Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
June 07, 2014

Ukraine: Poroshenko's Hope For "Western" Help Is Deluded

This means a lot of trouble for the people in the Ukraine, east AND west:

Ukraine's new president Petro Poroshenko said his country would never give up Crimea and would not compromise on its path towards closer ties with Europe, spelling out a defiant message to Russia in his inaugural speech on Saturday.
...
Poroshenko stressed the need for a united Ukraine and the importance of ending the conflict that threatens to further split the country of 45 million people. He said it would not become a looser federalised state, as advocated by Russia.
...
Poroshenko's speech drew an ovation from guests at a ceremony attended by Lithuanian President Dalia Grybauskaite, U.S. Vice President Joe Biden and senior EU officials.

The Saker calls the speech a declaration of war. That may well be right.

Russia will need to tighten the screws a bit. Be polite at the outside, concede in public but make sure that Kiev will feel more and more pressure through secondary channels.

I doubt that the "west" will take any real risk over Ukraine or even put up enough money to save it from ruin. In the end Ukraine will be alone facing a rather angry bear. If Poroshenko, as it seems, thinks different, he is clearly deluded.

Posted by b on June 7, 2014 at 11:13 AM | Permalink

Comments
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You say, "I doubt that the "west" will take any real risk over Ukraine."

Even so, Putin must now prepare for war. This changes everything. Now Ukraine's leader has publicly stated his determination to seize Crimea. He didn't make this claim without consulting Washington. In fact, that's where the order must have come from.

Any hostility directed at Crimea will lead to a swift escalation. Moscow must announce how it will respond at the UN so that everyone is on the same page.

Putin might not be able to avoid war after all.

Posted by: plantman | Jun 7, 2014 11:22:16 AM | 1

yes that poroshenko is crazy and wont stop the killings is obvious, but these statements about crimea etc is just empty threats imo. Although the nutjob in Georgia attacked Russia..

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 7, 2014 11:29:11 AM | 2

Poroshenko's speech is just a bluff and a quest for legitimacy in the eyes of the EU and USA and some of his desperate population.
He is a shrewd business man, he needs all the money he can get from his new found allies. Therefore he has to say what they want to hear.

Once he gets the money then he will surely change his tone. He can't afford the continuation of a civil war that may destroy Ukraine. NATO will never get involved in any military confrontation with Russia.
Poroshenko has no choice than to turn to Poutine for everything else than money. The EU and the USA are here for that. So he is exploiting them all. Poutine knows that very well and will deal with it as shrewdly while idealist Europe and naive USA will discover it later. While they all backed down from the disaster of the regime-change they executed in Libya, they wont be able to back down so easily from their responsibility in Ukraine.
Poroshenko's Ukraine will be a new burden to ailing Europe.

Posted by: Virgile | Jun 7, 2014 11:36:56 AM | 3

If things go even more pear-shaped from now on
at least Poroshenko does have another country
to run "home" to.Israel.

PS Who is he to tell what language his fellow countrymen
are supposed to use.

Posted by: chris m | Jun 7, 2014 11:52:21 AM | 4

thanks b. b quote "In the end Ukraine will be alone facing a rather angry bear."

i think this is a good summation, but i think ukraine is being led to believe differently. they are being encouraged to maintain a defiant stance towards russia by being given financial support for military conflict.. too bad they don't seem interested in anything other then resolving their problems with a military solution. maybe they think the usa is there friend? that has to be the height of stupidity..

Posted by: james | Jun 7, 2014 11:56:33 AM | 5

Anonymous...I don't agree that "Poroshenko's speech is just a bluff and a quest for legitimacy in the eyes of the EU and USA."

Poroshenko is a US stooge who says what he is told to say by his handlers.

And why would he be bluffing?

The US wants escalation, in fact, it cannot achieve its goal of deploying NATO without escalation. Here's how it works: If killing civilians in the East doesn't work, then they'll burn them alive in Odessa. If that doesn't work, they'll bomb schools, orphanages, hospitals etc.

It doesn't stop until the US gets the reaction it wants, which is retaliation from Putin.
These guys don't give up. They never give up.

Posted by: plantman | Jun 7, 2014 12:07:35 PM | 6

Posted by: plantman | Jun 7, 2014 12:07:35 PM | 6

Yep, Amerikas cycle-0-paths win and the citizens of the Ukraine lose.

Posted by: jo6pac | Jun 7, 2014 12:35:46 PM | 7

retribution is coming..."Let noble fury boil up like a wave, the Peoples'War is going on!"...so says the lyric to the song "The Sacred War"...probably the most moving music of WW2...listen to it!

Posted by: bfrakes | Jun 7, 2014 12:37:13 PM | 8

Let's just add this shit to the list of US-driven propagandistic nonsense along the lines of Assad must step down, this here's a red line bitches, Iran has nukes, Israel is a beacon of democracy blah blah blah that and all the other shit that the US minions are forced to mouth for more cash/power.

Members of the Billionaire Elite are called upon to say the stoopidest fucking things everyday here in the US and 9 times out of 10 they're simply just mouthing crap meant to propagandistically frame the faux "debates/discussions" for the chattering classes as they disseminate information to the peons.

Now that Poro has staked out the "insane" cop stance the US will look more "reasonable/good cop" when they propose their own "rational" alternatives which will obviously include the murder/maiming/displacement/endangerment of many innocent people just not on as large of a scale as the original Poro "solution".

Again, this shit happens daily here in the US. Some member of the elite will say something totally fucking crazy with no chance of the idea being implemented but it is consciously said anyways to make the ensuing seemingly less fucking crazy ideas seem more rational.

Example:

Crazy fucker (insane cop): I want to gas every US citizen over 65 because they are a drain on our resources!!

Peons: That's fucking crazy!!!

Crazy fucker's associate (saner cop): That gas idea IS crazy. Instead, I rationally propose that we just totally eliminate Social Security and Medicare instead!

Peons: How reasonable!!!Thank God cooler heads prevailed!!!

So, instead of retaking Crimea like Poro says the US war criminals can now - just riffing here - state something like:

While we think engaging in active combat over Crimea is an untenable solution we will compromise and put a forward NATO base outside of Kiev where US troops will train the fledgling democrats on our latest missile defense system.

Peons: Whew! At least we avoided at hot war! Obama, you so 11 dimensional!!Hillary 2016!!!

So while it's obviously still not a good thing for Ukraine and the innocent people involved I believe this is just the war criminal elite setting - once again - the stage for what's really to come.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Jun 7, 2014 12:55:45 PM | 9

Adding:

Instead of this "just not on as large of a scale as the original Poro "solution" I would change it to read:

"just not on as BLATANT as the original Poro "solution"

The US war criminal elite have ZERO compunctions against how many people they kill/main/threaten/endanger they just would rather do it sneaky-like if at all possible.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Jun 7, 2014 1:02:03 PM | 10

Those are just words from Poroshenko. No one would expect him declare that Crimea was no longer part of Ukraine. To this day Georgia has not conceded S. Ossetia and Abkhasia, but we all know that they will never be part of Georgia.

Right now, Poro has to put together a new government. If he wants to accomplish anything he will have to get rid of the Svoboda Party and Right Sector people. It is not clear how the neo-nazis will react to that development. One problem Poro has with calling an immediate cease fire is that all of the neo-nazi fighters in eastern Ukraine would return to Kiev. Now that would be a problem for him. If a peaceful and negotiated solution is his goal he has to worry about the reactions in western Ukraine and well and the east.

Posted by: ToivoS | Jun 7, 2014 1:02:53 PM | 11

For those familiar with the American superstition regarding the groundhog, Mr. Poroshenko has seen his shadow and the world will see a continuation of this war.

Posted by: Bob In Portland | Jun 7, 2014 1:12:04 PM | 12

@11 ToivoS

Thanks for bringing some sanity to these hysterical postings. The chocolate oligarch is what he is and his bluster is without substance at this point. Sounds like he uses the same speechwriter as Kerry doesn't it? If he does not end the killings his reign will be short.

The reality on the ground is that each civilian death in eastern Ukraine and each piece of the area's infrastructure destroyed makes real civil war that much more likely. The average Ukrainian's traditional passivity is being ripped from them bit by bit and they are starting to get really pissed off. Hardball starts soon. Military intervention by Russia gets closer by the day as well, but on Putin's terms, not the western puppet-masters'. Note that just as the Ukrainians are getting angrier, so are the Russian citizens. The media is beating the war drums in Russia and Putin's support is unwavering. Only idiots would believe that Putin is weak. Even Europeans are waking up. Only America sleeps on.

God Bless the Ukrainian people in their fight against the psychopaths in Washington and Brussels.

Posted by: TicoTiger | Jun 7, 2014 1:50:57 PM | 13

Russia will have to intervene now.. Putin has done a good job walking a fine line dealing with this disaster that's been forced on him, but his recent happy talk WRT petro-dollarshenko is now obviously, delusional. I suggest it would be wise for Russia to prepare for a massive attack. Say nothing to her scumbag "partners" in NATO, and launch a massive surprise attack, putting all nuclear forces on condition-1 full alert, get the bombers launched, etc.,etc., tell the US if they so much as twitch toward eastern Europe that its all over, and take back 80% of Ukraine including Kiev. Leave a rump state in the westernmost region as a buffer and to drive the most rabidly Russophobic, pro-NATO populations into, like a garbage can. Then put the lid on it.

Posted by: Marc | Jun 7, 2014 2:00:20 PM | 14

The IMF said that the current conditions attached to the loans are based on a scenario maintaining Ukraine's territorial integrity and specifically on a strong central government (i.e. no federalization). If this scenario changes, then a new set of conditions - likely more draconian - will be imposed. That is probably what is driving Poroshenko's rhetoric.

