Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 15, 2014

Obama Urges Ukraine's Military To Not Get Involved (Two Month Ago)

Obama says the U.S. urges Ukraine's military not to get involved in a conflict that must be resolved politically. He's expressing outrage about images of Ukrainian security forces firing automatic guns on Ukrainian people.

Obama says in a statement that Ukraine should respect the right of protest and that protesters must be peaceful. He's calling for dialogue to reduce tensions and address the people's grievances.

While that sounds somewhat reasonable, it is not what Obama now says about the current attack by the Ukrainian military on so far rather peaceful protesters in Donetsk oblast. He said the above two month ago while U.S. financed brutes from Maidan occupied government buildings, hailed hundreds of Molotov cocktails on policemen and stormed the parliament to stage their coup.

For a usually slick operator that Obama is such obvious double talk is pretty embarrassing.

Posted by b on April 15, 2014 at 10:10 AM | Permalink

Comments
next page »

Nice one, b..

Like I said, everything go downhill from here... The meeting on Thursday won't happen either.

This latest move has NATO all over it. Time is of the essence and they think they need to secure strategic locations before the revolt in the East becomes entrenched.


The next chapter of European civil war's just begun. They never learn!

Posted by: Zico | Apr 15, 2014 10:14:17 AM | 1

B,

Now that the "anti-terrorist" operation has started, will Russia intervene?

Posted by: OAB | Apr 15, 2014 10:34:23 AM | 2

Turchinov: "I will personally lead the gay parade.I hope we will have lots of guests from EU and US".
The homosexual event is to take place on May 9th in place of the traditionally held Victory day parade which celebrated victory over fascism.

http://zergulio.livejournal.com/1174475.html

Original source: http://up-photo.ru/img/2014-04/11/7lwo3el6dqda9u87xedf5nrup.jpg

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 15, 2014 10:35:36 AM | 3

@1

I agree. It looks like the dumbsters who've been in charge of US foreign policy for the past 15 years are getting desperate. I think its hard to underestimate the adverse selection into the US policy elite that's been going on since the Clinton presidency. They are what a French fried of mine scathingly calls 'bons éleves' (good students)--i.e., the kind that are smart, get good marks, play it safe and have no imagination to get them past the conventional wisdom they mastered to get ahead. I'm being generous here. Others see more sinister designs. I just see stupidity. Obama is the top of that class.

Posted by: Knut | Apr 15, 2014 10:38:21 AM | 4

Russian Market ‏@russian_market 2m
Mobile networks down in Kramatorsk

the better to conduct a slaughter

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 10:41:58 AM | 5

Retweeted Crimea&East (@IndependentKrym):

@russian_market plane poured flammable liquid&fired to burn/smoke out soldiers defending the base&kill them easier http://t.co/o7mxTDRE8q

Crimea&East ‏@IndependentKrym 16m
so why Russia doesn't intervene??RT @myrevolutionrus There are victims among civilians near the airport Kramatorsk - Rossiya24.

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 10:43:49 AM | 6

Breaking

Kiev junta using military jet against own people.
In the city Kramatorsk, Donetsk republic, military jet opened fire by aircraft guns.According to other reports the aircraft were shot flares against antiaircraft missiles. Nevertheless, the fact the use by the fascist junta a jet against its own people confirmed.

Watch video
In 0.35 people tell: "It launch something"
In end of video you can hear sound of fire launched from aircraft guns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjjEnTSpSaY&feature=youtu.be

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 10:45:00 AM | 7

OAB #2 – will Russia intervene?

I do not think so. The people will win, NATO will lose. There is no need for Russia to get involved.

The birth of Novorossiya has been a slow and protracted one because it is a breech birth; the baby is about to come out buttocks and feet first. Many have suggested that birth should be given by Caesarean – or Putinean – section; splitting Ukraine in half right in the middle, with tanks if needed. Other, more skillful midwives suggest that the fetus can be maneuvered into the right presentation, so that birth is, if not painless, at least bloodless.

The fundamental force driving events in the Ukraine is not separatism in the east but separatism in the west. Banderist want to free themselves of the "Russian yoke". We cannot solve the problems in Ukraine by cutting off the head (Donbas), we have to cut off the wart in the butt (Galicia or Banderastan Proper).

For the inevitable to happen, the center must first collapse. The east must gain strength. The next thing we will hopefully see, is Galicia exercising its right to self-determination and slipping out of Kyiv control.

