Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
May 04, 2014

Ukraine: U.S. Campaign Stuck Without Russian Intervention And German Support

Two days ago a mob, supported by the fascists Right Sektor, killed over 30 federalist Ukrainians in Odessa by pushing them from their camp into a building and then setting fire to it. Those who escaped the massacre, not the perpetrators, were rounded up by police. Today pro-federalism people besieged the police headquarter in Odessa until the police released those it had earlier arrested.

In the east some military and National Guard units under government control were in sporadic fights with federalists but right now the government forces seem to be again in retreat. There were attacks on private bank outlets in the east because the owner of the bank, a well known oligarch, is suspected of financing the fascist Right Sektor paramilitaries.

The U.S. plan for Ukraine seems to be to bait Russia into an occupation. This would destroy EU-Russia relations, embolden NATO and help the U.S. to keep the EU as a secondary partner under its control. There would be lots of economic upsides for the U.S. in such a situation. Selling more arms and increasing energy market shares are only the starters.

There are two reasons to believe that this plan will fail:

First: Russia will not take the bait. The people requesting more local autonomy in Ukraine are perfectly able to take a stand on their own. Should a few die, like in Odessa, even more will rise up. Except for the Right Sektor people now included in the National Guard there are no loyal troops for the Kiev coup government to use against the people. The huge mistake the coup government made, repeating a U.S. mistake made in Iraq, was to dissolve the federal riot police Berkut. Those now unemployed trained fighters, together with experienced former Soviet soldiers, are the military backbone of the federalists. There is therefore no need for Russia to openly intervene. The Kiev coup government is already a dying entity.

Second: Many people in Europe have recognized the nefarious U.S. scheme and are protesting against their politicians' slavishness in following the U.S. lead. The political pressure against Russia bashing is building. Every pro-NATO/anti-Russian report in the media, and there are lots of them, gets trashed in the comment sections. Some of the European elite are openly turning against the U.S. induced anti-Russia propaganda. Even the most staunch transatlantic tabloid in Germany, Bild, today reports (original here) that the CIA and FBI with dozens of agents are running the show in Kiev. The report is based on "German security sources" which lets me believe that the German government is looking for ways to counter Washington's moves. The German Foreign Minister Steinmeier just called (in German) for a second Geneva conference to solve the situation.

Without Russian intervention and without German support the U.S. campaign against Russia is unlikely to reach its secondary target of isolating Russia. The primary target, Sevastopol harbor in Crimea, was already lost when Russia reunified with the island.

What is left to do then for Washington is to create more chaos in Ukraine and to hope that somehow out of total chaos some new chance may arise to stick it to Russia. For lack of real direction that strategy is also unlikely to succeed.

Posted by b on May 4, 2014 at 11:34 AM | Permalink

Comments
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I don't trust Steinmeier one bit, Merkel neither. But hopefully Economic and Strategic realities will keep Europe in the de-escalation camp and out of the sanctions camp. What those Neo-Nazi scum did in Odessa was pure savagery. Luckily Putin is not taking the bait.

Posted by: Colm O' Toole | May 4, 2014 12:09:44 PM | 1

Germany must take the lead now against the crazy warmongers, they have the power to do that!
Calling for a conference is a good start, hoewever Germany cant keep sanction Russia. This must stop!

Posted by: Anonymous | May 4, 2014 12:16:48 PM | 2

I think you are absolutely correct that the U.S. plan for Ukraine is to sucker Russia to invade Ukraine to protect Russian-speakers and supporters there. You are also correct, I hope, in your doubts that Russia will take the bait. Probably, the fascists scum will retreat and the entire tragedy will gradually play itself out. From the Russian point of view, the only thing that could happen which would be better would be for the nutso fascists to actually cross the border into Russia with guns blazing.

Posted by: George | May 4, 2014 12:21:41 PM | 3

Lockheed Martin would like to share some good news....

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101640055

Posted by: dh | May 4, 2014 12:23:21 PM | 4

New video: People jumped from building, got beaten to death by kiev thugs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbeUmpQ_4nU
So sick..

Posted by: Anonymous | May 4, 2014 12:27:45 PM | 5

there's plenty of chances, b!

A random assassination of some important EU bureaucrat/politician would be good enough to stampede the EU countries into NATO's arms. Will be done by the UK. It will be of a rabid Russiphobe of no consequence and then things spill over ever so slowly.

Speaking from far away, if I can kneecap Germany, I can get the following

* EU under US energy control

* EU under US economic control

* US style neo liberal social care in EU

* permanent control of EU

* Russia surrounded and under military and economic control


The question simply now boils down to, how can Germany be made to hate Russia?
So bad that Germany will cut its own nose and the rest of EU?

Posted by: shanks | May 4, 2014 12:30:26 PM | 6

In Poland there are signs of the tide turning, the comments sections on major portals are increasingly pro-Russian, especially on ONET where also many articles approach objectivity. The threat against EU departing from the murderous atlantists yoke has always been the same for last couple of decades: "strategy of tension" with terror campaign GLADIO-style blamed on "extremist groups de joure", AQ, right-wing fanatics, whatever...

Part of that threat have been "warning messages" from the criminal transatlantist cabal channeled thru the lame-scream media: "battle-hardened islamist from EU in Syria coming back home", as if they could not have been prevented from going to the ME in the first place? Why spending so much on surveillance, intelligence, technology and introducing new legislation limiting liberties in order to "fight terrorism" where the only outcome is "monitoring"? What the fuck that even means where we see news about the reports from "intelligence sources" about "growing number of radicals form EU joining the war in Syria being closely monitored "? Where the fuck are the billions spend to prevent those dumbwits from getting there? This is a complete absurdity and why the EU population is not rioting against this assault on logic is beyond me. What it is and should be perfectly clear for any Westerner that such news are what in the intelligence called "covers" (excuses, false pretexts) carefully prepared for staged violence later.

So if the EU tries to get closer to Russia we should expect campaigns of bombing at public places (real: Boston 2013, Madrid 2005, London 2007, earlier Bologna,... and fake: Sandy Hoax), assassinations of pro-peace prominent figures (like Olof Palme), "weird" diseases outbreaks b'coz of the biowarfare (laboratories in Ukraine, Georgia), acts of sabotage on the essential infrastructure (recently some snipers destroyed some electric power stations in the US), massacres Breivik-style, or like in Toulouse, other school shooting (like in Germany), poisoned water/food supplies. Everything conveniently blamed on "terrorists" from Iran, Arab countries, Russia,... Also more riots with both law enforcement and protesters killed by the same snipers. "Clerics" will be shouting loudly calling for "jihad" - Bernard Lewis et. al. carefully planned "clash of civilizations", Christians against Muslims, set in motion with full speed.

Antihuman globalist cabal will not allow the tectonic shift of the EU re-aligning from the UK/US realm to Russia/China to be conducted without blood. At this point it is of utmost importance to inform as many people as possible about what's coming and who's behind this.

In Poland authorities conducted recently the largest drills of internal security / crisis management forces, unprecedented.

There will be blood. (unless someone will get to those on the top and neutralizes them first...)

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 12:40:28 PM | 7

Journal of an pravoslavnyi nationalist - mechanics of the provocation. The police in Odessa allowed the massacre to happen.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 12:51:15 PM | 9

Well Germany doesnt exactly want to see Europe go up in flames,again.
as in past 100+years.

US tells UK what it wants Germany to tell Russia what to do.

seems the UK part in the chain is coming unstuck,
so now Pres Obama has to go directly over to Germany to give his orders directly.

Posted by: chris m | May 4, 2014 1:04:59 PM | 10

I think Boris Kargalitsky's views on the situation are interesting in that Western involvement doesn't figure in his analysis at all.

This is extracted from 'Fate of Donetsk is being decided in Kharkov', published 3 May.

Representatives of the Donetsk republic and of the movements of the Ukrainian south-east show up constantly in Moscow, where they are received warmly and with goodwill. Meetings for them are organised with journalists and Duma deputies. Then they are sent home empty-handed. The individuals through whom official Moscow expresses its support for the “brother people” do not decide anything, and do not even take part in discussions on important questions. They are simply used to transmit propagandist formulae, and do not shape the political agenda.

Moscow cannot, of course, publicly cut off its support for the Donetsk republic. That would be a disaster in terms of domestic politics and propaganda, and the potential for disaster will be greater to the degree that today’s Russian authorities manage to build up their ratings in the course of the Ukrainian turmoil. If the revolt is smashed while Russia does nothing, the effect will automatically be to provoke mass indignation. The problem, however, lies in the fact that it is impossible to calculate everything in advance. As they try to manoeuvre and win time, the Russian authorities risk missing the crucial strategic moment when the situation flies out of control, and they are forced simply to reconcile themselves to the outcome whatever that might be.