Right Sector strength: sources close to journalist Robert Parry said the hasty recognition of the coup regime last February was based on a need to stabilize a government lest the Right Sector take over entirely. A Frankenstein monster enabled by the West, and probably beyond control still. Confirmation of the report that Right Sector militia was being trained in Poland last September will establish whether this mess has been improvised or plotted.

Posted by: jayc | Jun 7, 2014 2:03:45 PM | 15

The Candyman's statement on E Ukraine was to be expected and his belligerence on Crimea is a hollow threat strictly for local consumption. The real news is that Putin is closing the Russian border with E Ukraine to strangle the flow of arms and support to the insurgents. Russia already has sufficient troops in Crimea to deter any move by Kiev.

I think that the people who expect Putin to rescue the People's Republics in E Ukraine may be disappointed when he stands by while their ability to resist is degraded. This seems to be the preferred outcome Putin seeks to return Oligarch control to all of Ukraine.

Posted by: Wayoutwest | Jun 7, 2014 2:05:37 PM | 16

@wayout @16

There's a lot to be said for that take on Russia v Putin's response. His problem is that he has to deal with domestic pressure to attack and the fact that its not going to stop here. The US has all but declared war on Russia.However it works out Oligarchs will rule Ukraine, as they did before the US created mess and as they do now.

Posted by: Marc | Jun 7, 2014 2:11:56 PM | 17

@TovioS - There is absolutely zero chance that the US would advise PP to ditch Svoboda. In fact, I would guess that Svoboda is far and away the US favorite on the political scene, and that the US will most certainly work to expanding the popularity and reach of this party at least to stand as the weak, but major, opposition to the oligarchs. As they have already done - the Svoboda name itself fits US ideological worldview for the region, Svoboda follows better than anyone the US "politics of history" message, is most violently opposed to Russia of the parties. Right Sektor, I believe, is too much of an unpredictable quantity for the US, and in any case are not a "party" like Svoboda is (Svoboda is a real political party with a platform, TV adds, and local and presidential candidates. Right Sektor is little more than a paramilitary outfit). Anyway - if you actually think there is any chance that the US would try and eliminate them, you are sadly mistaken. Watch for them to grow under US tutelage.

About Ukraine support among the diaspora: I saw in the East Village, NYC (an area that once held a large Ukrainian population, and still retains much of the infrastructure - ethnic banks, fairs, national homes and benevolence societies), a large wall mural of images and support for Maidan, especially the deaths of the "heavenly hundred" purportedly at the hands of the government, despite all the evidence to the contrary. There is even a poster: "Ukraine Freedom met with Russian war and imperialism". It is all very sad. The fight in the Ukraine is being portrayed in the US less as an international political concern, and more as a sports match (an event Americans can really get their heads around) with teams to support unquestioningly, slogans to be screamed, and colors to be paraded. This is how this reversion to fascism and extreme nationalism plays itself out in the US and likely Canada as well. It would be interesting to look into the history of the East Village Ukrainian population - was it bred of White exiles, Banderists, Soviet-emigrees? I don't know, but would be interesting to find out.

OT: There is a very interesting film called "Master of the Universe" by a German named Marc Bauder that I suggest people see if they have a chance. In the spirit of a film like "Fog of War" it is the soliloquy/interview with a German banker. Like McNamara in "Fog of War" he doesn't come off as sympathetic as clearly he still doesn't know the full effect of what his deeds have wrought and has benefitted mightily, but you do get an interesting inside view of how ego and the drive to make money from nothing destroys both an individual and a society. The interview is filmed inside a deserted office tower in Frankfurt, and sort follows him through his career. He discusses the advent of computerized trading and how it works, the Gulf War, the effect on his personality and his family, the Asian Financial Crisis, and of course the recent world crisis we are still in.

One interesting tidbit - he notes how at a certain point, it was some American bankers who brought computer trading to Germany and trained their banks in "financial innovation". Knowing what we know about the connections between Wall Street, the CIA, and what we see now in the collapse of the EU, it is definitely opens up avenues of investigation.

Some quotes:

"The bigger the shit [a bank makes], the thicker the Corporate Social Responsibility reports it puts out."

"There are those who have an interest in the collapse of the EU, the profit potential is enormous"

"Only a simpleton believes markets can learn... people are like lemmings... this crisis was not enough to wake people up - you hear just 'okay, what's next'"

"We pretend that the markets are the will of god but there is no such thing as the market. People make decisions. That's it. If the bank executives said 'okay, everyone who is still shorting Spain, Ireland, Greece, or Italy by next week will be fired' it would end. Just like that."

I have no idea how big this film is in Germany, here it is playing at a very small, non-profit theater.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 7, 2014 2:19:31 PM | 18

@TovioS - Where I said: In fact, I would guess that Svoboda is far and away the US favorite on the political scene I want to be sure this is understood as secondary to the oligarchs. First order of business is business. But Svoboda is, ideologically, the key political party for fostering Ukrainian nationalism and obstinacy and the fight against Russia - without which, oligarchical rule would be impossible (see the USA for how the nexus of radical right and business parties works...)

@TicoTiger: You say: The average Ukrainian's traditional passivity is being ripped from them bit by bit and they are starting to get really pissed off. Hardball starts soon. Military intervention by Russia gets closer by the day as well, but on Putin's terms, not the western puppet-masters'. Note that just as the Ukrainians are getting angrier, so are the Russian citizens.

But is it not possible that this is the plan? If we can look at recent US tactics in Syria, Libya and Iraq, then we should see the same attempts to pit societies against one another for the purposes of inflicting heavy damage on potential adversaries all while keeping ones hands out the the dirt (the same thing we witnessed on the Eastern Front during the Second World War?).

What evidence is there that the US doesn't want to foster major tensions between Ukraine and Russia - up to and through a military confrontation?

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 7, 2014 2:28:45 PM | 19

In a way it's almost irrelevant what Poroshenko says right now. After all, he has no real natural allies to protect him from any of those he'd have to take action against in order to actually bring about meaningful progress within Ukraine that would benefit the Ukrainian people. He apparently is not going to be able to disarm and neutralize the Right Sector killers or their leaders in the junta government, nor the Svoboda Nazi gang under Tyanbok, nor will he be able to protect himself against the "Fatherland Party' mafia of Tymoshenko and Yatsenuk should he turn more directly against them. Any one of these groups would kill him in a nanosecond if he didn't allow them to continue dong what they're doing.

It's by no means clear the Poroshenko could command the loyalty of the Ukrainina military either, or indeed whether that military is even sufficiently cohesive in a way where a 'chain of command' process would work on the scale necessary to purge the volunteer 'National Guard' of the Right Sector murderers and other belligerents and actually do some of the work of removing the criminals who hijacked the government in the first place from that government.

Poroshenko's closest natural ally seems to be the somewhat smarter steel empire oligarch Akmetov. (I say somewhat smarter because at least Akhmetov had the good sense not to run for political office.) I suspect Akhmetov understands though that if Poroshenko follows the line he toed in his inaugural speech that things will go to shit in Ukraine very quickly and Poroshenko himself will not last very long. But Akhmetov will also realize, I believe, that if the assaults of Eastern Ukraine from Kiev under Poroshenko continue for more than the next few months, (lets say until the mid term elections in the US in November), then by that time not only will the devastating hardships imposed by the conditional requirements attached to the IMF/EU loans be devastating in their effect on the people across the entire Ukraine, if at that time the Russians do decide to move to stop the violence by Kiev against the broader citizenry in the East, they will be widely seen as liberators rather than aggressors.

So if Akhmetov is smart enough he will not side with Poroshenko if he keeps to the Western scheme. Akhmetov will understand it will lead to him losing his entire empire.

In my view Ukraine is screwed anyway for the foreseeable future. I do figure though that Poroshenko has already had his 15 minutes of fame and it's all downhill for him now. I'll be amazed if he's still in power by the end of this year. (I do hope that if he is killed that at least it's not the result of a successful US-engineered false flag operation designed to pin the blame for it on the Russians.

Posted by: Stephen J | Jun 7, 2014 2:32:44 PM | 20

@ tico @ 13


I just read every comment and I don't see any "hysteria"... ?

Posted by: Marc | Jun 7, 2014 2:35:31 PM | 21

@guest77 #18:

I agree with you about the USG and Svoboda. As I said before, I don't think Poroshenko has the power to change the (hunta) cabinet. However, he did say in his speech that parliamentary elections should be held soon so that parliament reflects the new mood of the people (something to that effect, anyway). I'm not sure what he means by that. Svoboda has done poorly in elections, and that goes for the Svoboda candidate in the recent presidential election. A parliamentary election should give Poroshenko the opportunity to form a new cabinet, one with no fashists in important positions, if that is what Poroshenko wants. He's a billionaire and can always go to Israel, as someone observed above, so it's still not clear to me that he is going to be a US puppet. However, my impression is that even if he wanted to, he can't change "policy" from what the junta has been doing until new parliamentary elections.

Russian media are not taking as stark a view of Poroshenko's speech as the Saker. For the moment it seems, Poroshenko's election and now inauguration has changed nothing.

Thanks for the recommendation of Master of the Universe.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 7, 2014 2:59:50 PM | 22

I suspect that a lot of anti-tank and anti-aircraft weaponry are crossing the Russian border to Donetsk these days. and I don't see many ethnic Russians voluntarily surrendering to the national guard units.

I wonder how long the regular Ukrainian can hold together before units begin switching sides.

