONE would've volunteered to fight because all were based on massive lies with massive media manipulation to boot. And millions died for what??? So we can attribute our "freedoms" to them???

Cold war 2.0's already begun. There seem to be no sane heads in European capital other than the ones that keep towing US state department bs lines. Poland has expelled some Russian diplomats and Germany's also done the same. What these stupid Eurocrats don't realize is that, when there's no-one to talk things out with, bullets,bombs, missiles fill in the vacuum.. If the current crop of European leaders really believe they can fool the masses into another war with Russia, then they're sorely mistaken.. The average European citizen don't give a f*ck about NATO or EU and will quite frankly like to live their lives peacefully.. Any open war against Russia will be an opportunity for Europeans to finish off their NATO puppet leaders who seem to bring them nothing but wars and more war.

Interesting times :)

Posted by: Zico | Nov 17, 2014 5:53:43 PM | 68

Putin is not going to let Russia become a US vassal. It's just not going to happen. Eurasia and the BRICS are becoming more powerful everyday. The US is going to regret not using soft power in a multi-polar world when it had the chance.
I guess we're going to see what people like McCain are really made off. We threaten and sanction Russia and they don't back down. Now what, tough empire guys? Are you going to make them? What are you going to do NATO?, with your show off drills?
The Empire and the west have no statesmen, just bloviating politicians. Diplomacy is a sign of weakness. Sure it is. What utter fools. Their act is becoming embarrassing and tiresome.
Pray these buffoons can fade out and somehow leave the planet intact.

Posted by: Kraken | Nov 17, 2014 6:21:35 PM | 69

The Saker has a post which compliments this one:

http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.ca/2014/11/the-anglozionist-empire-has-truly.html

(I pasted a bare link because if I use html, the comment gets blocked.) If you don't like the Saker, that post is still worth looking at, because the three articles linked to in the first paragraph (two by Pepe Escobar and one by Patrick L. Smith) are all worth reading.

@Fran #16:

It's interesting that the FAZ didn't take the line anglophone media did. Also, Merkel met with Putin for two hours. Hopefully these are signs of things to come.

As those three pieces indicate, the Anglosphere has absolutely nothing constructive to offer the rest of the world: just destruction and chaos.

Posted by: Demian | Nov 17, 2014 6:43:03 PM | 70

The Saker has a post which compliments this one. (The spam filter won't let me give the link; the title of the post is "The AngloZionist Empire has truly become an 'Empire of Illusions'".

(I pasted a bare link because if I use html, the comment gets blocked.) If you don't like the Saker, that post is still worth looking at, because the three articles linked to in the first paragraph (two by Pepe Escobar and one by Patrick L. Smith) are all worth reading.

@Fran #16:

It's interesting that the FAZ didn't take the line anglophone media did. Also, Merkel met with Putin for two hours. Hopefully these are signs of things to come.

As those three pieces indicate, the Anglosphere has absolutely nothing constructive to offer the rest of the world: just destruction and chaos.

Posted by: Demian | Nov 17, 2014 6:45:45 PM | 71

The mood in Germany is far from Cold War. See this Frankfurt am Main discussion featuring one guy lost in translation.

The media seems to work under conflicting orders. There was a round of "Putin lies" in Der Spiegel and FAZ when the important people were back in office on Monday and had had time for consultation.

5.6 million watches the Putin interview by Tagesschau. That is a lot in an active adult population of 60 to 70 million.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 17, 2014 7:12:48 PM | 72

Mexico is not a country. It's a dump. It's an embarrassment. But it is assuredly not a country despite protestations to the contrary.

I'll tell you what, Mexico, if you like Russia so much, send your immigrants to Russia and get your remittances from Oscar Putin rather than the creative and entrepreneurial Gringos immediately to your North. Mexico is a joke. Mexico is a slob and a whore. Mexico can kiss my ass. Mexico and Russia deserve each other, just not on the North American continent please.

Posted by: Cold N Holefield | Nov 16, 2014 1:08:52 PM | 5

Cold and hole in the head shows his (american) class.
maybe mexico will stop licking US ass and start kicking it!