The paradox lies in the fact that this strategic turning point will not necessarily result from some initiative by Kiev. As the rebels try to ensure that the strategic initiative finishes up in their hands, they cannot afford simply to wait for decisions by the Kremlin. To the contrary, they need to create a new situation through their own actions, determining in advance what these decisions will be.

A breakthrough in the development of the struggle in south-eastern Ukraine will only occur when the largest regional centres, above all Kharkov and Odessa, join in the movement. Clearly, the authorities in Kiev understand this perfectly, since they are using all available means to try to maintain their control over these regions and to seal them off from the Donetsk republic. The experience of the past few days has shown that for mass protests to develop in these centres, the slogans of brotherhood with Russia and of defending the Russian language will be completely inadequate on their own.

A broadening of the social base of the uprising will depend on its program, on the goals and slogans that it advances. Against the background of an inexorably worsening economic situation, only demands aimed at satisfying the urgent needs of the masses can serve to mobilise the huge numbers of people who now sympathise with the rebel republic, but who are not ready to stand beneath its banner.

It is perfectly possible to put forward an anti-oligarchic social program today, and such a program does not even have to be exclusively left-wing or socialist. It is enough to call for nationalisation of the property of those Ukrainian oligarchs who have openly associated themselves with the Kiev regime, and to demand that these assets be directed toward the solving of social problems, toward investment in health care, education and the development of infrastructure.

In conditions of revolutionary crisis, moderation ceases to be a pragmatic virtue. To the contrary, it turns out to be suicidal. The more moderate the leaders of the Donetsk and Lugansk republic now show themselves to be, the fewer hopes they have of drawing into struggle new masses of people outside the borders of their regions. Needless to say, such actions are liable to alarm the Moscow bureaucrats who keep a constant watch over the interests of “their own” oligarchs. But as noted earlier, it is precisely the Moscow politicians who have now finished up hostages of the Ukrainian situation. If the revolt shifts to a more radical course, the authorities in Moscow will be forced to beat their breasts and voice their approval. In the same way, they were obliged in the case of Latin America to come to terms with Hugo Chavez, even though the social measures being implemented in Venezuela caused them no particular delight.

Posted by: William Bowles | May 4, 2014 1:06:11 PM | 11

Despite the apparent inability of the USG to meet its primary objectives in UKRAINE, it can't hurt the USG case for intervention by perpetuating a situation that makes Ukraine appear to not be be able to manage themselves.


(My comments keep vanishing after saying they have been posted..)

Posted by: Tea | May 4, 2014 1:07:38 PM | 12

And let's not forget, for 1 micro-second, that without Putin's co-operation and assistance, NATO's only Afghan withdrawal option will be the Stairway to Heaven so beloved of lite Christian warmongers.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | May 4, 2014 1:20:33 PM | 13

RT reports that Slovyans'k is surrounded by Ukrainain military with checkpoints. I expect occasional forays into Slovyans'k with murders against local civilians, as this was the tactic that the western powers used against the rebellion in Cite Soleil---turn the area into a 'virtual concentration camp' by sealing off the area, then shoot civilians, often babies, in the face, in their own homes. Recall that the junta is being trained by the same powers that conducted these crimes in Haiti. Those who've seen Kevin Pina's Haiti: The Untold Story will understand. He no longer distributes that video, although a modified version, with the victims' faces obscured, is available online:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=25Mf7Lv5Qo8‎


http://rt.com/in-motion/156708-ukranian-army-slavyansk-military/

Posted by: Johan Meyer | May 4, 2014 1:37:37 PM | 14

@14

But would they really have the balls to do this in Europe? Wouldnt the press be forced to notice?

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 1:43:06 PM | 15

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 1:43:06 PM | 15

Remember Yugoslavia?

Posted by: William Bowles | May 4, 2014 2:05:06 PM | 16

@16 I don't think they've got the cash to pull the ol' Belgrade stunt off this time, not amidst anticipated budget cuts and a new fiscal cliff.

Posted by: Grim Deadman | May 4, 2014 2:12:49 PM | 17

The U.S. plan for Ukraine seems to be to bait Russia into an occupation. This would destroy EU-Russia relations, embolden NATO and help the U.S. to keep the EU as a secondary partner under its control. There would be lots of economic upsides for the U.S. in such a situation. Selling more arms and increasing energy market shares are only the starters.

Good analysis, b. I think that's a pretty good summary of the USG's geo-political reasoning. The US would no longer be the world's hegemon if it lost its European foothold on the World Island. Thus, a Russia-EU economic alliance is the greatest threat to US global hegemony, and the USG has attacked the formation of the alliance by encouraging and overtly supporting the putschists and then through its propaganda presenting the Europeans with a manichean choice.

For the moment Russia's geopolitical ambitions seem to have been reduced to the security of its borders. How can Putin get the development of a multi-polar world order back on track?

Posted by: ess emm | May 4, 2014 2:14:27 PM | 18

"...The experience of the past few days has shown that for mass protests to develop in these centres, the slogans of brotherhood with Russia and of defending the Russian language will be completely inadequate on their own.

"A broadening of the social base of the uprising will depend on its program, on the goals and slogans that it advances. Against the background of an inexorably worsening economic situation, only demands aimed at satisfying the urgent needs of the masses can serve to mobilise the huge numbers of people who now sympathise with the rebel republic, but who are not ready to stand beneath its banner.

"It is perfectly possible to put forward an anti-oligarchic social program today, and such a program does not even have to be exclusively left-wing or socialist. It is enough to call for nationalisation of the property of those Ukrainian oligarchs who have openly associated themselves with the Kiev regime, and to demand that these assets be directed toward the solving of social problems, toward investment in health care, education and the development of infrastructure..."

Thanks, William Bowles @11, for this.
I agree with it entirely. It hardly needs to be added that if Popular Councils develop, as they will have to do both to arm and organise militias and to promulgate concrete demands and slogans, the whole world, Europe attentively and the country with the worst child mortality rates on the continent, in particular will be watching.

Thanks too for your News Monitoring website.

Over the few months that I have been visiting MoA I have been struck by the accuracy and confidence of "b"'s assessments of the situation. Personally I am inclined to pessimism, which I strive hard to shake. It must be something biological because I understand well that the ruling class is weak, divided and extremely susceptible to popular political action. Nor do I believe in any of the myriad versions of the secret conspiracies (of Jews, Masons, rich families whose names begin with an R, the descendants of the Electress Sophia of Hanover etc ad nauseum) said to control the world and to be the motive force behind just about everything that happens in the world.

This post confirms my view that the powers that be, armed to the teeth, as rich as Croesus, surrounded by crowds of courtiers from the intelligentsia and harems full of journalists, are totally unable to understand revolutionary situations.
They have one answer to everything: killing. They long for the freedom to commit genocide, like Nero they wish that all the people had but one neck, for them to wring. And they wish that Ukraine had more competent recruits for their death squads- football hooligans and demented fascists on speed are not a long term solution.

Right now they are itching to add drones to the Death Squads. If they do they lose, but there is a limit to their stupidity.

Posted by: bevin | May 4, 2014 2:22:21 PM | 19

Steinmeier is slowly walking back the support of the Kyiv regime

Steinmeier sagte, obwohl die Zeit knapp werde, sei die für den 25. Mai geplante Präsidentenwahl in der Ukraine immer noch möglich. Die Wahl würde helfen, die Ukraine zu stabilisieren, da die Legitimation der gegenwärtigen Regierung und des Übergangspräsidenten fehle

Translation: Though there is not much time left, Steinmeier considers elections on May 25 still possible. Elections would help to stabilize Ukraine as the present government and its interim president lack legitimacy.

Posted by: somebody | May 4, 2014 2:26:21 PM | 20

@16

Good point... I forgot Slavs arnt considered white.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 2:32:34 PM | 21

Germany is the key. And if b is right that Germany is beginning to openly distance itself from the U.S. mad dog, then we have good reason to be hopeful. On Rowan Berkeley's blog he posted an excellent DEBKAfile on Merkel's visit to the White House and the fissures developing between Obama and Germany on Ukraine.

Posted by: Mike Maloney | May 4, 2014 2:33:07 PM | 22

@17

The Deep State is immune to budget cuts.

If budget cuts are needed, it will be to healthcare and education, not the military or CIA.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 2:33:19 PM | 23

@19

Theres a conspiracy theory about the descendants of Sophia of Hannover? Lolwut?

So by that do you meant he British royal family?