Posted by: Bob In Portland | Jun 7, 2014 3:25:55 PM | 23

regular Ukrainian army

Posted by: Bob In Portland | Jun 7, 2014 3:26:37 PM | 24

Guest77. I am assuming that Poro is sincere in his statements calling for the end of the war. If that is correct, then Svoboda members have to be removed from the government. My assumption is based on very little other than Putin's words encouraging him in that direction. As Demian points out, even if Poro wants to end the fighting, will he be able to? I do not know. What was encouraging is that the Svoboda candidate was crushed in the recent election.

Posted by: ToivoS | Jun 7, 2014 3:40:13 PM | 25

Predictable. Poroshenko is just reading from the script that he has been handed by his US handlers.

I repeat for the nth time. This is it, the west (well the US) is going for Russia full steam. The neo-cons are fully in charge now.

There is going to be no backing down from them. There is only the low probability (at least in the short term) of a split with the EU (especially Germany), but don't hold your breath, the satraps there are well under control and will all quite happily sacrifice their countries.

The first priority of the US is to get NATO troops into the Ukraine, this will happen in July.
The second, will be to create a rational to impose full (Iran like) sanctions on Russia. The fact that blocking the biggest oil producer in the world from world markets will raise oil price to infinity and wreck everyone's economy seems to escape them. And of course blocking gas to the EU, which will end it.

The powers that be within the US believe this is the right time to take down Russia and China.
It is based on a set of fantasies, but no one has ever accused them of being fact oriented ('an empire that creates it's own reality....' and all that).

First fantasy is that many in the 'Verseille on the Potomac' actually believe the hype about the gas and oil available from fracking and the US is not just going to become self sufficient soon, but will become an oil/gas exporter. The fact that this 'boom' is just ending (as was predicted) won't sink through for ages.

Two, most dangerous. They actually believe in their land and seas based anti-missile systems. That they will actually work.
Again this has been debunked by experts so many times now it is not funny.
But they believe they will work and thus feel quite confident about a nuclear showdown with Russia and China and even that they can 'win' such a war with a first strike.

Three, there is a creeping panic within the 'Von on the P' that US dominance is slipping and it needs to be asserted now in a big way to ensure the 'America Century'. Previously the neo-cons (and they are all neo-cons now) thought that 'smashing some shitty country every 10 years...' would be sufficient to keep everyone in line. Since that has abysmally failed, they have now moved on to taking on the big boys directly. This is not just 'doubling up', this is increasing their bet by orders of magnitude.

Combine these three fantasies (plus various more minor ones) and you have this recipe for disaster.

In July (appropriate month) NATO troops will be in the Ukraine for exercises. What do you want to bet they never leave...?
How long until NATO troops are used to put down the Eastern Ukrainians?

Now, where are all those old plans for nuclear shelters again?

Posted by: oldskeptic | Jun 7, 2014 3:49:20 PM | 26

Should screen print those comments now thinking poroshenko is a peace dove or something. Ridiculous.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 7, 2014 4:07:32 PM | 27

Pushkov: Program Poroshenko similar statements Yatsenyuk

"The head of the state Duma Committee on international Affairs Alexei Pushkov called voiced by the President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko programme on crisis management in the country is similar to the statements of the Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk, appointed by the Verkhovna Rada on this post after the coup d'etat.

"The program Poroshenko: federalization " no; Russian as a state - no; Crimea - Ukrainian; policy of the European Union. B General Yatsenyuk N2," wrote Pushkov in his microblog on Twitter."

Doubtful Poroshenko will be any different than the other western puppets in the Ukraine since it's still the same puppet masters pulling the strings. The western bankster's destabilization of Russia and China must go on. Can't allow their dollar to lose primacy.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 4:16:55 PM | 28

The insanity cannot be hidden. Ukraine will be partitioned. The Yugoslavia break up plays out again. Except this time, ethnic Russians are being killed by Nazis and Russia possesses nuclear weapons. At best, Europeans will freeze when the gas is cut off or, at worst; the world suffers a nuclear winter. Clearly the Western Overlords don’t give a damn about the blood of the dead on their hands.

Neo-liberal Financiers have purchased control of Western politicians. Ther ruling ideology is “greed is good”. Ukraine has new resources to be seized and marketed. If Russia is destabilized again; all the better. The second ideology at play that supports the neo-liberal land grab is the neo-conservative hatred of Russia. Add in the war profiteers and psychopaths, and a bloody cauldron is being stirred by the neo-conservatives, with one intention, to get Russia to invade Ukraine to justify a nuclear first strike.

Rather than incinerate Wall Street, City of London and Frankfurt; hopefully, the financial crooks will join with General Martin Dempsey and try halt a First Strike on Russia. But, as tensions soar, our existence will be threatened by the Air Force True Believers who may get it into their heads to start the End of Days, or by frontline officers in the shooting war between NATO and Russia, when overrun by the enemy, ignites their tactical nuclear weapons.

Unless the people re-seize control of their governments, we will never live in peace again and mankind may destroy the earth.

Posted by: VietnamVet | Jun 7, 2014 4:20:25 PM | 29

OT, but indicative of the institutionally corrupt nature of the fascist west, with which the normal people in the Ukraine and Syria are faced with confronting.

DEA blackmailed doctors with ties to medical marijuana – reports

"The Drug Enforcement Administration allegedly threatened doctors associated with medical marijuana dispensaries in Massachusetts, telling them they would lose their federal license to dispense medications unless they severed ties with marijuana companies.

At least three doctors told The Boston Globe and MassLive.com that DEA agents visited their homes or offices with ultimatums. The alleged visits highlight tension between federal law, which prohibits the use of marijuana, and various state laws that have allowed the sale and use of medical and non-medicinal marijuana. Massachusetts voters agreed to allow medical use of marijuana in the state in 2012.

Dr. Samuel Mazza, on the board of a medical marijuana dispensary, told the Globe that he found multiple messages on his answering machine and a DEA business card on his home door upon returning from vacation in February.

“You either give up your [DEA] license or give up your position on the board ... or you challenge it in court," Mazza, chief executive of Debilitating Medical Conditions Treatment Centers, said DEA investigator Gregory Kelly told him upon making contact.

Mazza’s Debilitating Medical Conditions Treatment Centers was one of first 20 dispensaries to receive preliminary state approval to open a medical marijuana firm. He relinquished his prescription license since, he said, it wasn’t required for his part-time job conducting surgery at a Veterans Affairs hospital.

Yet the Globe found two other doctors that had given up their positions on boards of medical marijuana operations."

Many think the Drug Enforcement Administration exists to combat the illegal drug traffic. It's real role is that of enforcement for the drug mafia's monopolies of the illegal drug business. This kind of hypocritical corruption is endemic to the western establishment. It's not just the cynical fascism=democracy garbage used to sell their war crimes, it is the basis of everything they do and say. It is the essence of their existence.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 4:48:47 PM | 30

East, west Ukraine at odds over country’s future – Gallup poll — RT News

The difference in opinion between residents of eastern and western Ukraine is wide, with people in these regions having opposing views on the conflict in their country and who is the culprit, says the latest poll by Gallup.

Interesting, that this has not been published in the Western media, despite the polls being done by Gallup.

Posted by: Fran | Jun 7, 2014 5:29:27 PM | 31

OK, this is so Iraq. They are following the same old tired path and they are going to keep escalating, no matter what Russia does. Even if it surrenders totally they will still escalate.

West: make absurd demands on a country. If they actually meet them, then lie that they haven't. If they don't (say because they are impossible) then escalate. Make more 'demands' .. lie more ...escalate.

I now suspect that, just as in the case for war with Iraq where the decision had been made months before, that the decision to attack Russia has been made. And just like Iraq this is just shadow boxing and preparing the people and getting their propaganda and military forces lined up.

This is SOP. Seen it in Afghanistan (hand over BL or else ..ok we will hand him over...you haven't agreed to hand him over ..... invade). Iraq (get rid of your WMD... ok done ... you haven't got rid of your WMD ... invade) and Lybia and Syria.

Now it is Russia's turn (expect more absurd 'demands'):

http://www.haaretz.com/news/world/1.597235
"President Obama and British Prime Minister David Cameron laid down new markers for Russia on Thursday, giving Moscow a month to meet their conditions in Ukraine or face further sanctions.

The new thresholds for action were spelled out at a joint press conference, following a Group of Seven world leader summit that was rearranged to exclude Russian President Vladimir Putin after his aggressive moves in Ukraine. The United States and Europe also have imposed economic sanctions in response.

To avoid even harsher sanctions, Cameron said, Putin must meet three conditions: Recognize Petro Poroshenko's election as the new leader in Kiev; stop arms from crossing the border; and cease support for pro-Russian separatist groups concentrated in eastern Ukraine.

"If these things don't happen, then sectoral sanctions will follow," Cameron said, standing before a row of United States and British flags. "The next month will be vital in judging if President Putin has taken these steps. And that is what I will urge President Putin to do when I meet him later today"

Russia had better make sure its nuclear forces are full alert in case of a first strike. If you hear a report about a Russian ballistic missile sub being destroyed (or going missing) then we are only hours away from nuclear war. That will be the first target and UK and US attack subs will be going full on to find and set themselves up to destroy them.

So watch the movements of the RN & USN nuclear attack subs, if they all suddenly leave their ports ... we are a day or two away from the big one. Also the movements of UK and US ballistic missile subs, they will move into close position for a first strike. Again if they all disappear then it will be very close.

Posted by: oldskeptic | Jun 7, 2014 5:32:46 PM | 32

Ukrainian punitive has blocked a shipment of medical supplies for the wounded in Slavyansk and Kramatorsk

"Trampling on basic principles of international humanitarian law, Ukrainian punitive blocked the supply of medicines surrounded Slavyansk and Kramatorsk.