The West fears and some in the Resistance hope that Russia would simply step in and enforce the desired solution by military force. That will not happen for a very simple reason, Russia is not America! The fundamental principal of Russian foreign policy is – and has been for centuries – respect for international law. Russia will only act when it has the approval of the "international community."

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 15, 2014 10:45:53 AM | 8

We need to bring George W. Bush out of retirement and let him deal with Putin. He and Putin have a great relationship and understanding. Bush looked into Putin's soul and knows Putin is a good man. Plus, Bush is White. I don't think Putin likes Obama because he's Black and Obama doesn't like Putin because Putin doesn't blink (he literally doesn't blink).

So, impeach Obama and install Bush as the U.S. version of Putin and all of this will quickly blow over. Bush is so fond of Putin, he even painted him. I highlighted the artwork in my latest blog post. I'm thinking Obama hasn't painted Putin…not yet, at least. There's still time once Obama retires. I can't wait to see his rendition.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Apr 15, 2014 10:47:32 AM | 9

Posted by: OAB | Apr 15, 2014 10:34:23 AM | 2

Do you think the Kyiv government is able to get control of all of the country?

Russia will act as in Syria - they will support people who fight.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 10:51:22 AM | 10

Yup, now that the groundwork has been laid by the intel agencies and their minions, it's time to call in the big guns and really get the murder wagon rolling!!!

With every CIA/USAID "color revolution"/putsch more data is left to analyze about the empire of mass-murder and its willing war criminal minions. This is the second part(forgive if already posted) in a great 3 part series on USAID and associated NGOs and their involvement in Ukraine, Syria, etc etc and how it's all part and parcel of a the larger propaganda machine of US war criminals. All three parts very good.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Apr 15, 2014 10:51:35 AM | 11

From "Truth about Ukraine" FB Page"

Breaking

Kiev junta using military jet against own people.
In the city Kramatorsk, Donetsk republic, military jet opened fire by aircraft guns.According to other reports the aircraft were shot flares against antiaircraft missiles. Nevertheless, the fact the use by the fascist junta a jet against its own people confirmed.

Watch video
In 0.35 people tell: "It launch something"
In end of video you can hear sound of fire launched from aircraft guns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjjEnTSpSaY&feature=youtu.be

Posted by: ChrisMclavelli | Apr 15, 2014 10:58:26 AM | 12

Russian Spring ‏@diablo3xnews 8m
@RT_russian reports 4 dead, 2 injured in #Краматорск #Kramatorsk #Ukraine airport shooting. 2 Army helicopters, Massive tanks, 500 soldiers.

Alec Luhn ‏@ASLuhn 9m
Hands off Donbass! Locals chant, crowded around government commander

Alec Luhn ‏@ASLuhn 12m
Are we terrorists!? Locals yell at anti-terrorist operation commander

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:06:05 AM | 13

Russian Spring @diablo3xnews 15h
a must see! Victoria Nuland made a new song called: "Fuck the EU" - #EU #US #Ukraine #Russia https://soundcloud.com/acidpauli/fuck-the-eu

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:07:24 AM | 14

Alec Luhn ‏@ASLuhn 10m
Locals throw rocks at troops, soldiers fire in air

Alec Luhn ‏@ASLuhn 12m
Locals facing off with troops at gates to airfield. Shots fired in air

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:12:01 AM | 15

Truth about situation in Ukraine
7 minutes ago
Armed gangs of Kiev junta opened fire at an airport near Kramatorsk, people's militia fighters from Donetsk republic army have 2 wounded report agency RIA-Novosti .

"Representatives of the Ukrainian army APCs drove to the military airfield between Kramatorsk and Slavyansk . They entered into negotiations with the self-defense forces that controlled airfield. Suddenly the shooting started . Among the militia are wounded , perhaps killed . The remaining militia blocked the entrances to Kramators'k and ready to repel attacks "- was quoted as saying one of the self defense forces.

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:14:14 AM | 16

Actually it sounds more like comedy than serious war.

But obviously locals clearly show they mean it.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 11:18:32 AM | 17

RT ‏@RT_com 11m
MORE: Angry Kramatorsk locals w/Russian flag & molotovs, Kiev troops & masked militia now hold airfield (via @ASLuhn) http://on.rt.com/1q9y34

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:23:01 AM | 18

Russia sounds very relaxed - actually a lot like the UN human rights report

Medvedev hopes Kiev ‘has brains’ to avoid escalation in eastern Ukraine

Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev said on Tuesday he hoped that the authorities in the Ukrainian capital have “enough brains” to prevent a further escalation of the conflict in the east of the country, Reuters said. “Ukraine is on the brink of civil war and it is scary,” he said after a meeting with his counterparts from Belarus and Kazakhstan. The only way to normalize the situation is to create conditions for economic development and dialogue so that the interests of all ethnic groups are taken into account and ethnic Russians can use their language, he said.