Posted by: brian | Nov 17, 2014 8:02:49 PM | 73

Cold Horseshit stupid screed about Mexico is stupid.

Mexico is a killing fields because of US involvement, not despite of it. If the Mexicans COULD have a government responsive to its people a relationship with the BRICS (something the Mexican people are literally dying for), it would be a huge improvement.

But the USA, Cold Horsehit's Favorite Empire will not allow Mexico to have democracy.

Posted by: guest77 | Nov 17, 2014 10:10:41 PM | 74

What's amusing about the 'isolated' nonsense is the underlying reason for it.
Putin would probably agree that Russia was a basket case after its US-NATO funded and orchestrated humiliation and defeat in, and withdrawal from, Afghanistan. But the West's immodest ideologues, having declared Mission Accomplished, surrendered to their Schadenfreude gene and spent the next 2 decades congratulating themselves and each other - and took their eye off the ball.

That was enough time for Russia to reinvent itself. Putin and a reinvigorated Russia are the result. And the West's clever-dicks are having trouble digesting the fruits of their folly, knowing (but never admitting) that they have only themselves to blame.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Nov 17, 2014 10:48:08 PM | 75

@somebody #72:

In a recent poll, 81% of Germans said they have a negative view of the US, 14.4% said they have a positive one, and 4.6% didn't know what they think.

Posted by: Demian | Nov 17, 2014 11:05:29 PM | 76

must be tough being a german political leader, having to agree to the exceptional nations sanctions disaster agenda.. what goods does the financial establishment have on germany /europe to allow them to press their nuts in a vice and squeeze a 'yes' from them every time? it's really pathetic..

Posted by: james | Nov 18, 2014 12:12:52 AM | 77

The German US State Department propaganda outlet known as Der Spiegel is happily joining in with the demonization of Orbán:

Proteste in Ungarn: "Orbán, hau ab!"

Hungaria's premier Orbán is gradually driving his land from democracy in a direction of authoritarianism – but by no means without resistance. In more than 20 citiess, tens of thousands of people have taken to the streets.
Was that written in Hamburg, or in Foggy Bottom?

Posted by: Demian | Nov 18, 2014 1:00:51 AM | 78

surprise! guess what:
US ambassador identified "observing" the protests in Hungary. http://news.yahoo.com/us-hungary-envoy-under-fire-attending-protest-170811666.html
'Government spokesman Zoltan Kovacs said on Twitter that Goodfriend was not just observing but "influencing" the protest.

Tamas Deutsch, a lawmaker from Orban's Fidesz party, called the diplomat a "fifth-columnist CIA agent turned agent provocateur" in a Facebook post.;'
and:
'Goodfriend, who was not available for comment Tuesday, told journalists Friday that "negative trends" such as weakening of the rule of law and intimidation of civil society have "rapidly taken hold" in the EU member state'

US knows all about weakening the rule of law...they wrote the 'Colour Revolution for Dummies' handbook

Posted by: brian | Nov 18, 2014 2:54:39 AM | 79

Posted by: Demian | Nov 18, 2014 1:00:51 AM | 78

Czech Zeman had a problem, too. I guess, there are going to be sympathetically covered Eastern European mini color revolutions now against anyone in the EU opting for Putin.

There was a huge demonstration in Greece, too. I had to go to twitter and to Australia to find information on it.

Each year the demonstrators march to the US embassy for a protest to denounce the role US intelligence agents played in the military dictatorship's rise to power.

Our president Gauck missed this demonstration on his "freedom roadshow".

Size cannot have been the criteria for reporting - the Greek demonstration 30.000+ was similar/larger than the Hungarian one 10.000+

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 3:22:58 AM | 80

The state of the game in Eastern Europe - The Guardian

But anxiety about Orban’s tilt towards Moscow has brought ferocious criticism of his democracy record from the Americans who blacklisted six Hungarian government officials for alleged corruption last month, uniquely for an EU or Nato government.

“The Americans have been worried for a long time,” said a European ambassador in Budapest. “Now they are getting vocal.”

Angela Merkel is trying to sell the line that association with the EU is deliberate and no pressure is used. It is never a good sign when politicians assume their audience is stupid. Or, reality is completely different from what politicians say.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 3:58:36 AM | 81

Found it - Social Democrats are searching for life boats from Merkel's sinking foreign policy ship.