If anyone controls the world, it cant be them. They cant even control their own country.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 2:38:22 PM | 24

Dmitri Orlov is simply brilliant today!

That, and The Saker's latest posts on the matter have me thinking that the US is the angry little kid swinging and flailing and cursing, while the bigger kid Russia holds the little one at arm's length and chuckles lightly with amusement.

Posted by: Dr. Wellington Yueh | May 4, 2014 2:44:05 PM | 25

This is the best analysis I’ve read and is about as close as one can get to reality when looking through the fog of misinformation. The plan is to bait Russia to invade Ukraine and split Russia away from the EU and destabilize it.

Money has been spent to aggravate existing ethnic and religious hatreds to get chaos to a tipping point that requires outside intervention. Ukraine is a variation on the same pattern seen previously in Syria, Libya, and Serbia.

If this plays out as planned, NATO and Russian troops will be eyeball to eyeball in Western Ukraine with locked and loaded weapons including tactical nuclear weapons in the middle of a civil war. This is incredibly dangerous.

The reason why is the “Known Unknown”. NATO member states politicians are bought and controlled. A European War and Forced Austerity are not in the best interests of the people but both are happening anyway. An extralegal faction of the Davos Elite need war profits and all the Western Plutocrats are afraid of an economic crash if BRICs establishes a second world payment system.

Sovereign states and the people are helpless to prevent the death and destruction while the rich and NGOs run the world aground in the rivers of Hell.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 4, 2014 2:45:10 PM | 26

dh @4
F-35 is visible to Russian radar so useless and the US won't sell the F-22 to anyone else, so I think that is the usual crappy PR one has come to expect of the US military/industrial complex.

Posted by: blowback | May 4, 2014 2:57:29 PM | 27

Mike

Distance? Germany just travled to obama to agree to more sanctions.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 4, 2014 3:04:00 PM | 28

dh @4

Iron Dome 2014 is f all use against Grad rockets, what chance does MEADS have against Iskandar. etc. missiles designed to evade air defence systems? The other thing is that for something like MEADS to work effectively, you pretty much have to ground all your own aircraft so no point in buying F-35s or F-22s.

Posted by: blowback | May 4, 2014 3:06:26 PM | 29

Dr Wellington Yueh @25
Thanks: you are right about Orlov!

Posted by: bevin | May 4, 2014 3:07:20 PM | 30

The past few days I have been writing about the sources of US foreign policy in the Obama administration.

Once again, just like Vietnam War and the Rand Corporation, there are high level think-tanks who advocate policy of national security, international relations, NATO, defence in Europe and people involved with the Atlantic Council.

In a brief summary:
DNI Publication 'Global Trends 2030'
US NATO ambassador Ivo Daalder on containment of Russia making it a pariah state
Kerry Preaching Russia Policy @Atlantic Council

Posted by: Oui | May 4, 2014 3:07:20 PM | 31

@29 Thanks. Seems we have a clear case of false advertizing by Lockheed Martin.

Posted by: dh | May 4, 2014 3:09:48 PM | 32

If you read the DEBKAfile, Anonymous, you'll see that Merkel's announced support for further sanctions is ambiguous. Here is part of that analysis:

Merkel faces two tough decisions:

1) Whether or not to line up behind Obama’s policy of broadening sanctions against Russia until the Kremlin falls in behind Washington on Ukraine. The answer to this question is negative. At home, the industrial giants that are the engines of Germany’s economic prosperity have lined up against this course. Before she went to Washington, she faced a powerful lobby of BASF, Siemens, Volkswagen, Adidas and Deutsche Bank, urging her to stand up to Obama against broader sanctions against Russia. She can’t ignore them. Germany’s external trade is heavily weighted in favor of ties with Russia and China rather than the US, and a third of its gas comes from Russia. Furthermore, two former German chancellors Helmut Kohl and Gerhard Schroeder are partners in Moscow’s state energy concerns.

2) Merkel must also determine whether the BND will join US agents to guarantee the May 25 election. At Friday’s news conference in Washington, she noted that not much time is left to that date, a hint that a postponement may be useful for developing dialogue with the Russian ruler and action to cool the hotheads leading the civil violence. But Obama ignored her comment. Clearly, after giving the Kiev government its head for a military offensive that morning, he was not prepared to give up the prospect of the Ukraine military forcing its will on the dozens of towns held by the pro-Russian militias and making them take part in the vote.

Posted by: Mike Maloney | May 4, 2014 3:11:58 PM | 33

Mike

Debka isnt trustworthy imo. Seeing merkel agree to more sanctions is evidence enough.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 4, 2014 3:29:30 PM | 34

thanks for the conversation and links everyone - dh, Dr. Wellington Yueh and etc.

Posted by: james | May 4, 2014 3:32:59 PM | 35

Nor do I believe in any of the myriad versions of the secret conspiracies (of Jews, Masons, rich families whose names begin with an R, the descendants of the Electress Sophia of Hanover etc ad nauseum) said to control the world and to be the motive force behind just about everything that happens in the world.

Ok yeah - so the rich family whose name begins with an R, DIDN'T end up having to out themselves as the beneficiaries of the Yukos shares that Kordorkovsky was supposedly the owner of?

And the aforementioned "rich family whose name begins with an R" DID NOT have their agent Peter Mandelson elevated into the position of EU Trade Negotiator where he managed to secure a massive reduction on imports of Alu-foil for ONE company only - RUSAL, thus helping RUSAL to secure an almost monopoly position in the world-wide production and sale of Alu-foil

And RUSAL is NOT run by Oleg Deripaska another Oligarch Frontman for that "rich family whose name begins with an R"?

And of course the attack on Yugoslavia had actually nothing whatsoever to do with Alu-production or massive resources of bauxite still sitting in the ground in the former Yugoslavia

Ok got it

Thanks for telling us your thoughts on all that, ignorant and useless though they are

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 3:36:13 PM | 36

Oh and of course there is nothing even remotely staged about this Putin puff-piece from BBC, complete with Teacher-like admonishment of the Rothschild frontman Deripaska

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XfbWnDXCx8

Not at all staged.

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 3:44:48 PM | 37

The latest re-incarnation of the foff troll insists @36, that ownership of several powerful corporations equates with controlling the world.

It is worth reading @36 just to understand the shallowness of the minds which promote these nasty and groundless theories, the burden if which is that there is nothing wrong with capitalism, that the Empire would be wholly acceptable were the Jews or the Masons or the Catholics or the Communists or the Rothschilds or the trilateral commission, or Boros or the Russians or the Shi'ites....

The bottom line on these theories, all utterly groundless and proffered with the sort of empirical evidence that would make a Kangaroo blush, is that they incite divisions between ethnic groups, religious faiths etc.

"Divide and Rule" it is the oldest trick in the book, next to employing trolls to bear false witness.

Posted by: bevin | May 4, 2014 3:52:42 PM | 38

Yes b's optimism if a nice tonic to the pessimism I often feel. Given his high batting average in anticipating events his words arn't easy to dismiss as wishful thinking.

The good news today was the no new news about the attacks against Sloviansk and Kramatorsk in the British and US press or RT either. That would seem to mean that Ukrainian army has just surrounded the towns and have stopped their offensives. Somehow, siege warfare does not look like an efficient means for reasserting control of those cities.

Posted by: ToivoS | May 4, 2014 3:57:07 PM | 39

what a pompous moron you are

You really know sfa about anything

The bottom line on these theories, all utterly groundless and proffered with the sort of empirical evidence that would make a Kangaroo blush, is that they incite divisions between ethnic groups, religious faiths etc.

lol

pointing out the mere tip of the iceberg of hidden control the "rich family whose name begins with an R" exercises, certainly does seem to upset some of the more idiotic pseudo-intellecuals here -

a 'few corporations', the idiot says. ROFLMAO

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 3:59:18 PM | 40

clearly the honourable pompous dissident Professor from Canada thinks there is nothing at all staged or fake about the BBC Putin puff-piece posted @ 37

the honourable pompous dissident Professor from Canada is about as fake-left as they come

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 4:01:51 PM | 41

Despite the apparent inability of the USG to meet its primary objectives in UKRAINE, it can't hurt the USG case for intervention by perpetuating a situation that makes Ukraine appear to not be be able to manage themselves.

Posted by: Tea | May 4, 2014 4:05:25 PM | 42

@39 'Somehow, siege warfare does not look like an efficient means for reasserting control of those cities.'

I was thinking the same thing. It is more likely to harden the anti-Kiev attitude. At some point the Ukrainian Army is going to have to put up or shut up. They are waiting for instructions I guess.