"We had worked out the scheme of delivery of health care in these cities, however, people cannot obtain them. Kiev "cut" the supply of the drug and narcotic drugs for narcosis in these communities," - reports "Russian newspaper" the statement of Vice-Premier DND Andrei Purgina.

Having a tremendous advantage in firepower, the number and types of weapons, the junta could not take it by force heroically fighting Slavyansk and Kramatorsk. In the last days it became clear that Kiev is ready to go on dishonest methods of dealing with these cities: bombed the power plant, in the hope of chemical poisoning of inhabitants bombed chemical plant, blockade medical supplies for the wounded."

Remarkably similar to the way Israel terrorizes the Palestinians in Gaza. This is how the cowardly fascists in the west fight wars.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 5:47:52 PM | 33

вот так over at the Saker posted some Slavophile nonsense:

Many argue about whether it is necessary to divide the former Ukraine, or whether it can be preserved, provided that Bandero-fascism is destroyed

Ukraine should be divided into Federal Novorossia and the Federal Ukraine. Because most of the residents of the West and centre of the former Ukrainian wish the European future, and South and East - see their future with Russia. And this split is based on civilizational, cultural, ethnic, and eventually economic components. The basis of today's events in Donbas is the clash of the civilizations of the West and Russian civilization.

What utter rubbish. European civilization is a continuum: from the Anglo-Saxons, to the French, to the Germans, and finally ending with the Russians (to mention just the most significant elements). Russia is part of European civilization; the US is not.

Most of us know that "the basis of today's event in Donbas" is Russia's refusal to submit to the Empire. And if there is a "civilizational clash" here, it is not between Europe and Russia, but between continental Europe and Anglo-American imperialism. The "West" does not signify Europe; it is a euphemism for Atlanticism (i.e., the Empire).

Alexander Dugin's point, that Europe west of Russia is hopelessly decadent and a mere colony of the US, so that only Russia can save European civilization, is an entirely different matter.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 7, 2014 5:53:59 PM | 34

@plantman

"And why would he be bluffing?"

Poroshenko is a shrewd businessman, not a US stooge. He is bluffing because he is making the USA and the EU believe that he can provoke Russia into a fatal bad move (invasion) or make Russia loose Ukraine for good.

Poroshenko (and Ukraine) needs Russia more than they needs the West. He is playing a double game. Putin knows it and plays along. The West is naive and it will pay a heavy price in euros.
The stooges are the EU...

Posted by: Virgile | Jun 7, 2014 5:54:58 PM | 35

@Virgile #35:

Not only is Porshenko a businessman: as a businessman, he is not crazy, which Uki fascists most definitely are. The rational thing for Ukraine to do, especially if Novorossia does not split from it, is to steer a course between the EU and Russia. I'm pretty sure that Poroshenko understands this; the Bandera-fascists don't because they are crazy.

As Putin suggested, we will have to wait and see how effective Poroshenko is going to be in restoring some sanity to the Uki government.

BTW, a Saker comment said that someone from Right Sector speaking live on Yuki radio said that Right Sector has given Poroshenko "his own army", and that parliament should be dissolved soon. The president needing his own army just shows how broken the Uki state is. Not sure what to make of the dissolving parliament bit, especially coming from Right Sector. Do they really think a new parliament after elections are held would be much different? (I expect there to be a lot of international monitors.)

@Fran #31:

Interesting poll. It indicates what previous polls have indicated: either most west Ukrainians are Banderites, or they have been totally brainwashed by Uki TV.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 7, 2014 6:46:45 PM | 36

The idea that the US. and NATO risk nuclear war over Ukraine is absurd. And as far as conventional war risks go, the US military is used to fighting third world nations at minimal cost in casualties. I doubt if its army could long sustain truly heavy human and material losses.

Amid all the D day propaganda, the current Volunteer US military.would not dare to undertake any aggressive operation against a strong opponent that could give as good as it getting unless national survival was at stake.

Posted by: Andoheb | Jun 7, 2014 7:23:25 PM | 37

Thanks to a comment at the Saker, a new interview with Strelkov, along with a translation.

Strelkov has the view of many here that Poroshenko is not interested in stopping the military assault on the people of Ukraine:

Q: Poroshenko promised Putin that, in the nearest future, the war will be either brought to an end or suspended, in some manner. In your opinion, what did he mean when he said this?

A: I believe that what he meant is that the Ukrainian army will steamroll over the entire Donbass region, will eliminate all those who rose up against the illegitimate Kiev government, all those who rebelled against the discrimination directed against the Russian people, and that, in this manner, he would bring the war to an end. I think this is what he had in mind. An oligarch who sponsored the so-called “Maidan,” who made the most warlike claims and adopted extreme positions while still a Presidential candidate, who is a puppet controlled directly by the United States of America, this oligarch cannot change who he is in one day or one night. Of course, what he means is that he plans to “impose order” with an iron fist, the fist of his punitive forces.

The Uki forces know that they cannot gain control over territory, so they just shell indiscriminately from afar:

With respect to international law and norms, they never cared for them on bit. For example, here they use cluster bombs and similar [illegal] weapons. They shoot, and, as you correctly pointed out, remove entire township from the face of the Earth. They shell cities. They will continue in this manner with ever-increasing [brutality]. This is because they experience no material opposition [to what they do]. They have no other tactic. They are unable to take up their weapons and go on attack, go storm our positions face-to-face with us, despite their profound numerical advantage in troops. As soon as their infantry faces direct combat, it retreats. They retreat even if supported by tanks. They abandon their tanks and retreat. They understand that their infantry is not combat-worthy. Their only option is to shell us from afar, again and again and again, and hope to inflict the greatest possible destruction.

A very high quality translation IMO, especially considering that the interview only appeared today.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 7, 2014 8:15:45 PM | 38

Remember the Ukrainian nazi general roasted, along with more than a dozen others, in that helicopter flamed by the Novorossia self-defense forces? It seems there were American war criminals amongst the fried passengers.

Cybercapture opened the computer assistant to the Chairman of the Ukrainian Gestapo Nalyvaychenko

"We, United #Kiberopolcheniem Donetsk, Lugansk and Kharkiv regions, continue to the people's war against fashistvuuschego of oligarchs and Kiev henchmen.

We managed to get access to the personal computer of one of the assistants of the Chairman of the Ukrainian Gestapo VA Nalyvaychenko.

As a result of the action we've got the document that reveals some details of the destruction of the filth Kulchytsky.

Obviously, we are talking about some foreign specialists, who accompanied the fascist General. These people how to perform security functions, and to advise the commander on conducting a punitive operation in the regions of Novorossia.

Of particular interest is a text document with addresses. From the title of the document, we assume that this address to send copies of letters or its analogues in content.

More detailed information will be posted here:" http://vk.com/novorossiya_cyber_riot

Includes screen shots of the nazi's computer of the items described, along with his "desktop".

BTW, another ranking western nazi military puppet has been neutralized (so sad):

In Artemovsk shot the car of the commander of a tank base

"Today, unknown persons shot BMW, which was the commander of the military unit Uladzimir Chobitok. The incident occurred in the area of the store "Ranok+". Chobitok wounded, but alive. Eyewitnesses reported three dead and one wounded.

In the city traumatology confirmed that they received one patient with a serious wound, which is operating - doctors are fighting for his life. The rest are in surgery, the official information on the number of wounded to find out yet.

According to Ukrainian sources, the car belonged to the Artemovskiy militia and among them are killed. The attack may be connected with today's attempt nazvanii to take the city. Attack of the Ukrainian guards was repulsed. Information is improved."

In the Ukraine, better than a no-fly zone, is good military intelligence. ;)

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 9:33:22 PM | 39

Kiev Regime Abandons Ukraine-Russian Border Checkpoints: Russia Controls Borders. Parts of East Ukraine Are De Facto “Integrated” into Russian Federation

"Ukraine’s central government, located in Kiev, has given up manning the country’s border with Russia at areas in the southeast where popular opposition to the Kiev authorities has overwhelmed the Kiev government’s ability to police the border there.

The central government’s border guards at the town of Severniy abandoned their post, on Thursday June 5th, so that now anyone can cross unimpeded there to and from Ukraine and Russia. This will enable Ukrainians who want to flee to do so, and it will also permit Russians who want to join the rebellion in Ukraine’s southeast (or simply to protect family-members who live there) to do so, with no difficulty on either side, and with no fear at the border-crossing.

This abandonment was reported by Agence France Presse. Russia’s Itar-Tass News Agency reported in more detail, saying that the decision was made by Ukraine’s central government and had broader scope than just Severny:

“‘To prevent the emergence of threats to the population’s life or health as a result of dangerous events taking place in certain areas, the cabinet [in Kiev, in the northwest] agreed with the State Border Service’s proposal to stop the operation of checkpoints,’ the government press service said in a press release on Thursday.”

Itar-Tass went on, to mention that Severny was one of a total of six abandoned border-crossings:

“In Ukraine’s Lugansk region, the operation of the following checkpoints has been stopped: Dolzhansky, Chervonopartizansk, Krasnaya Mogila, Novoborovtsy and Severny. In the Donetsk region, the Marinovka checkpoint will be closed. The Ukrainian government has instructed the Foreign Ministry to inform Russia about the decision.”

The significance of this event is that it cedes control of the border there to Russia.

The Kiev government has been using helicopter and jet sorties into the region, and bombs, to persuade the residents that they will have to give up their opposition, in order to stay alive; but a lot more airpower will have to be devoted to that task than the Kiev government currently has at its command. On 14 April 2014, Reuters reported “U.S. Is Considering Arms to Ukraine.” However, for the U.S. to send weapons in any public way would be detrimental to America’s ability to persuade its European allies that the government that was installed in Ukraine in late February has democratic legitimacy, especially after the May 2nd massacre that took place in Odessa.