Platzeck fordert Annexion der Krim zu legalisieren

Der Vorsitzende des Deutsch-Russischen Forums, Matthias Platzeck (SPD), hat gefordert, die Annexion der Krim durch Russland zu legalisieren. "Die Annexion der Krim muss nachträglich völkerrechtlich geregelt werden, so dass sie für alle hinnehmbar ist", sagte Brandenburgs früherer Ministerpräsident der "Passauer Neuen Presse". "Da gibt es verschiedene Möglichkeiten. Dazu gehören finanzielle Leistungen, eine Wiederholung des Referendums unter Kontrolle der OSZE und Weiteres. Das müssen Kiew und Moskau aushandeln", sagte Platzeck. Auch die von prorussischen Separatisten kontrollierten Regionen in der Ostukraine würden wohl nicht zum ukrainischen Staat zurückkehren.

"Es ist momentan kaum vorstellbar, dass Donezk und Lugansk nach allem, was passiert ist, einfach wieder in den ukrainischen Staatsverband zurückkehren", sagte der frühere SPD-Vorsitzende.
Platzeck fordert den Westen auf, gegenüber Russlands Präsidenten Wladimir Putin nachzugeben. "Der Klügere gibt auch mal nach", sagte Platzeck demnach. "Was käme denn nach Putin, wenn der russische Präsident weg wäre? Sicher kein pro-europäischer Nachfolger, eher ein noch nationalistischerer Präsident. Wenn Russland als zweitgrößte Nuklearmacht der Welt aber politisch instabil würde, hätte das unabsehbare Folgen. Das wäre brandgefährlich!", sagte Platzeck. Er fordert: "Wir müssen also eine Lösung finden, bei der Putin nicht als Verlierer vom Feld geht."

Brief translation: Former Social Democrat Chairperson demands to find a way to recognize Russia's annexation of Crimea, for example by a repeat of the referendum by OSCE, or similar mechanisms. Eastern separatist controlled provinces would hardly want to return to Ukraine either after all that had happened. Platzek demands that the West gives in to Putin, asking what would be the result should Putin be removed. His successor would certainly be not more pro European but more nationalist. Should Russia, the second nuclear world power, drift into instability, the consequences would be more than dangerous. Platzeck demands that a solution be found where Putin does not have to leave the field as loser.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 4:33:50 AM | 82

In fact the isolated were the 5 who accuse Putin of being isolated: 4 of the 5 Eyes and the slant-eyed US puppet in Japan

Posted by: Dave S | Nov 18, 2014 7:16:40 AM | 83

somebody @ 72

Thank you for the Frankfurt link. Heartening to see a reasoned forum discussion. The American on the panel reminded me of the old saying, "if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, confound them with bulls***".

The value of this site is to see things like this you would otherwise miss.

Posted by: mrd | Nov 18, 2014 7:29:31 AM | 84

In a recent poll, 81% of Germans said they have a negative view of the US, 14.4% said they have a positive one, and 4.6% didn't know what they think.

Polls are funny things. Let's get in the Time Machine and travel back to Germany circa 1935.

In a recent poll, 81% of Germans said they have a negative view of the Jews, 14.4% said they have a positive one, and 4.6% didn't know what they think.


Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 18, 2014 8:15:24 AM | 85

Cold

I think this study will suit you fine.

Trolls on the internet often have mental issues.
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140217/05122426247/psychologists-internet-trolls-are-narcissistic-psychopathic-sadistic.shtml

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 18, 2014 8:52:55 AM | 86

The patriarch of Kiev - amazing Putin bashing, though he doesn’t name him.

With great regret I have to say now publicly that among the rulers of this world upon the fact of baptism, belonging to the Orthodox Church, appeared a real new Cain - not by name, but by deeds.

These matters indicate that the abovementioned governor as the first in the history fratricide Cain, came under the action of Satan. more at link.


http://cerkva.info/en/messages/5417-new-kain.html

As for Putin leaving early, other posters have pointed out he wasn’t the only one. Because the end of the meeting was breakfast on Sunday, who wants to put up with that? Possibly the breakfast was merely on the agenda for those who were leaving Sunday. Plus, he announced his departure beforehand. Diplomatically, there is nothing to write home about.