Posted by: dh | May 4, 2014 4:06:37 PM | 43

#36

"a massive reduction on imports" = a massive reduction on import-duties

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 4:09:12 PM | 44


Another Pause in a Standoff Between Kiev and the RF?

Kiev knows that it has a strategic reserve of Kalashnikov assault rifles and other light weapons stored in Ukraine as a mobilisation reserve dating back to Soviet times. It has hinted quietly but strongly in back channels between Ukrainian and Russian military establishments that it might be prepared to open this strategic reserve of weapons to an eastern Ukrainian population prepared to resist any Russian military incursions. Since the stockpile consists of up to five million weapons, the prospect would be a nightmare for Russian military planners if they realistically prepared to move into eastern areas of Ukraine. The prospect of civil war and an anti-Russian insurgency on an unprecedented scale with unpredictable consequences represents a real – if extremely dangerous – bargaining chip for Kiev.

The stark fact is that at least half the strategic stockpile of light weapons on Ukrainian territory is concentrated near Slavyansk.

This explains many of the manoeuvres around this small and otherwise unimportant city. On 24 April Ukrainian authorities re-launched their ‘counter-terrorist operation’ against Russian separatists who had occupied key areas to restore Kiev’s control over Slavyansk. In a coordinated response Russian forces edged closer to the Ukrainian border in such a way as to threaten a territorial incursion to support the separatists. This Russian move was dangerous but had the desired effect when the Ukrainian counter-terrorist operation was immediately halted by Kiev. It was an interesting standoff between two sides threatening each other with their adversary’s worst fears. Today, Kiev has upped the ante in the standoff and will test Russian resolve to prevent the Ukrainian government from regaining control of the city and its light weapons stockpile.

Cutting off Kiev’s Strategic Weapons Reserve

Such a standoff has illuminated a number of strategic factors. The multiple seizures of government buildings in eastern Ukraine, not just in Slavyansk but also in Konstantinovka in Donetsk Oblast are aimed to make it impossible for Ukrainian forces to fully control the territory and, in effect, to cut it off from its strategic stockpile of light arms which are the essence of Kiev’s present deterrent posture.

Whereas symbolic government buildings in other cities might be occupied by Russian separatists for political and symbolic reasons, in Slavyansk the separatists effectively control the whole city and the immediate surrounding area. They have physical control over the strategic weapons reserve.

Posted by: Tea | May 4, 2014 4:24:47 PM | 45

Kiev knows that it has a strategic reserve of Kalashnikov assault rifles and other light weapons stored in Ukraine as a mobilisation reserve dating back to Soviet times. It has hinted quietly but strongly in back channels between Ukrainian and Russian military establishments that it might be prepared to open this strategic reserve of weapons to an eastern Ukrainian population prepared to resist any Russian military incursions.

Since the stockpile consists of up to five million weapons, the prospect would be a nightmare for Russian military planners if they realistically prepared to move into eastern areas of Ukraine. The prospect of civil war and an anti-Russian insurgency on an unprecedented scale with unpredictable consequences represents a real – if extremely dangerous – bargaining chip for Kiev.

OTHER than the Royal Services Institute, and what looks like it's employees "Dr Igor Sutyagin, Research Fellow, Russian Studies; Professor Michael Clarke, Director General; Dr Jonathan Eyal, International Director and International Studies Director", is there any other source for this claim of a massive weapons cache in Slavyansk

Cos, tbh, the "Royal Services Institute" is hardly a reliable source in this instance

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 4:30:55 PM | 46

Putin suggests Kiev talks to eastern Ukrainian separatists - German - phone call Putin - Merkel

Schwerpunkt des Gesprächs war laut der stellvertretenden Regierungssprecherin Christiane Wirtz die Vorbereitung des geplanten Besuchs des Schweizer Bundespräsidenten und OSZE-Vorsitzenden Didier Burkhalter am Mittwoch in Moskau. Dabei solle unter anderem die Einrichtung Runder Tische unter der Schirmherrschaft der OSZE erörtert werden.

The call concentrated on the preparations for the planned visit of Swiss president and OSCE chair Didier Burkhalter in Moscow on Wednesday. Burkhalter is supposed to discuss the establishment of round table dialogues organized by OSCE.

Presumably the Kyiv offensive has been stopped. There is nothing to gain now.

Posted by: somebody | May 4, 2014 4:34:36 PM | 47

somebody

Well we remember the meeting some weeks back, it didnt generate anything good but a military assault. I hope you are right though..

Posted by: Anonymous | May 4, 2014 4:46:29 PM | 48

"is there any other source for this claim of a massive weapons cache in Slavyansk?"

Posted by: lol | May 4, 2014 4:30:55 PM | 46

That is why I posted it.
I am wondering.

Posted by: Tea | May 4, 2014 4:50:08 PM | 49

when the eastern ukraine comes out on the other side, i believe it will institute a new form of government . . . a step towards social equality through a more direct democracy utilizing the internet. the anarchist and communist history of east ukraine is a rich legacy. the world is lucky that the brave people of the east ukraine are taking matters into their own hands, once again. they are teaching us all, they are helping us brothers and sisters in the west.

power to the people, right on

Posted by: anonymous | May 4, 2014 5:17:21 PM | 50

I'm sorry but does anyone think that it is going to be easier for the people of Odessa to fight the Kyiv regime? The police have made it clear what they will allow the regime's true believers to do. People will only rise up against that terror when they hope for something worth risking their lives for. In this case, it is against the rule of the oligarchs. Frankly it is the Right Sector that has made a play for that support, which is exactly why it is powerful beyond its official numbers.

It is not even clear what the so-called pro-Russians or anti-government forces stand for? It seems pretty clear that the only really popular positions are for federalization and neutralization, but maybe the self-defense forces really are for independence or Russian federation? But maybe they would be satisfied with just federalization? After all, the elected government was overthrown precisely to ensure that Ukraine commited to EU. (And could NATO be far behind?) The only thing that's certain is that they aren't anti-oligarch. It's not clear where they stand on the Party of Regions. It's not clear where they stand on Presidential elections. Why wouldn't they accept Poroshenko? Being an oligarch isn't a problem for them, so far as we know.

Given the extreme political weakness of the movement, there is no reason whatsoever to think that time is on their side. The committed neofascists are a small portion of the population but they have a program and they have foreign allies who are actually intervening.

I agree that Putin has no intention of intervening. It hardly matters why Putin is indifferent to the victory of neofascism in a state on his nation's borders.
The EU and US will gladly assist Putin in falsifying and hiding the atrocities the neofascists commit in their campaign to assemble a force that can repress the people. Even if the oligarchs manage to win the ensuing struggle with the neofascists, the damage done to the society and the precedent set for other neofascists will wreak lasting havoc.

Posted by: stevenjohnson | May 4, 2014 5:19:06 PM | 51

Russia should perhaps give weapons to Ukranian insurgents as US has done for years inSyria.

Posted by: Andoheb | May 4, 2014 5:21:39 PM | 52

59

There are - lots of sources - eg RT?

Posted by: somebody | May 4, 2014 5:28:06 PM | 53

dh | May 4, 2014 4:06:37 PM | 43

Those sieges are going to have an impact on the attitudes of many of the citizens living in those two cities. I think most of the pols seem to show that even among those people who identify as "Russian" culturally who live in the the Donbas region they still accept that they are Ukrainian nationals. Nothing like a siege of their cities by the "Ukrainian" army to change that perspective.

Given that these sieges have to be the worse thing that Kiev could be doing right now. They are in effect turning people who once considered themselves Ukrainians into Russians. This has to be a major sign that those offensives against Sloviansk and Kramatorsk failed miserably.

b is right. There is no need for Russia to send in their troops at this point.

That is the situation in the Donbas. But what is happening in Odessa and Mariupol?

Posted by: ToivoS | May 4, 2014 5:31:51 PM | 54

Interesting When You Slow-Dance with the Devil, You Can't See His Face | Ukrainian Diaspora in Canada, USA


"For the same day your court in Donetsk ruled to strip [Ukrainian Ultra Nationalist hero Stepan] Bandera of his Hero title, God bestowed the best gift possible to our family: the birth of Stepan Bandera's fifth great-grandchild... This was the third-generation Stepan Bandera's open letter to Ukrainian President Victor Yanukovych in 2010.

The first Bandera's grandson is a former editor and reporter for the Kiev Post, and you can read his own take on Ultra Nationalists like Oleh Tyanhybok here.