The IMF (International Monetary Fund) has told the authorities in Kiev that putting down the rebellion will be a prerequisite to continuation of financial support for the deeply indebted government.

So, the current leader in Kiev, President Petro Poroshenko, has his work cut out for him — by the IMF, if not by the U.S. or anyone else."

I've read elsewhere that currently 200km of the border between Novarossia and Russia is deloused. Russia says now they closed the border on their side... ;)

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 9:50:47 PM | 40

A little truth about the junta's punitive operation slips through in the Western media, sort of:
CNN: 'It's hell down there:' Inside the battle for eastern Ukraine

Now there is a sense of purpose among the units newly deployed, and a greater readiness to use heavy armor. Throughout an extensive tour of the Slovyansk area, the crump of artillery and boom of tankfire sounded periodically.

But the targeting is sometimes puzzling.

Krasny Liman is a town of some 20,000 people and a major railway junction. But one of its two hospitals is in ruins, struck repeatedly by what appeared to have been mortars or shells. There was also evidence of strafing from the air. A tearful nurse approached us, saying that whoever had done this was not human. She -- and others -- thought Ukrainian forces were responsible, but they could not be sure. Patients had been evacuated, but one middle-aged man sat listlessly on a bench outside. He had nowhere to go, he told us; a doctor came past once a day to give him an injection.

The targeting is only "puzzling" to the reporter because his editors will not let him reach the obvious conclusion that the junta is composed of fascists who have no compunction about bombing their own people, hoping to terrorize them into submission.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 8, 2014 12:25:05 AM | 41

b is spot on.
Poroshenko seems to have become infected with a very debilitating bout of Sakashvili-itis. He must have forgotten that US-NATO has NEVER launched a military assault on an entity which can shoot back.
And never will.
Poroshenko should phone Sakashvili and find out how bad Sakashvili-itis gets before the recovery phase sets in.
That's a joke. Sakashvili-itis is incurable and can only be successfully 'managed' by emergency intervention from Dr Vladimir Putin.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jun 8, 2014 1:22:35 AM | 42

@ Vietnam Vet @ 29

I agree, fully except maybe not so much about the lust for Nuclear war. Not that our finance capital overlords and their drooling political servant aren't morally capable and intellectually deficient enough to try it, but they know that even under best case circumstances those ABM weapons cannot take out long range, hi-altitude ICMBs, they cant take out Russian Super Sonic bombers (they have 100 or so) and they cant hope to take out Sub launched ICBM's That said, WW1 started by accident.. As for taking over we have to do it...and it aint gonna happen "at the ballot box", or with each of us pursuing our own separate "rational self interest". A working class revolution is the only way forward that doesn't end in Armageddon. Capitalism has proven beyong a shadow that it can.not. limit itself. It "will not abide any limits". Infinite "growth" on a finite world is running into the inevitable barriers. That leaves 99.5 % of us living sweating bleeding and dying to support the .5% in the lifestyle to which they have become accustomed , or Socialism.

Posted by: Marc | Jun 8, 2014 1:34:22 AM | 43

@ Marc #43

It does seem that all other avenues dead-end except the coming global war fought on class - the poor against the rich, and to the death because that's precisely what the rich have in mind for the poor. And we are all poor now.

That said, I keep trying to figure how to fight. What the US has revealed with Ukraine, to its ultimate fatal disadvantage, is its amazing control of the media. If the media told even a ragged semblance of the truth, the US ruling class couldn't get away with any of the actions it takes. If there is a way to fight against this media "foreign occupation" then everything else will follow automatically from the ordinary instincts of the American people, who are actually not stupid, simply propagandized to accept a certain narrative.

Posted by: Grieved | Jun 8, 2014 2:01:32 AM | 44

b

Consider that, in 2009, HRH Clinton (and UKs Milliband) unilaterally grifted Hamid Karzai with $5 BILLION lifted from US Humanitarian Aid to Afghanistan, and deposited it directly into his Bank of Kabul, as open bribe, in plain view, for Hajigak's vast iron and coking coal reserves, to counter the Chinese $3B bribe for Aynak's vast copper reserves.

Not an eyebrow was raised when Clinton flew to Kabul for no particular purpose five times, then announced her $-35MILLION bankrupt presidential campaign fund has been paid off by 'anonymous donors'.

Nor did anyone raise an eyebrow when HRH had to fly back to Kabul and grift Hamid with $3.5 BILLION more, (after he lost the $5 BILLION in Dubai R/E scams as so many have), to stave off collapse of the Bank of Kabul, and have an audit that would reveal what was already apparent to anyone with one good eye.

Kerry-Koch, Nuland, and Poroshenko are all from the same Tribe. Kerry-Koch has already pledged American financial aid. Do you really believe they can't skank another $5 BILLION out the State vault, in plain view, without a single word in the MSM? Of course they can!

This is the Time of Great Looting.

Karzai gifted the Hajigak lease to India. Hillary blew $8.5 BILLION for nothing, although, she did manage to skim $85MILLION off for herself, so, all in all, I guess it was worth it.

Posted by: chip nikh | Jun 8, 2014 2:01:46 AM | 45

Russian Spring

Slavyansk.

Strelkov:

“Artemovsk” has goten away so far. No doubt, upon a “beaten track” trouble will come back. Again, the enemy blasts “Semenovka”. A bit later, supposedly, they become more bountiful to hit the downtown.

Strelkov:

A trouble has come where was less expected… precisely, was expected but hoped not imminent – because reserves are bust. The opponent is taking over “Artemovsk”. They battle our tiny (smaller than in “Red Liman”) garrison. Have raided our rear. Now, the supply route will be cut.

Alright kamarads (comrades). Have to find a way out of the situation. And this one is grave.


Russian Spring

Slavyansk.

Strelkov:

In brief:

Trough yesterday, artillery and mortars pounded “Semenovka” as well as “Cherevkovka”. Same is going through today. Afternoon and night they pounded the downtown – some 20 of 152mm shells. Casualties among the combatants and locals. We retaliate from mortars toward “Karachun” and their block-posts; our reconnaissance group destroyed 2 “KAMAZs” (truck) with infantry. Clobbered an unmanned aircraft over “Nikolaevka”.

Our troops twice attacked opponent positions – “Bilbasovka” and “Kombikormovy”. But Ukrainians dispatched tank detachments everywhere, consequently, defeating any position without massive losses unachievable.

Towards “Red Liman”, our detachment took 3 POWs of 93rd brigade. The soldiers (1 contractor, 2 conscripts), what they say, do not want to fight, but officers and “National Guards” force them.

Question: Pilots of the shot down AN-306 (reconnaissance plane).

Strelkov:

Would you believe, no smallest regret. Thank these cool pals, the enemy fire has become principally more accurate. They hovered over l-o-ng time. Conscientiously…

Comment: In a video interview, Strelkov pointed a) Need of adequate hardware; b) Figure of Poroshenko to mobilize even more into the struggle; c) The conflict to consume the entire Republic; d) Russia to intervene to save Republic’s infrastructure from destruction.

Posted by: Fete | Jun 8, 2014 2:10:19 AM | 46

Something weird just happened on Facebook. Someone commented on two posts on the Truth about Ukraine FB page, and posted screenshots showing interesting documents. An hour later the user account is removed and the content is inaccessible.

Facebook however has a strange way censoring itself: if you click on the thumbnail of the deleted image, it is displayed for about 1/10 of a second until it is replaced by a notice saying that "This content is currently unavailable". You can try out these two links and see if you can see the screenshots.

https://www.facebook.com/TruthfromUkraine/posts/1508662749357072
https://www.facebook.com/TruthfromUkraine/photos/a.1482868135269867.1073741831.1452285018328179/1508669776023036/

There are two ways of extracting the information from deleted images:

1) Take a photo of your computer screen at just the right moment. (Press slowly, the image opens when you release the mouse button.)
2) Save the whole Facebook web page (option "Webpage, Complete") on Google Chrome. You must however remember to first click to open the image, as this refreshes the browser cache with the high resolution image. The screenshots I manage to download are about 70 kB in size and 960x720 pixels.

I will not be disclosing or discussing the the content here, other than noting that the number originally reported - 2 = number later confirmed.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 2:53:25 AM | 47

Update on Facebook censorship:
Facebook has a really funny way of blocking users and their content: You can still see it if you are NOT logged in! (Also, some random users seem to be able to see the content.)

Here are links to the two interesting posts: (should work if you are not logged in to Facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=257373844466095&set=p.257373844466095 (duplicate)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=257374227799390&set=p.257374227799390

Direct links to documents: (should work for everyone)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/t1.0-9/10440921_257373844466095_9184043951576776325_n.jpg (duplicate)
https://scontent-b-mad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/10417666_257374227799390_8215159422124820070_n.jpg

In case you are interested in the leaker / poster / spammer, here is a link to one of his older posts. (should work if you are not logged in to Facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/hans.richardt.3/posts/255800791290067

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 4:38:47 AM | 48

The full story here: (Found using Google Image Search)

Anonymous Email Leak From Security Service Of Ukraine To Derek Chollet (Sec Of Defense Asst) Proves Major US Involvement In Ukraine
Email Leak From Security Service Of Ukraine To Derek Chollet (Dept Of Defense) Proves Major US Involvement In Ukraine?