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 18, 2014 9:26:19 AM | 87

The troll said: "My point is not about the rationale at the time, but the effect of the occupation well into the future, and if you think the occupation didn't fall under the auspices of the Monroe Doctrine, you're a bigger fool than I originally thought — and that's pretty damn big. America's meddling in Mexico, regardless of any example you contrarily provide, is the Monroe Doctrine in action. It's still ion effect and going strong today. I don't suspect it will change anytime soon."

Unfortunately you continue to display hindsight as defined as equine posterior vision.

The Monroe Doctrine was to keep European powers from gaining influence in Central and South America - as in colonies and puppet regimes.

The Monroe Doctrine was not about keeping one European nation from being disadvantaged by another in said region.

Monroe was president of the United States exactly 1 term after the War of 1812. It is impossible to think that the Monroe Doctrine had anything whatsoever to do with helping Great Britain.

Once again, you demonstrate nothing of substance in an area I know well - which makes my suspicion that you know nothing of substance in other areas, stronger.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 18, 2014 9:28:34 AM | 88

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 18, 2014 9:26:19 AM | 87

Yep, they are pretty unrecognized by anybody else orthodox.

The church originated in 1992 after as a result of a schism between the Moscow Patriarchate and its former locum tenens, Metropolitan of Kiev and all Ukraine Filaret, when Filaret chose to convert his former see (of which he was head for more than two decades) into a Ukrainian autocephalous church, initially within the legal framework of the Russian Orthodox Church. The majority of the Ukrainian bishops refused to support him, and forced him to resign his position. Undeterred, Filaret, with support of the President of Ukraine, Leonid Kravchuk, initiated a merger with the canonically-unrecognised Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox Church. With the support of nationalist groups such as UNA-UNSO, the church fought for control over property. In response, almost all Ukrainian bishops called a sobor in Kharkiv, where they refused to follow Filaret, and ruled to defrock and anathemise him. However the union between the Western Ukrainian and diaspora clergy of the former UAOC and the now defrocked Russian Orthodox clergy who followed Filaret, became very fragile. And after the death of Patriarch Mstyslav in the summer of 1993, the union reached a breaking point causing the UAOC to terminate the union. After a brief leadership of Patriarch Volodomyr (Romaniuk), Filaret assumed the Patriarchal throne in autumn 1995.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 10:08:53 AM | 89

More informed journalism on Ukraine - Bavarian radio - in German.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 11:38:38 AM | 90

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 18, 2014 9:28:34 AM | 88

You fathead, are a moron and I won't discuss this with you any longer. It's obvious you're c1ueless.Pull your head out of your ass and get out and about and breath some fresh air if you can find any, you dope. Jesse — next you'll be telling up is down and black is white. Are you Dubya by any chance? He does the same thing.

Posted by: Cold N Holefield | Nov 18, 2014 12:00:29 PM | 91

Just stfu nato seriously
http://presstv.com/detail/2014/11/18/386551/nato-alarmed-by-russia-military-buildup/

Posted by: Anonymous | Nov 18, 2014 12:10:07 PM | 92

somebody 89 thx for the info.

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 18, 2014 1:09:24 PM | 93

The troll said: "You fathead, are a moron and I won't discuss this with you any longer. It's obvious you're c1ueless.Pull your head out of your ass and get out and about and breath some fresh air if you can find any, you dope. Jesse — next you'll be telling up is down and black is white. Are you Dubya by any chance? He does the same thing."

Pity your skin is so thin. Most people who are as uninformed, yet ideological as you are, are better disciplined.
Run off to hide under your bridge.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 18, 2014 2:28:32 PM | 94

The C1ueless Terrorist said : Pity your skin is so thin.

Pity your skull is so thick. There was a chance for you if you could have pulled your head out of your ass, but since your skull is so thick, it really doesn't matter. Keep it in there and keep proudly crapping out of your mouth and fingertips.