From a Kiev Post interview lunch with the grandson of national hero Stepan Bandera, by Paul Miazga, Kyiv Post Staff Writer, April 20, 2005:

"Bandera, who currently writes for New York City's [Ukrainian] Diaspora newspaper The National Tribune , never knew his grandfather, who was killed by a KGB agent in 1959. But he has an affinity with him.... "Our family has always been very tight, very Ukrainian.' Bandera's father--also a nationalist activist--died under mysterious circumstances back in 1984, just like his grandfather. "I came to Ukraine looking for a fight,' he says."

Aside from being a journalist supporting his family's claim to an Ultra Nationalist Ukraine, Mr. Bandera plays a much larger role behind the scenes. This second-generation homegrown Canadian Ukrainian Ultra Nationalist helped Americanize the ultra-nationalist movement in Ukraine through his influence in America's civil, political, and business circles.

The CUSUR (Center for US-Ukrainian Relations) was started as a result of the continuing support for a free Ukraine in three US presidential administrations. The "free" in "free Ukraine" refers to an ultra-nationalist Ukraine that Mr. Bandera's grandfather would be proud of.

First under President Bill Clinton, and then through two terms of GW Bush, both the US and Ukrainian governments, and businesses in the two countries, built extensive networks that culminated in the event-driving Maidan movement for Ukrainian integration with the West.

The CUSUR and the UCCA (Ukrainian Congressional Committee of America) are intertwined and so powerful in American politics that even a casual glance at their meeting notes or plans will give you the chills. Both groups are in fact OUN (b) (Ukrainian Ultra Nationalist) organizations that operate freely in the US, influencing National Security issues , Foreign Policy , and American National Politics.

Both Congressional Durbin brothers and Secretary of State John Kerry are enthusiastic supporters. Senator Durbin, a Lithuanian-American, has in fact stated during John Kerry's bid for the Presidency, "If John Kerry is elected, Kerry will work vigorously for Ukraine's continued independence and prosperity." That position, of course, supports the UCCA view .

Where does Mr. Bandera fit into all of this? For the last seventy years, the US has only recognized one Ukrainian government. According to CIA-released documents to which I provided links in previous articles, that one government is the Ukrainian government in Exile , led by the Stetskos. That government has now been brought back to Ukraine and cemented with the Maidan.
The Depth of the Bandera Influence

Here's a quick look at one name that appears on all of the steering committees of the CUSUR. As you'll see in UA Quest Roundtable Steering Committees , that name is Stepan Bandera...

With Bandera's involvement, CUSUR has found enthusiastic support from across the spectrum of US universities, think tanks and corporations, and from the US government itself. Sponsor companies and foundations that fund the organization include: American Foreign Policy Council, Atlantic Council, Bechtel Corporation, Coca-Cola Beverages Ukraine Ltd., Canadian Ukrainian Foundation, Delta Airlines, Halliburton, J. P. Morgan, Microsoft, National Endowment for Democracy, Philip Morris Companies, Inc., and, of course, the RAND Corporation--among many others.

At the very least, Mr. Bandera provides the brand name for the new Ukraine that US businesses and the US government can rally around.

Children of the OUN (b)

Oleksandr Ivanovych Muzychko (aka Sashko Bily) was recently gunned down in Rivne. Mr. Muzychko was a leader of the ultra-nationalist umbrella organization Pravy Sector for Western Ukraine. He was also a leader in UNA-UNSD (Ukrainian National Assembly--Ukrainian National Self-Defense), which was originally led by Yuriy-Bogdan Shukhevych, son of OUN General Roman Shukhevych and a friend of the Nazi sympathizer Slava Stetsko. Mr. Muzychko has the distinction of having the same family name as Slava Stetsko 's maiden name. It might be noted, too, that Mr. Tyanhybok is descended from a legendary Ukrainain politician, Lonhyn Tsehelsky , and that Mr. Yatsenyuk's family also has distinguished itself in service to the Nationalist cause. If you look closely at the family histories of today's Ukrainian politicians, you find that today's Stepan Bandera shares the company of the children and grandchildren of the men and women that supported his illustrious grandfather.

In the picture below, you'll find presidential hopeful and EU favorite Vitali Klitschko, his brother and his father. And, yes, that is Oleksandr Muzychko with the number "2" over his head. Mr. Muzychko introduced the Klitschko brothers to connections in America.
How Powerful are Ultra Nationalists in the US Government?

Here's a short highlight history of how groups openly working with Adolf Hitler entwined themselves and have shaped US domestic and foreign policy for the last 30 years...

In 1977 the UNA gained enough political potency to establish Human Rights Day in the nation's capital, an event hosted by Senator Bob Dole and attended by 51 members of Congress...

The Chicago School Neo-Cons, including Dick Cheney, Paul Wolfowitz, and, today, even Victoria Nuland, subscribe to Strauss' brand of ultra-nationalism. That is what the "American Exceptionalism" they all want to promote is in reality.

The Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations ( ABN ) The Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations (ABN) was formed in 1943 by OUN leader Yaroslav Stetsko, who headed it until his death in 1986. Leadership of the ABN then shifted to his wife Slava Stetsko, along with that of the OUN, which had leadership of the entire Ukrainian diaspora.

The UNA, UCCA, and many other groups and foundations all fell under the control of the ABN. After the death of (the first) Stepan Bandera in 1959, control of these groups in the US and abroad fell to the OUN (b) Ukrainian Prime Minister in Exile, Yaroslav Stetsko.

The groups that made up the ABN were and are all radical Ultra Nationalist, or Nazi, when the group leader's affiliations to Hitler are taken into account. These are the groups from which the Republican Heritage Groups Council was formed...

Jumping to 1988, an article in the Jewish Weekly forced the resignation of six Republican leaders from George HW Bush's campaign, because of their Nazi ties. All of them were members of the Republican Heritage Groups Council...

Leo Strauss and the Chicago School (the University of Chicago), where our current President was a professor, don't care whether you're liberal or conservative, as long as you agree with certain principles. As a government employee, you would be expected, like each of the members of the second group of 100 city designers, to have arrived at the same conclusions as everyone else. That is US government today.

The National Review, a respected Neo-Conservative publication, makes the point this way: " Nazism may have been an ideology to which the United States was -- and to which the President is -- implacably opposed, but it is hardly "senseless.'...

In the 1980s, John McCain was on the Advisory Board of the USWF ( United States Council for World Freedom) . Like Presidents Reagan, Bush, and GW Bush, he was in contact with the Stetskos and was in fact chairman of the most important division of Yaroslav Stetsko's ABN group. McCain eventually resigned from this position, because of the heat you have to expect when you are in the US government and some of your best friends--those in Stetsko's ABN--are Nazis, Fascists, and perpetrators of genocide...

In 2005, President Obama toured surplus weapons stockpiles in Ukraine with Senator Dick Lugar. The agreement that came out of this visit was that Ukraine would give up its nuclear weapons and, in return, the borders of Ukraine would be guaranteed. Mr. Obama played a large role in creating this pact.

The role of the National Endowment for Democracy (NED) makes clear that President Obama's views on America's role in the world are on a par with those of John McCain ...

If you combine Section 1, parts iv and v, and Section 4(a) and Section 6(c), the order is very clear: Any person, including US citizens that are only writing about the Ukrainian Revolution, or government, who represent Bandera history, philosophy, and politics in any light other than favorable to the new Bandera-led Ukrainian government, is no better than Anwar Awlaki...

I have written about Mr. Kolomoisky in a few of the articles I have published. He was the Oligarch who said about the protests in southeast Ukraine: "Give them what they want. We can hang them later." Both he and another Oligarch were reported on the news today, because they are hiring mercenary groups to quell any protests and maintain order in the regions they control...

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 5:35:03 PM | 55

Posted by: William Bowles | May 4, 2014 1:06:11 PM | 11

"I think Boris Kargalitsky's views on the situation are interesting in that Western involvement doesn't figure in his analysis at all."

Well, western involvement wouldn't figure in his color revolution style of propaganda, since it's his job to find blame for what the west does on the Russians, and absolve his western handlers. He's been doing this routine since the early 90's, and now has no credibility among Russians, who long ago saw through his game. His propaganda is for westerners, for those covertly part of the western propaganda machine on the "left" to distribute as "leftwing" analysis of Russia, and those unaware they are being psychologically manipulated by "color revolution" marketing. This is why a R2P site like Znet keeps him around and regularly trots him out as their "Russian expert" when an event involving Russia transpires that they cant conveniently ignore.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 5:39:39 PM | 56

Link to Radicals shooting at people in Odessa’s burning building caught on tape

New video has emerged online which shows a man shooting at the windows of Odessa’s burning House of Trade Unions. At least 39 anti-government activists died in the flames on May 2 in the building besieged and set ablaze by radicals.