Original:

Full Control CyberGuerrilla – June 4, 2014

We, United #KiberOpolchenie Donetsk, Luhansk and Kharkiv regions, continue the people's war against the fascist oligarchs and their henchmen Kiev.
We managed to get access to a personal computer, one of the Assistant Chairman of Ukrainian Gestapo VA Nalivaychenko.
As a result of the action at our disposal got a document that reveals some details of destruction Kulchytskyy filth.
Obviously, we are talking about some foreign experts, accompanied fascist general. These people could, how to perform security functions, and advise with respect to the general conduct punitive operations in the regions of New Russia.
Of particular interest is a text document with addresses. Based on the title of the document, we assume that it is - the address for mailing copies of the letter or its analogues content.
For more information, we will lay out here: http://vk.com/novorossiya_cyber_riot

***

First it was 14, then it was 12, now it is "more than a dozen people":

Obituary: Major General Serhiy Kulchytsky – BBC, 29 May 2014

Major General Serhiy Kulchytsky, who led the combat training department in Ukraine's National Guard, was among more than a dozen people killed when pro-Russian separatists shot down a military helicopter near the eastern Ukrainian town of Sloviansk.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 4:57:03 AM | 49

Petri Krohn

So ukraine security forces, would send an actual letter to the US? Is that really how its done by diplomats?

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 5:41:46 AM | 50

I just spend two weeks travelling through Russia and talking to all kinds of people. Among them two very good journalists. I also follow the news in Russian, English and German. I believe a deal is in place. What Poro spouts is the usual post election rubbish. The reality is like that:
- Russia is tightening the screws on the separatists. They are starting to control the border.
- Obama has given the Russians what they wanted: no NATO for Ukraine in the foreseeable future.
- Whatever the US might want, France and Germany are thoroughly fed up. They will not countenance any more bullshit versus Russia as long as there´s no outrage like an invsaion of Ukraine
- Reading the speech of Poro carefully he concedes federalization in practise but not in name. (Regional elections and Russian as second language)
Only problem is on the ground. The war starts in the head and from I heard from people makes me fear that there have been pssions aroused that will not be that easy to quell

Posted by: Tom | Jun 8, 2014 5:50:29 AM | 51

i used to be quite enamored of putin as the hoped-for savior of the remnants of europe but after seeing the stonehearted betrayal of donbass, i've come around 180 degrees, my contempt for him driven by events on the ground.

donbass is history, its brave but futile resistance thing of the past, rebels will be rounded up in fema inspired gulags.

the smooth judo-zen master of long term strategy is nothing but a witless coward shivering in his foxhole.

a visual stunt pulled off before fervently hoping and wishing worldwide audience just as with obama prior to his first term when the world swooned in a rancid love-fest.

day by day, the talmudic serpent tightens its coils around russia, they own even the black sea now, soon russia's navy will be bottled up in sevastopol, unable to sail out without explicit permission by nato.

it hurts to say all of this but the scales must come off eyes at some point.

putin deserves talmudic punishment: to be boiled in pussy riot's menstrual junk, but i think he's already made his deal and will retire on bahamas with yeltsin and gorbachev as neighbors.

insha'allah that my eyes lie but to the families of needlessly sacrificed martyrs, it will be a poor consolation if kremlin's waiting game ultimately pays off.

Posted by: lobro | Jun 8, 2014 6:04:34 AM | 52

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 4:57:03 AM | 49

You can find the same info in "Posted by: scalawag | Jun 7, 2014 9:33:22 PM | 39"

Note the 3 addresses listed.

1600 Tysons Boulevard
Suite 1140
McLean, VA 22102

Is corp. HQ of Academi.

7685 Siempre Viva Road
San Diego, CA 92154

Academi southwest div.

79 New London Road
Salem, CT 06420

Is Academi northeast div.

http://academi.com/pages/about-us/contact-us/general

Sounds like it was Academi mercs that got charbroiled.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 8, 2014 7:08:52 AM | 53

I just read at Voice of Russia that Hollande, Merkel, and Putin cornered Poroshenko (in a hallway, without US participation) and spelled out some very explicit consequences if Poroshenko continues down his current path. The article says that Putin:
"...told Poroshenko about the consequences of trying to continue his current policy. The consequences will be very dire and painful: Russia will rescind the current zero-tariff policy for Ukrainian exports to Russia, therefore ruining most of the country's export potential and sources of hard currency. Moreover, there are five to six million Ukrainians working in Russia and sending money home, helping shore up Ukraine's economy. Those millions of people are likely to be sent home, dealing another crippling blow to the national economy and creating a huge mass of angry and unemployed people who will hate Poroshenko."

It sounds as if Merkel and Hollande may have, temporarily at least, grown a set.

Read more: http://voiceofrussia.com/2014_06_08/Poroshenko-at-crossroads-Ukraine-has-to-decide-who-to-side-with-US-or-Russia-Europe-9589/

Posted by: madisolation | Jun 8, 2014 7:38:15 AM | 54

guest77 @ 18, just a minor remark, Pravy Sektor, yes, is a blanket paramilitary association. But it registered itself as a party some time ago (don’t recall, before Feb.) The coup Gvmt nominated after 21 Feb includes: Serhiy Kvit, Minister of Science and Education, and Dmitri Boulatov, Minister of Youth and Sport, Pravy Sektor. (Interesting choice of slots for them!) Svoboda got the Vice-Premiership, the Minister of Defense, the Secretary of the National Council of Security and Defense (although this person has belonged to other parties in the past and may not be a formal member of Svoboda, idk), the Minister of Ecology, and the Minister of Agriculture. Plus the post of (Main) Public Prosecutor.

One interesting fact about the coup Gvmt. is that almost all of its members come from the Far West and Kiev (city) with a few from Central Ukr and iirc ony 2 or 3 from the East.

Well, that is history in a way ... Svoboda has always done very badly in elections and polls (except in very circumscribed districts.)

We will see. And I’m not quite sure Svoboda are sorta the US favorites, though your arguments are good!

thx for the film recommendation.

Posted by: Noirette | Jun 8, 2014 7:39:06 AM | 55

@34

Thank you for your level headedness. This 'War of Civilizations' nonsense is ridiculous whether its the NeoCons or Slavophiles talking about it.

If anything the war is the "War of Neoliberalism vs Eurasian State Capitalism" or "Empire vs Anyone who is at all Independent of Empire".

I mean, its not like Syria is part of that so-called 'War Against Russian Civilisation'. And it cant be one against muslim civilisation either considering how many muslim puppet states the Empire has.

Posted by: Massinissa | Jun 8, 2014 7:57:26 AM | 56

@52

You realize that using the term 'talmudic' makes people dismiss everything you say as nonsense?

Though, it probably is nonsense.

Posted by: Massinissa | Jun 8, 2014 7:59:21 AM | 57

I watched the F interview of Putin + vid of the ‘meet‘ in France.

Putin is very nervous, I’ve never seen him this rattled.

Poro is playing to the gallery. Recall, too, that Ukr. public political speech is often outrageous, even violent, and then quickly forgotten. Still I was surprised he mentioned Crimea, that was over the top? (I haven’t read the speech yet, only posts...)

It seems the intentions of the US-W and Kiev are crystal clear:

The Eastern separatists are simply to be eliminated at all costs.

That is the plan, and it is a logical follow-up to all the previous events.

Putin knows this, for a long time one supposes. Plus, it is perfectly evident in the ‘conditions‘ he ‘must‘ meet before ‘more sanctions’, etc.

How one figures Putin will react or not depends on one’s overall view:

a) The recent events in Ukr. are the pre-cursors of a desired proxy war between the US and Russia, with the EU as poodle, Ukr. as pigeon, or better, sacrificial lamb.

b) What we see is a conflict internal to the Ukr. (not just E vs. W, in its ethnic/ideological composition, but internal oligarch struggles for economic and therefore political control) in which outsiders have taken sides, partly because they were appealed to, then providing some minimal support, dragged in by various forces.

c) Tout le monde navigue à vue. All the actors are steering ship with their eyes only, various factions want different results, chaos.

Not mutually exclusive, many shades in-between or in combination exist.

As I favor b) and c) while realizing that certain factions are bent on a), mho is still that Putin will not take the bait, will temporize / delay as much as possible, and will not intervene with big guns (e.g. ground invasion.) An *optimistic* reading.

It is terrible news for the Ukrainians, and not only those in the Donbas. It makes me sick, and I blame the EU idiots and cowards most of all. > insert unprintable rage.

Posted by: Noirette | Jun 8, 2014 9:04:20 AM | 58

You know things are dire when...

European anti-crisis strategy: Sex, drugs, alcohol could boost economic growth

"European governments are turning their attention to prostitution, drugs and contraband as possible ways of boosting their economic growth profiles, as they struggle away from their debt crises, AFP reports.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 8, 2014 9:12:53 AM | 59

@scalawag #53 – Sounds like it was Academi mercs that got charbroiled.

Do Ukrainian generals need Academi mercs as bodyguards? I am sure Ukrainian presidents do – both "acting" and "elected". The regular soldiers in their clumsiness might accidentally stab them with bayonets.

I just do not think these people were doing the normal "bodyguard" business like American mercenaries usually do. More likely they were military "advisers" directing the operation. Why else would SBU chief Nalyvaychenko write a letter of condolences to Derek Chollet in the US Deparment of Defense? I guess the high-ranking US officers were temporarily transferred to Academi payroll, so the US government would have the necessary deniability.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 9:18:59 AM | 60

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jun 8, 2014 9:18:59 AM | 60

"I guess the high-ranking US officers were temporarily transferred to Academi payroll, so the US government would have the necessary deniability."

Very possible. They've done that before.

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 8, 2014 9:25:17 AM | 61

@madisolation
Interesting link

It seems that it is not Russia that's getting isolated, but the US and UK
(what Ukraine wants doesnt seem to count)

(PS Wheres Cameron and Hague, they dont like being kept out of the picture,
while rest of EU (read Germany and others) go around making decisions?