"day wudz jus helpin der frinds the bwitish." As if. Who are they helping now with their meddling, moron? Grow up you sophomoric maroon — that quote resembles your disposition.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 18, 2014 4:31:22 PM | 95

For posterity. The C1ueless Terrorist can believe what he likes.

ABC Pact (Alliance between Argentina, Brazil and Chile)

The US-Mexican Mediation as a Springboard to ABC

At the same time, the United States’ growing influence over the continent had sparked some new tensions. Military interventions under the Monroe Doctrine became more common. In April 1914, on the eve of WWI, the US occupation of Veracruz during the Mexican Revolution threatened continental peace. Argentinian and Chilean delegates, Rómulo S. Naón (1875-1941) and Eduardo Suárez Mujica (1859-1922), together with the Brazilian ambassador in Washington, Domício da Gama (1862-1925), quickly offered their mediation services to avoid a war. The three diplomats had seized the opportunity to increase their influence on the continent by showing excellent behavior on a diplomatic level. A conference was then set up at Niagara Falls from 18 May to 1 July 1914.

Against all odds, and despite somewhat unexpected results, the main goal was achieved: war was avoided. This mediation gave a new impulse to the ABC project by offering the South American states strong reasons to consider themselves credible internationals actors, or at least as counterweights to US continental hegemony.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 18, 2014 4:52:17 PM | 96

The Monroe Doctrine

5. The Monroe Doctrine in Practice: 20th Century

Continued Interventions

Though subsequent presidents spoke much less bluntly than Theodore Roosevelt had, the United States continued to intervene regularly in Latin America through the 1920s, and the Monroe Doctrine remained popular.

President Woodrow Wilson often articulated a moralistic program toward Latin America, renouncing conquest and expressing much concern over its economic progress. But he also projected a strong sense of superiority and intervened frequently in the affairs of Mexico when the people of that nation overthrew Porfirio Diaz, its long-time dictator in 1910. Wilson refused to accept Mexico’s new leader, Victoriano Huerta, and he occupied Vera Cruz when Huerta refused to apologize for arresting sailors from the United States who had gone ashore in Mexico. Substantial numbers of troops from the United States were soon deep in Mexico chasing Pancho Villa, a revolutionary leader whose raids sometimes crossed into the United States. Mexico must “take help if needed,” Wilson explained. Much of the public of the United States, troubled by the Mexican Revolution’s anti-clericalism and nationalization of foreign-owned businesses, agreed.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Nov 18, 2014 5:15:00 PM | 97

To Demian at 71 --

Here's the link to The AngloZionist Empire has truly become an "Empire of Illusions".

And while y'all are droppin' in on the Saker, you might like Paul Craig Roberts and Glenn Greenwald are right: Hillary is truly dangerous. Again, maybe not so much for the brief posting, but for the article links. I can't vouch for the Greenwald pc., but PCR is in fine form over at Counterpunch.

I've found these pcs. interesting. The West's Fatal Russia Mistakes: 1989-2014 over at Russia Insider, and via Fort Russ, Fighters from volunteer battalions bring weapons and chaos to Ukrainian home front. Another leading indicator of political violence by the "heroes of Maidan."

Posted by: rufus magister | Nov 18, 2014 6:33:45 PM | 98

Some media are creating a complete alternative universe - this here is Time magazine.

After a night spent debating the Ukraine crisis with the Russian President, German Chancellor Angela Merkel came out more determined than ever to push the Kremlin out of Eastern Europe ... Much more likely, the West’s ostracism will “foreclose” any remaining channels for swaying Putin through dialogue, adds Rojansky. But if Putin was searching for such a channel during his night of debating with Merkel, he has come up empty-handed. It’s not clear if he has anywhere else in the West to turn.

Fact is, the sanctions are self defeating. Germany can survive them as Russia can survive them, but they are in neither interest.

Posted by: somebody | Nov 18, 2014 7:25:31 PM | 99

cold has gone off his meds, lol.. might want to take a trip down to mexico as i hear the pharmaceutical companies don't have there tenterhooks on mexico like they do the land of the exceptionalists, lol..

Posted by: james | Nov 18, 2014 9:28:05 PM | 100

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