A man in the video is wearing a bulletproof vest and is shoots several times in the direction of the burning House of Trade Unions.

Another video of the same man shows him speaking on the phone passionately arguing that he and his people are unarmed, while having to confront armed anti-government protesters. The man introduces himself as sotnik Mykola (“sotnik” is what Maidan group leaders in Kiev call themselves) He also says he was wounded in the leg by protesters, although he doesn’t look hurt in the footage.

Both the videos have gathered thousands of views on YouTube, stirring a wave of indignation at the man’s hypocrisy and his shooting at the people trapped inside the burning building.

Survivors of the fire say they had to barricade themselves inside the House of Trade Unions, to hide from an aggressive mob, which had torched their tent camp.

Radicals then began throwing Molotov cocktails at the Trade Unions building, setting it on fire. Witnesses say that those who managed to escape the fire, were severely beaten outside by the besiegers of the burning building.

“We couldn't go down, we were seeing people from other floors being brought down and then those rioters down there attacked them like a pack of wolves,” a survivor of the fire, who was hiding on the roof of the building, told RT.

Afraid of falling into the hands of radicals, people didn’t leave the House of Trade Unions, where dozens eventually burnt alive, suffocated or jumped out of windows.

The Ukrainian Interior Ministry however offers a different version of events, saying the victims of the violent unrest started the fire themselves, when they began throwing Molotov cocktails from the upper floor.

Multiple videos of the incident, however, show Molotov cocktails flying from outside the building.

Several hundred people rallied overnight in Odessa outside the local police headquarters, demanding the release of the fire survivors who had been detained on May 2.

People claim around 60 survivors of the Trade Unions House are currently being held in jails. The rally participants told journalists that anti-government activists who managed to get out of the burning building were first beaten by nationalist militants outside and then detained by police.

Many of the rally participants were holding pictures of their relatives and friends, who have been missing since clashes broke out in Odessa two days ago.

The videos described in this piece are part of the article at RT.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 5:50:31 PM | 57

For peace and security in the south-east of Ukraine Igor Kolomoisky must be targeted and neutralized. It is mostly him and his minions (Tymoshenko) who are responsible for the current bloodshed. The time to act is now.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 5:53:11 PM | 58

Link to Avoiding facts? MSM uncertain who is behind deadly Odessa blaze

Despite clear evidence that the pro-Kiev radicals set Odessa’s House of Trade Unions ablaze on Friday killing dozens, the mainstream media is being ambiguous about the causes of the tragedy.

On Friday, Ukraine’s eastern town of Odessa saw brutal street battles between pro-autonomy activists and nationalist radicals which left 46 people dead. The majority of the victims died in the Trade Unions House that was set on fire by pro-Kiev radicals.

Very carefully worded commentary on the tragedy in Odessa came from the mainstream Western media, as if they were trying to avoid assigning the blame to those who actually set the building on fire. Their coverage of the event was heavily reliant on statements from Kiev that blamed the violence on pro-autonomy activists, as well as witness accounts given by the nationalist Right Sector members.

Based on their reports, it may seem that the House of Trade Unions just caught fire.

“At some stage yesterday – and it still unclear exactly how this started – but there were rival pro-Russian and pro-Ukrainian protests here. It led to fierce street clashes, which culminated in a huge fire in a building last night,” reported Sky News.

“Violence is escalating in Ukraine. Police in normally calm Odessa say a clash between pro-Russians and government supporters led to a fire that killed at least 31 people,” said a report by Fox News.

But the actual video footage from the scene of the incident clearly shows how pro-Kiev radicals are throwing Molotov cocktails into the Trade Unions House where pro-autonomy activists were trapped.

Asked by the Washington Post who had thrown Molotov cocktails, a pro-Ukrainian activist Diana Berg admitted “Our people — but now they are helping them to escape the building.”

The BBC website merely quoted the regional office of Ukraine's Interior Ministry, writing that “it did not give details of how the blaze started,” stressing that “the exact sequence of events is still unclear.”

Reuters news agency reported that “a pro-Kiev march was ambushed, petrol bombs, stones, explosive devices were thrown, police soon lost control and the building was later set on fire.”

CNN covered the incident by stating that it was “unclear exactly what may have caused it [the fire].” Later, however, the channel acknowledged the fire was started byKiev supporters throwing Molotov cocktails at the building.

The New York Times goes with the headline: ‘Ukraine Presses Pro-Russia Militants After Fighting Spreads to a Port City.’ The words “pro-Russian militants” could create the impression that those were not just ordinary people and anti-Kiev demonstrators trapped inside a burning building, but militants. And that kind of wording can almost justify the act of killing, notes RT’s Gayane Chichakyan.

The Guardian quotes a member of extreme-right nationalist group Right Sector as saying "The aim is to completely clear Odessa [of pro-Russians]… They are all paid Russian separatists.”

Such statements - be they from Right Sector, or the coup-imposed government - perpetuates a narrative that whoever opposes the Kiev authority and feels strong ties with Russia is simply a puppet of Moscow. And this narrative is just perfectly in line with how the US and European officials see the situation. They have firmly sided themselves with the authorities in Kiev and are ready to justify and defend whatever action Kiev takes against the protesters, says Chichakyan.

The videos described are part of the article at RT.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 6:00:29 PM | 59

List of shame: Press Kit on Human Rights in Ukraine

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 6:02:21 PM | 60

Link to West doing same to Ukraine as it did to Yugoslavia in 1990s

By blaming protesters in the east of Ukraine, the EU is encouraging radicals in Kiev and risks repeating what happened in Yugoslavia in the 1990s – a civil war followed by a bombing campaign – political analyst Aleksandar Pavic told RT.

RT: A lot of denouncements have been made by the US and the EU, stopping short of actually mentioning those responsible. Why?

Aleksandar Pavic: It’s because those are the people that are being sponsored by the West. It’s very simple; their radicals are able and allowed to do whatever they want. When it comes to unarmed citizens trying to just protect their equal rights from the junta in Kiev, then those are the ones who are supposedly instigating the violence. It’s just a matter of Western clients going unpunished and they are actually getting support from the West, which is a scandal.

RT: The EU and the US clearly blame Moscow for steering it, but why are they not coming up with any proof?

AP: They don’t have proof, but we have proof that the West is instigating this. And just the other day, Catherine Ashton, the EU’s commissioner for foreign policy, pretty much gave a green light to the extremists from Kiev. She pretty much said they had a right to establish law and order within the borders of the country. I would say that the EU has blood on its hands, especially Catherine Ashton. It’s the same thing they did in Yugoslavia in the 90s, when they started encouraging radicals, extremists, secessionists. They could do no wrong. On the other hand, legal authorities in Yugoslavia could do no right. Well it’s almost the same thing, but the other way around now in Ukraine.

RT: On the one hand, they are backing Kiev’s military crackdown in the east. On the other hand, they are calling for calm. How do those two things go together?

AP: They call for calm, but they call for calm from the other side. They call for calm from people who actually just want the federalization of Ukraine. On the other hand, they’re encouraging extremists from the Right Sector who have taken up arms, probably being armed and advised by the West right now. They are giving them the green light. So this makes sense from the Western view point. It’s not at all fair, it’s not balanced, and it’s actually a criminal sort of meddling in the internal affairs of a country. They are instigating civil war right now.

RT: How worried are you about the situation? Is there any middle ground to be gained at this point, as we head towards these elections on May 25? On the one hand, Russia does not accept the legitimacy of the interim government in Kiev, but that government sees backing from the West. Is anyone going to see eye to eye here? Or do you think the situation is going to get worse?

AP: I’m very worried about the situation. I’m seeing a repeat of the events of 20 years ago when the West made sure that no peace settlement was reached until it served its own interests. Instead of having peace in Yugoslavia as early as 1991, we had four years of bloody civil war until 1995, when the West got what it wanted. And then it opened up a new front again in 1999, with bombing Yugoslavia. They supported terrorists in Kosovo; they’re supporting them today. So as long as the West keeps doing that, and as long as we see the same people running things in Washington and Brussels, in London and Berlin – today as then – I don’t expect any good news anytime soon, unfortunately.

RT: Do you think the elections planned for May 25 will help calm the situation?

AP: Absolutely not. This cannot be a regular election under any circumstances, even if a ceasefire was somehow reached in the next couple of days; there’s no trust within the country anymore. It will take quite a while for that trust to be instituted. So on May 25 to have real elections – it will be a joke.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 6:05:53 PM | 61

Obama prepares to smash BRICS during his last few years in office

Posted by: Propeace | May 4, 2014 6:06:28 PM | 62

they won't be able to cover this up for long

Pravy Sector was inside the trade union building at the time of the fire.