Posted by: chris m | Jun 8, 2014 9:26:15 AM | 62

Ah too bad he didnt of mistake made a shot..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1sT9r9mU2M

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 9:52:09 AM | 63

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 9:52:09 AM | 63

"Ah too bad he didnt of mistake made a shot.."

Ah, but he did:

What really happened

Posted by: scalawag | Jun 8, 2014 10:40:11 AM | 64

Now that the new chief oligarch has been installed as president, it was time to clear Maidan of its formerly heroic protestors:

The Kyiv mayor's office on Khreshchatyk 36 was cleaned of the Maidan activists living in it in an infinitely cynical way. The Nazis have a rich experience worked out in the Odessa Khatyn; nevertheless, it was difficult to expect that they would use it against their former revolutionary allies.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 8, 2014 10:57:39 AM | 65

I watched the F interview of Putin + vid of the ‘meet‘ in France.
Putin is very nervous, I’ve never seen him this rattled.
... ...
Posted by: Noirette | Jun 8, 2014 9:04:20 AM | 58

With the greatest respect, I suggest that the facial expressions to which you refer are Vlad's version of "suppressed outrage" - i.e. a cheap trick of the kind routinely resorted to by the likes of Bliar, Kerry, Sarkozy, Hague, et al, in their indefatigable pursuit of the Nobel Prize for Sincerity.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jun 8, 2014 11:13:06 AM | 66

@ 42 Petri Krohn

That Academi letter information seems to be a 'hot item'. They have me blocked out of twitter since I tweeted it to a friend late last night.

Problems w/twitter started week ago Friday. I use computer exclusively and get security messages and have to shut down twitter. Twitter support fixes it and I"m able later to get on, but if I'm "caught" it reappears. Infuriating to say the least.

Friend questioned source as it was Russian site, so I gave him cyberguerilla link from the Russian page. I'm sure completely hiding it at this point is fruitless on their part.
I hope

Posted by: rouge | Jun 8, 2014 11:15:34 AM | 67

Opps :(

@47 not @42
apologies

Posted by: rouge | Jun 8, 2014 11:16:49 AM | 68

ad 66.
'facial expressions' = body language

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jun 8, 2014 11:24:58 AM | 69

scalawag
64

if that actually happend bet that this soldier was a russian spy according to the west. They see russians everywhere,...as germans saw jews everywhere in ww2.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 11:25:24 AM | 70

@58 Noirette. nice analysis. thanks. i am not sure i agree with your take on putins nervousness though. i agree with you that i think he will not take the bait.. b) and c) are the more likely path then a). for poroshenko - talk is cheap. he needs time and time is not on his side.

Posted by: james | Jun 8, 2014 11:52:43 AM | 71

scalawag @64

It would be funnier if, after the shot, his body just acted like a deflating balloon, complete with rasping noise as it deflated.

Posted by: Yonatan | Jun 8, 2014 11:59:19 AM | 72

@19 guest77

"But is it not possible that this is the plan?" Of course. The history of US foreign policy has usually been a) change an unfavourable government to one with a puppet leader who will then allow "free market capitalism" to take over and rob the country's natural riches, or b) destroy the country so it has no power of any type and can no longer resist U. S. "progress," after which US tax payers will pay to rebuild the country and then the robber barons come in as in a).

I disagree slightly (if I understood you correctly) only in that I don't believe the U.S. really wants a serious military confrontation with Russia under any circumstances. What they want is to force Russia to intervene to stop the suffering of the average Ukrainians (whom average Russians actually care about, while average Americans don't give a shit) and then try the usual spin tactics to place the blame on Russia, as they have already been doing since their boys instituted the illegal coup in Kiev. Notice as time goes on, the supposed solid facade of EU support of US policies and the isolation of Russia politically are crumbling day by day as the truth seeps out, despite the efforts of MSM (thanks to the internet and you tube). What I also believe is happening is that the eastern Ukrainians now realise they must stop the facsicts themselves (with the covert support of Russia) and not sit back and wait until Putin rides in on his white horse to do the heavy lifting.

Thanks to the internet, more and more of the world's people see through this web of US deceit and see the reality on the ground, i.e. yet another massacre of unarmed, defenceless civilians just like what happened in Lybia, Syria, Iraq, Afganistan, Kosovo, etc. ad nauseam.

“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Posted by: TicoTiger | Jun 8, 2014 12:38:42 PM | 73

Pathetic bulgaria just annonced that the South stream pipeline is aborted due pressure from US, EU.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 1:02:29 PM | 74

@74

Bulgaria is a small country. It cant resist the EU without help.

Posted by: Massinissa | Jun 8, 2014 1:22:24 PM | 75

Massinissa

Not so much about eu but the US.
Why arent EU seeking to become part of the US one wonder..

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 1:28:47 PM | 76

57;Yes,the Talmud does have a lot of nonsense.(possibly a few pearls,even blind squirrels find that acorn occasionally).Obviously you are Jewish,as most people other than Jews recognize the Talmuds absurdities.
The guy said he liked Putin and then turned on him when Putin failed to walk into the wests trap.Sounds like a hasbarist misdirector.
Putin serves Russian interests,not Ukrainian and Zionist.And you can bet the house,the Zionists approve of all this goyim infighting,and encourage it through their propaganda arm,the media.

Posted by: dahoit | Jun 8, 2014 1:31:39 PM | 77

Poor Bulgaria... I guess they can't afford to piss off their masters in Washington and Brussels too much. With these stupid moves, the EU is surely on her last legs.

Why should Europeans freeze for the pleasure of some American politicians?

I think Putin's been way too nice with this gas thingy.. It's about time he shut down some of the key pipelines for "maintenance work"...

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/bulgaria-halts-south-stream-gas-pipeline-165658594--finance.html#Poeife9

Posted by: Zico | Jun 8, 2014 2:00:42 PM | 78

Funny that about Bulgaria
"Bulgaria halts Russia's South Stream gas pipeline project"

McCain, commenting on the situation, said that "Bulgaria should solve the South Stream problems in collaboration with European colleagues," adding that in the current situation they would want "less Russian involvement" in the project.

Presumably McCain has ideas of his own, regarding building pipelines
(and presumably on how and who is running the EU---himself)

Posted by: chris m | Jun 8, 2014 2:13:03 PM | 79

South Stream can go through Romania, but then again US/EU can put screws on that one as well. Its not the first time EU submissively shoot themselves in the leg, like it was with Iran.

This wont last long though, within years all these projects will go full steam again IMO.

Posted by: Harry | Jun 8, 2014 2:37:10 PM | 80

Harry

Romania? Romania is even more pro-us than Bulgaria, south stream is dead now.
A dumber group than EU is hard to find.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 2:48:48 PM | 81

Try building South Stream through Greece.
Bulgaria,Romania,Greece, whatever.
It all reminds me of that nursery rhyme i always like saying.

Eeny,Meany,Miny..MO..etc.....And O-U-T spells out.

Posted by: chris m | Jun 8, 2014 2:52:14 PM | 82

I think we can expect a very bloody week coming now, poroshenko said today that the east should be finished in one week.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 3:28:16 PM | 83

Anon @83

Apparently Poroshenko has acquired Saakashvili as an advisor. The one week probably came from him.

This should be amusing. The combination of EU, Ukraine and Saakatash must be approaching a singularity of stupidity.


Posted by: Yonatan | Jun 8, 2014 4:34:15 PM | 84

yonathan
84

You cant make this up, who will be PM, Bernard-Henri Lévy?

poroshenko is digging his own grave, just sit back and watch the circus.

Posted by: Anonymous | Jun 8, 2014 4:49:21 PM | 85

@Noirette - Thanks for the info. I knew the Right Sektor had become a party, but I did not know they garnered cabinet seats. A pretty good trick for a group that never faced formal elections (if I have that right)! Very interesting that they were given positions that most closely work with youth, but then not surprising as these are the only people innocent enough to buy their horseshit.

@Tico - I agree with you - the US wants Russia in a war, just not with themselves.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 8, 2014 4:53:28 PM | 86

Try building South Stream through Greece. I am surprised that Russia hasn't been more active in Greece. They are quite popular there. More popular there than in any European country to be exact. Which is probably why the EU wants to see democracy in Greece like it wants to see Brussels inundated with in 20 feet tall wave of feces.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 8, 2014 4:57:07 PM | 87

I always question when someone like lobro pops up to tell how much he is disappointed in Putin. Seems a bit... convenient.

and then to accuse Putin of being like that bum and traitor Yeltsin - what a laugh.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 8, 2014 5:00:12 PM | 88

Good op-ed from Diana Johnstone, originally published in Counterpunch this link is from Chuck Spinney because he adds some extra comment. This is a 'must read'.

http://chuckspinney.blogspot.com.au/2014/06/ukraine-why-is-us-trying-to-restart.html

She makes the point (and provides the evidence) that this was long planed by the US and EU (no doubt the medoa was set up in advance as well). Snippet:
" In September 2013, one of Ukraine’s richest oligarchs, Viktor Pinchuk, paid for an elite strategic conference on Ukraine’s future that was held in the same Palace in Yalta, Crimea, where Roosevelt, Stalin and Churchill met to decide the future of Europe in 1945. The Economist, one of the elite media reporting on what it called a “display of fierce diplomacy”, stated that: “The future of Ukraine, a country of 48m people, and of Europe was being decided in real time.” The participants included Bill and Hillary Clinton, former CIA head General David Petraeus, former U.S. Treasury secretary Lawrence Summers, former World Bank head Robert Zoellick, Swedish foreign minister Carl Bildt, Shimon Peres, Tony Blair, Gerhard Schröder, Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Mario Monti, Lithuanian president Dalia Grybauskaite, and Poland’s influential foreign minister Radek Sikorski. Both President Viktor Yanukovych, deposed five months later, and his recently elected successor Petro Poroshenko were present. Former U.S. energy secretary Bill Richardson was there to talk about the shale-gas revolution which the United States hopes to use to weaken Russia by substituting fracking for Russia’s natural gas reserves. The center of discussion was the “Deep and Comprehensive Free Trade Agreement” (DCFTA) between Ukraine and the European Union, and the prospect of Ukraine’s integration with the West. The general tone was euphoria over the prospect of breaking Ukraine’s ties with Russia in favor of the West."