Posted by: somebody | May 4, 2014 6:14:44 PM | 63

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 6:02:21 PM | 60

"List of shame: Press Kit on Human Rights in Ukraine"

Thanks for bringing that Voltaire.net article to attention here. Articles like that which pack a lot of data are extremely useful as references.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 6:18:56 PM | 64

the russian /soviet anthem was recently heard loud and clear in a rally in berlin...if NATO is pushing its missiles east, russia is moving west

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 6:47:38 PM | 65

These photos seem to indicate that the fire in Odessa was a professional operation.
http://vvv-ig.livejournal.com/690116.html
But I don't speak Russian, so will someone help translate.

I don't think the Right Sector has been involved in such an operation before. It is outside of what they normally do.

That means, that maybe someone else is behind the fire.
Is Kiev hoping that this terrible attack starts a civil war??

Posted by: plantman | May 4, 2014 7:09:17 PM | 66

For the moment Russia's geopolitical ambitions seem to have been reduced to the security of its borders. How can Putin get the development of a multi-polar world order back on track?

Posted by: ess emm | May 4, 2014 2:14:27 PM | 18

as long as europeans etc keep voting for the political parties they do...so long will a multi polar world be difficult to achieve

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 7:19:47 PM | 67

"What is left to do then for Washington is to create more chaos in Ukraine and to hope that somehow out of total chaos some new chance may arise to stick it to Russia. For lack of real direction that strategy is also unlikely to succeed."

Exactly. Repeated failure never stopped a neocon from pursuing their wet dreams yet, though. Just look at the last month:

1) Brennan visits Kiev, "anti-terror" ops begin. And fail.
2) Biden visits Kiev, ops renewed in earnest. Fail again.
3) IMF threatens the gravy train for fascists, more attacks in the East. Dunno if Odessa related. Nothing of note achieved.
4), 5), 6)... ????? Like b predicts, just more chaos, my concern is that they'll just keep trying, whether thru IMF or other bodies exerting pressure, or digging deep into the Gladio playbook, maybe even some potentially grand false flag spectacle, at the expense of more Ukrainian lives senselessly lost, and achieving exactly nothing but increased resentment against the US the world overr, increased resolve by the Brics to hurry up and break away with more and more partners, and of course MSM coming further detached from reality, as per scalawag @59. Disgraceful, And also potentially counter-productive as increasing numbers of people see thru the blatant cover ups and lies. I also agree the elections on May 25th have no hope for calming anything down, I just wonder how long the US and partners in crime will keep it up, and at what point Russia really had no choice but to respond should the provocations escalate, or just spin out of control.

Posted by: Colinjames | May 4, 2014 7:33:52 PM | 68

@scalawag you are welcome. I really enjoy reading your posts, very informative.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 7:45:49 PM | 69

I still cannot understand why the massacre in Odessa was not prevented? Everybody was expecting something like this, possibilities of atrocities committed by PS were widely discussed everywhere, what were the victims expecting ? Why not prepared for defense in advance. Unbelievable.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 7:57:13 PM | 70

@70 No, very believable.

East Ukrainians still think West Ukrainian NeoNazis have humanity. A naive thought: Theyre fighting animals.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 8:17:26 PM | 71

@70 the victims were attacked in their tent camp and ran for safety to the building. The police - who were definitely in collusion - opened a corridor for the assassins to move through and enter the building. Molotovs were thrown from the outside into the building, people trying to flee the building were beaten and killed outside, and now it appears that assassins were also inside the building simultaneously executing the victims. The victims I surmise included a lot of people not prepared for combat. As stated, they were surprised and attacked in their tent camp and chased into the "safety" of the building. The forensic aftermath increasingly suggests a planned and very well executed massacre.

Sorry - no links. This is just my synopsis of the available links posted everywhere.

Posted by: Grieved | May 4, 2014 8:31:23 PM | 72

@Massinissa, Grieved Thank you. It's heart breaking even more because I have been following the wars in Libya and Syria and the lesson learnt is - always expect the worst, below animal, behavior. Thus I knew: if opportunity emerges, something like this would happen. I hope other federalists are prepared well now to prevent such massacres. Shouldn't Russia train them somehow, even remotely? May the Providence protect them!

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 8:50:34 PM | 73

actually here's a link I don't think has been posted here yet - it's in English, about the events leading to the massacre:
Odessa, Ukraine (Novorossiya). New facts about how local citizens were burried.

Posted by: Grieved | May 4, 2014 8:51:30 PM | 74

Posted by: Grieved | May 4, 2014 8:51:30 PM | 74

Something went wrong with the link. Here it is again (hopefully).

Link to Odessa, Ukraine (Novorossiya). New facts about how local citizens were burried.

I was just going to post that account, and another account.

Posted by: scalawag | May 4, 2014 9:01:59 PM | 75

This is a very important article about the Odessa massacre. It is in Russia but please read it. It explain what real happened. It has many graphic pictures but it is a very important article. http://ruposters.ru/archives/4749.
Here a video where you can seen what happened to the people tried to escape. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbeUmpQ_4nU

Posted by: Umbertoz | May 4, 2014 10:06:44 PM | 77

They used napalm for burning the people. It means it was organized

Posted by: Umbertoz | May 4, 2014 10:07:47 PM | 78

Possible? Seems to fill in some missing pieces.. CIA disinfo agent Booth reports:
US Refuses To Take Back 13 Dead CIA Spies Killed In Ukraine

Posted by: ProPeace | May 4, 2014 10:18:05 PM | 79

1. Victoria Stellar ‏@intercaprica 6 hrs
The most frightening is huge number of jokes within fascists about people BURNT ALIVE IN ODESS."RUSSIAN WEEKS IN KFC" pic.twitter.com/gymCl9Peuw
(KFC! May not care for the association !)

1. Steiner ‏@Steiner1776 5 hrs
@Lehermayr @marcelsardo Das ist noch gar nicht. Das hier ist gerade der Hit bei den #Euromaidan Leuten pic.twitter.com/4kcEx4d9rs
(note the America flag on the bottled of fried Russian sauce….do the americans want them and their flag to be associated with massmurder?)
1. Steiner ‏@Steiner1776 5 hrs
#Ukraine #Kramatorsk today. 60m long St.George ribbon in the center pic.twitter.com/9ihiVwSmYD via @PogrebnyakAA
1. Retweeted by Steiner
АЛЕКСАНДР ПОГРЕБНЯК ‏@PogrebnyakAA 6 hrs
04.05.2014.#Краматорск. Георгиевская лента,длиной 60м у Краматорского горисполкома. #слвянск #РусскаяВесна #Донбасс pic.twitter.com/oAZbRsMEtc
1. billmon ‏@billmon1 6 hrs
Right Sector guys in Odessa marched down to hall where they burned people to death in order to hoist UKR flag over ruins. How appropriate.
1. Mark Sleboda ‏@MarkSleboda1 7 hrs
Right Sector mob must be getting close to ruined Trade Union bldg all armed heavies w clubs, medieval weapons + shields to front Battlelines
(a real mob)
1. Steiner ‏@Steiner1776 7 hrs
Urgent! #Ukraine #Odessa #PravySector wants to place ukr. flag on top of trade union building where they murdered 46 ppl via @stopnarcotics
1. Petr Shelomovskiy ‏@stopnarcotics 5h
Pro Ukrainian activists teared down and set on fire a Soviet flag near Trade Union building in #Odessa, #Ukraine
2. Petr Shelomovskiy ‏@stopnarcotics 5h
New Police chief of #Odessa is addressing pro Ukrainian activists in Ukranian only 1.5 hours after being appointed pic.twitter.com/hSbM7qnmji
Mike Giglio @mike_giglio • May 2
We were taken from a pro-Russia checkpoint en route to Slovyansk, blindfolded and held at occupied police building. The ordeal took 3 hours.

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 10:32:15 PM | 80

At bottom of page , is VICE news tell us what they think of president Putin?i #mediaobjectivity !
VICE News @vicenews • May 1
Russia is now just mind-fucking former Soviet republics: http://bit.ly/R3esa5 pic.twitter.com/pG6rbMpLVq

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 10:34:41 PM | 81

swedish diplomacy...long gone are the days of Olof Palme...Proof states and men can devolve

1. Marina Smolnikova ‏@m_smolnikova May 2
@carlbildt @akarlin88 The height of Swedish diplomacy - referring to people as thugs. Your nation should be ashamed of you.
1. Marina Smolnikova ‏@m_smolnikova May 2
@GrahamWP_UK @carlbildt @akarlin88 I was shocked! A SWEDISH diplomat! Dead activists, whoever they were supporting, are PEOPLE, not thugs.