Then she points out that that it was intended to create a clear win over Russia. Either it gave in and NATO got the Ukraine, and Russia kicked out of its naval bases and NATO getting them. Or, if Russia reacted, to create political (and ideally) economic isolation for it. Snippet:
Plan A for the Victoria Nuland putsch was probably to install, rapidly, a government in Kiev that would join NATO, thus formally setting the stage for the United States to take possession of Russia’s indispensable Black Sea naval base at Sebastopol in Crimea. Reincorporating Crimea into Russia was Putin’s necessary defensive move to prevent this.
But the Nuland gambit was in fact a win-win ploy. If Russia failed to defend itself, it risked losing its entire southern fleet – a total national disaster. On the other hand, if Russia reacted, as was most likely, the US thereby won a political victory that was perhaps its main objective. Putin’s totally defensive move is portrayed by the Western mainstream media, echoing political leaders, as unprovoked “Russian expansionism”, which the propaganda machine compares to Hitler grabbing Czechoslovakia and Poland.
Thus a blatant Western provocation, using Ukrainian political confusion against a fundamentally defensive Russia, has astonishingly succeeded in producing a total change in the artificial Zeitgeist produced by Western mass media.

Thirdly that this was unprovoked attack on Russia with the full and total backing of the EU and all it's Govts. That European leaders shave shown total, self destructive servility to the US, sacrificing their national interests. Snippet:
Perhaps the most extraordinary aspect of the current charade is the servility of the “old” Europeans. Apparently abandoning all Europe’s accumulated wisdom, drawn from its wars and tragedies, and even oblivious to their own best interests, today’s European leaders seem ready to follow their American protectors to another D-Day … D for Doom.

Posted by: oldskeptic | Jun 8, 2014 5:57:15 PM | 89

He we go boys and girls, this is one of the 'canaries' I have been watching for, the US moving assets into a First Strike position:

US Air Force Sends 2 B-2 Stealth Bombers To The UK:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-08/us-air-force-sends-2-b-2-stealth-bombers-uk

" ...overseas deployments of the Spirit stealth strategic bombers are quite unusual.

Indeed, B-2s don’t move from Whiteman AFB, in Missouri, too often as they are trained to conduct very long round-trip missions from their homebase in CONUS (Continental U.S.), as happened during recent training missions, extended nuclear deterrence sorties in the Korean Peninsula, as well as during real conflicts, as the Libya Air War in 2011 or the Allied Force in Serbia in 1999.

That’s why the deployment of two Spirit bombers with the 509th Bomb Wing to the UK is, at least, noteworthy.

Obviously, the official press release doesn’t mention the rarity of this “short-term deployment,” as it only mentions that the “multi-role heavy bombers will conduct training flights in the USEUCOM area of operations, providing opportunities for aircrews to sharpen skills in several key operational sets and become familiar with airbases and operations in the region.”

Little is known about this deployment, unlike the other one which involves three B-52s that have arrived at RAF Fairford last week and whose detachment had been exposed by aircrew patches produced ahead of the participation of the Stratofortresses to the Saber Strike and Baltops exercises.

"The training and integration of strategic forces demonstrates to our nation’s leaders and our allies that we have the right mix of aircraft and expertise to respond to a variety of potential threats and situations,” said Adm. Cecil Haney, commander, U.S. Strategic Command in the release.

For sure, the Russian threat in Europe is taken seriously by the USSTRACOM, that may have decided to deploy some strategic assets closer to Ukraine, more to show the local allies that Washington is capable to support them if needed rather than put some pressure on Moscow.
"

Posted by: oldskeptic | Jun 8, 2014 6:22:23 PM | 90

@oldskeptic #90:

Is this the first time that USG has done this since the reunification of Crimea with Russia? In that case, the timing is interesting, since Russia's stance has been very accommodating since Poroshenko was elected.

Maybe the US expects that Russia is going to make a military move on Novorossia soon, something the Saker is worried Putin will not do?

I would make a post there telling him this news—maybe it would cheer him up—but I find the climate there pretty hostile.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 8, 2014 6:48:23 PM | 91

Today I feel humiliated like never before now that the whole world knows that the senator whose incompetence gave Palin a national stage can issue orders to the supposedly sovereign government of my land of birth.

Posted by: OIFVet | Jun 8, 2014 6:55:10 PM | 92

@90 oldskeptic

With all respect to you sir, if you regard 2 B-2 bombers and 3 B-52 bombers as potential first strike "canaries," I suspect you are suffering from Kool Aid overdose. Obviously the regime in Washington is (increasingly) desperate to face down Putin publicly in his own front yard, but so far the massacre of unarmed and innocent Ukrainians is just causing cracks to appear in the EU and worldwide public opinion is turning very much against US. I have no doubt that if the new "president" of Ukraine continues his genocide against his own citizens, Putin will increase his covert help to the separatists, and if he decides to intervene, it will come from the high road and not from the sewers.

Posted by: TicoTiger | Jun 8, 2014 7:11:26 PM | 93

Re #92, as I said a 'canary' .. as in 'canary in a coal mine'....which is an early warning. Agree that there is a fair way to go before they would be ready, therefore future moves are going to be critical to watch.

But 2 B2's much closer to Russia is a concern all by itself. Their job would be to go in first to take out Russia's C&C... translated blow Moscow and it's Govt to radioactive dust, before the other B-2s arrive and the cruise missiles and the ICBMs hit.

If you study their plans for this, then this is exactly how they would start to deploy.

Posted by: oldskeptic | Jun 8, 2014 7:47:07 PM | 94

If Russia failed to defend itself, it risked losing its entire southern fleet – a total national disaster. On the other hand, if Russia reacted, as was most likely, the US thereby won a political victory that was perhaps its main objective.

It is impressive the amount of lies poured out by the US media, marching in lock step with their corporate/government/military masters. And it is true that a lie can get halfway around the world before the truth puts its pants on (not to add to the Churchill debate) but I would wager that - like the battle in Syria - this war in the Ukraine will eventually be seen in the US for the neocon shenanigans it is, giving the American people the chance to veto any major action before it gets underway.

Not that that's any comfort for the people suffering this very moment in Slavayansk.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 8, 2014 8:26:58 PM | 95

"Three visiting United States senators: John McCain, Ron Johnson and Christopher Murphy – had expressed objections to the choice of Stroytransgaz as the builder of the Bulgarian land section of the South Stream gas pipeline, given that the company’s owner Gennady Timchenko, was subject to US sanctions because of Moscow’s illegal annexation of Crimea.

The US underlined its stance on June 6 with a statement by Washington’s ambassador in Sofia, Marcie Ries, warning that companies or individuals that provide material support to Stroytransgaz – the company to which Bulgaria awarded the contract to build the land section of the South Stream pipeline in the country – could be subject to US sanctions.

Oresharski, nominal head of a government that is teetering under enormous political pressure and that is widely expected to give way for long-demanded fresh elections some time before the end of 2014, said that he had ordered the suspension of all activities related to the start of South Stream while consultations with the European Commission were underway.

Responding to a question, he said that the work had been suspended in reaction to a letter from the European Commission notifying Bulgaria of the infringement procedure. The course of further work would depend on consultations with Brussels, Oresharski said."

Posted by: neretva'43 | Jun 8, 2014 8:33:06 PM | 96

@guest77 #95:

I'm curious: why are you confident that USians will eventually see Syria and the Ukraine as neocon shenanigans? I don't think they even see Afghanistan and Iraq as neocon shenanigans: just "mistakes".

I doubt whether more than 5% of USians even knows what a neocon is. The vast majority still get their news from the TV, don't they? I'm too lazy to look that up.

One cause for hope is that Russian sources come up in Google news, but that's probably because Google is tailoring what it shows to my "preferences". Probably if you come to Google News without a Google history, what comes out will be all mainstream + right wing media.

Most Americans hate Obama by now, but I would say very few Americans have the resources to make a leap from that to getting a systematic understanding of US foreign policy. To get to the point that you understand that Huffington Post is little better than the NY Times, you have to be pretty determined in your quest for knowledge…

Posted by: Demian | Jun 8, 2014 8:46:47 PM | 97

The Saker is nuts. One post he is screaming that the Russian Communists are tools of the US who are on a campaign to make Putin out to be a coward who doesn't do anything for the people of the East, the next he is wailing that he fears that Putin will turn out to be... a coward who doesn't do anything for the people of the East.

I haven't spent a ton of time there, but I have spent enough to see that - lately, at least - the guy is all over the place.

Posted by: guest77 | Jun 8, 2014 8:54:04 PM | 98

@98

why don't you say that on his blog, instead of coming here and talking behind his back?

Frankly, many of us are "all over the place" concerned about what the crazy neo-con occupied USG is going to do next. But then you're here to defend that, aren't you?

Posted by: crone | Jun 8, 2014 9:05:25 PM | 99

@guest77 #98:

Well, fortunately we have scalawag, who is good at digging up Russian sources.

BTW, вот так, a commenter at the Saker, got mad at me for calling something he posted at the Saker "slavophile nonsense" here. He didn't reply to my criticism, however; just called me names. He claims to be our Pragma; he didn't mention the name, but did say that I knew that he got banned here.

Posted by: Demian | Jun 8, 2014 9:09:45 PM | 100

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