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 10:41:24 PM | 82

1. Anatoly Karlin ‏@akarlin88 May 1
In April, Putin's approval rating rose to 82%; record number of Russians think country is heading in right direction. http://www.levada.ru/30-04-2014/aprelskie-reitingi-odobreniya-i-doveriya
(what would be the current approval rating of swedens FM Carl Bildt?)

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 10:43:23 PM | 83

@81

The West is getting more stupid by the day if they actually believe Russia is behind this stuff using some kind of super secret techniques.

Its almost like the Cold War hysteria about demigod-like Russian espionage agents is back again.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 4, 2014 10:55:28 PM | 84

@brian #81:

That piece manages to talk about information war and the Ukraine without mentioning Victoria Nuland. Vice is worse than traditional media like BBC, Guardian, and NY Times. Those can't really be called Russophobic, but Vice certainly is.

Posted by: Demian | May 4, 2014 11:06:03 PM | 85

ProPeace | May 4, 2014 5:35:03 PM | 55

Interesting piece on the Bandera family. It has been clear for many years that after WWII the US allowed large numbers of "minority" fascist groups to settle in the US and Canada. Not just Ukrainians but also Latvians and Croatians. They established communities around the Great Lakes. They became prosperous. They influenced US policy. George Kennan in his memoirs complained about how hard it was for any rational foreign policy dealing with Yugoslavia and the Soviet Union because of these ex-patriate communities.

One would have thought after the first generation died this problem would dissapate. But it seems not just their children but also their grand and great grand children carry on the cause of their fascist ancestors. Ukrainian, Latvian and Croation nationalism lives on in the US.

Posted by: ToivoS | May 4, 2014 11:22:05 PM | 86

The following is a Lonely Planet author(!() ex BBC, so one can guess his drift:
1. Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin 18h
One of Euromaidan feeds resorts to open xenophobia. Almost 100K followers. pic.twitter.com/lIBoEBtDa0
(Vicki Nulland opened pandoras box)
1. Retweeted by Leonid Ragozin
Jack Stubbs ‏@jc_stubbs May 2
Pro-Rus separatists have seized #Donetsk Railways control centre, paralysing all train movement in the region - Railways spokes via @Reuters
(good idea…to prevent the ttransport of many of the sort who murdered in Odessa…but the western media wont see it that way)
1. Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin May 3
Not sure about Odessa, but in Kharkiv separatists were burning tires inside the government building for no reason at all. Back in April.
(better than burning people!)
HOW uis the following Orwellian?
1. Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin May 3
Orwellian: Russian MFA says release of OSCE hostages is a testament to Sloviansk defenders' courage & humanism. http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/730341
(now how is that Orwellian? After all the OSCE hostages weren’t burned aiv, disembowled, beheaded etc)

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:32:07 PM | 87

Retweeted by Leonid Ragozin
Carl Bildt ‏@carlbildt ·May 2
Those responsible for all the deaths in Odessa must be brought to justice, and peace and calm restored to this beautiful city.

(NOW THATS Orwellian!) leo spent too long in the bowels of the BBC

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:34:46 PM | 88

1. Retweeted by Leonid Ragozin
The White House ‏@WhiteHouse May 2
“The Ukrainian government has shown remarkable restraint throughout this whole process.” —President Obama #Ukraine

(that too is orwellian! And Leo doesn’t call it such…has he ever read Orwell?)

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:37:22 PM | 89

Posted by: Demian | May 4, 2014 11:06:03 PM | 85

after Ann Marie Slaughter, VICE has the most appropriate name!

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:39:14 PM | 90

the liberal mindset is best exemplafied by the following NINI tweet

Retweeted by Leonid Ragozin
Roland Oliphant ‏@RolandOliphant ·May 2
War of words already out of control over Odessa tragedy. This will be a day that lives in infamy for both sides in Ukraine.
=================
both sides? how many of the burn victims were pravysektor? who humiliated he survivors?
Neither Oilphant nor Leo have done their homework...
leo has been doing his best to implicate the russians in his NINI manner
so:
Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·May 3
State Duma deputy Ilya Drozdov says Ukrainian policemen besieged in Luhansk should be burnt alive. pic.twitter.com/JlF1t4rMgp

yes but has he burnt anyone alive? Leo is equating those who express outrage an atrocity and the desire for revenge (newflash to LEO: victims of the fires were all ethnic russians) with those who commit the atrocity.

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:47:27 PM | 91

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·May 2
Russian invasion into Ukraine very much in the cards now. Now or never.

wishful thinking by exBBC now Lonely Planey star Leo?

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:49:46 PM | 92

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·May 2
Thanks to @howardamos for outstanding reporting of Odessa battle today.

oh really? Howard is also a NINI

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:51:16 PM | 93

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·May 2
@sebsebezz Might be better to go via Belarus on a transit visa. There is a serious danger of getting caught up in invasion.View conversation

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·May 2
Mass betrayal by police seems to be essential part of Putin's strategy in Ukraine #Odessa
==================

im calling this Leothink! Leo is keen to have Putin(aka the russian army) invade.
but the idea Putin(who is in russia) waves his wand and the ukrainian police(who are in ukraine) decide on 'betrayal' shows magical thinking at its best, as well as a tendencey to wipe out sections of history such as the MURDER OF BEYKUT POLICE BY THE JUNTA/PRAVYSEKTOR...

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:55:31 PM | 94

early eg of Leothink:

Retweeted by Leonid Ragozin
EU Crimean Tatar ‏@CrimeaEU ·May 2
Today Crimean Tatar leader Cemilev was refused to enter Crimea via Moscow by the authorities & sent back to Kiev. pic.twitter.com/6UGxzqMhYi
------------------------------
the idea Leo is playing with here in retweeting is that the pesky russians have taken control of the Krimea, and their obvious racism is keeping out this tartar (leader?)...who has come FROM that bastion of liberal values KIEV with its Junta and [philosophy of race purification)
Thats the sort of upper class twit whom the BBC populated their offices

Posted by: brian | May 4, 2014 11:59:24 PM | 95

Hm, this sounds fishy to me:

Police in the eastern port of Mariupol said pro-Russian rebels posing as sympathisers had presented soldiers at a checkpoint with gifts of food.

"It turned out that the food contained a substance that induced sleep among the servicemen," the acting head of Mariupol criminal police department, Alexei Paniotov, said.

"After about half an hour, about 20 unidentified people arrived in three cars and, taking advantage of their helpless state, took them prisoner along with four automatic rifles, a grenade launcher, a machinegun and ammunition."

The five soldiers were freed after negotiations.

I don't know anything about pharmacology, but I should think it would be hard to get the dose right if you're giving someone spiked food. Sounds more like the local head cop was making excuses to his bosses.

Posted by: Demian | May 5, 2014 12:03:59 AM | 96

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·Apr 29
Putin urges talks between Kiev and separatists, rants about "Maidan cakes" whatever it is. http://ria.ru/world/20140429/1005974842.html
-----------
#leothink

Putin fans(not this one) like to see Putin bearing arms or riding bears..Putin foes like to claim he 'rants'.....President Putin doeas neither..

Posted by: brian | May 5, 2014 12:05:37 AM | 97

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·Apr 29
Just how many times have Russian channels violated Russian anti-terror laws by airing interviews with hostage-takers?

translation...leo doesnt like the russians! #leothink #penisenvy

Posted by: brian | May 5, 2014 12:06:59 AM | 98

Leonid Ragozin ‏@leonidragozin ·Apr 29
People who hate journalists for calling them separatists MT “@VoiceOfDonetsk: Луганск сегодня! pic.twitter.com/du3x0qRaVs”
.................

No ,,,,really?! the journalist is the offspsing from an illicit liason betwen a spy and a prostitute

Posted by: brian | May 5, 2014 12:09:58 AM | 99

All this terrible double-speak. In that link from scalawag @75, a fighter in the field learns from direct experience how the whole false-flag, Big Lie tactic works and describes it better than anything I've ever seen:

By the way, giving a common Ukraine informational overview - I understood a simple and genius Idea of the Maidan. Maidan is built on the Lie, completely from start to the end. Lie loud, lie crazy, lie first, and immediately condemn your opponent: 1) in the things you did, 2) in lying. Be loud and repeat. Keep your mass emotional, for them not to start thinking and see the real guilties in people troubles.

Odessa, Ukraine (Novorossiya). New facts about how local citizens were burried.

"Lie loud, lie crazy, lie first" - this is what has to be fought.

Posted by: Grieved | May 5, 2014 12:10:46 AM | 100

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