Now, West, what do you want - civil war or a united Ukraine?

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 11:29:48 AM | 19

Terre ‏@terbleu 11m
Self-defense forces: the attackers in Kramatorsk were dressed like "Right Sector" ppl, some spoke foreign languages http://russian.rt.com/article/27918

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:29:58 AM | 20

Kiev's military hardware storms Ukrainian south-east. LIVE UPDATES

http://voiceofrussia.com/2014_04_14/Ukraine-crisis-Kiev-calls-for-full-scale-antiterrorist-operation-in-south-east-LIVE-UPDATES-0336/

"19:19 Self-defense forces of Ukraine's Lugansk region have stopped a column of armored vehicles approaching the regional center, regional council deputy Yuriy Khokhlov told Interfax on the telephone.

19:16 Shots are being fired at the airdrome near the city of Kramatorsk and one fighter plane has been shot down, witnesses report from the scene, TASS reports."

Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:33:58 AM | 21

@ b: "For a usually slick operator that Obama is such obvious double talk is pretty embarrassing."

Just saying and doing what he's told. He's given NO latitude on Foreign Policy. That area of governance is for his owners to dictate.

Posted by: ben | Apr 15, 2014 11:34:50 AM | 22

President Obama talks just like Tony Blair
during his first few days after winning election in 1997.

He made a big talk about peace, while planning war.
(also he has often made many references during his tenure as PM and to St. Augustine,about the so-called just-war doctrine)

Thats why they call it the welfare-warfare state

Posted by: chris m | Apr 15, 2014 11:40:49 AM | 23

Interesting. CNN as opposed to Reuters is able to read a UN report correctly. They also introduce rarely mentioned facts.

After then-Ukrainian leader Yanukovych backed out of a deal with the European Union in November in favor of closer ties with Russia, he was forced from office in February, the result of months of protests in Kiev.

Distrust among the population in eastern Ukraine, the base of Yanukovych's power, grew as the new national government shifted rapidly in a pro-Western direction. A short time later, pro-Russian elements occupied the Black Sea peninsula of Crimea, which Russia annexed in March. Since then, pro-Russian protesters have taken to the streets in eastern Ukraine and in some cases stormed and occupied buildings.

Kiev's fragile new government and the West accuse Russia of destabilizing the region as a pretext potentially to send in troops to protect the local Russian-speaking population.

NATO says Russian armed forces are massing on Ukraine's eastern border, while Moscow says they are merely carrying out military exercises.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 11:45:17 AM | 24

There is no way the barely-functioning Ukrainian military can subdue the Donets Basin. If they go all in and start slaughtering civilians in earnest that will just bring more people into the streets. If they try to send APCs into the streets of Slovyansk all hell is going to break lose. The economy is on the verge of collapse.

This is the Brennan-dictated last gasp of the putschists to create some mojo before Geneva. But like everything the U.S./EU manages these days, it looks like a debacle in the making.

Posted by: Mike Maloney | Apr 15, 2014 11:48:05 AM | 25

I hope the spetsnaz takes down the Ukranian stooges. At the very least an airstrike like in Benghazi. It would be the most amazing revenge, responsibility to protect.

Posted by: Fernando | Apr 15, 2014 11:50:52 AM | 26

Hey, check out this petition for Putin & Lavrov:

I originally found it on vineyardsaker

it's symbolic, but never the less..

Posted by: Axle | Apr 15, 2014 11:53:40 AM | 27

@27 - axle - change.org is one bullshit site.

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 12:01:56 PM | 28

Nato Chief Anders Fuck Rasmussen warns Russia to stop destabilising the situation, he added military action was not yet an option.
The British foreign secretary, William Hague, warned Russia it faced being frozen out by the west for years if it did not stop destabilising Ukraine. He said London was prepared to take a financial hit from sanctions affecting business relations.
Rasmussen is an overpaid clown, sorry clerk and as such should not be making political decisions. As for William Hague he is prepared to cut off his nose to spite his face or our faces. The West has gone mad, Putin will make them all look like the fools they are.

Posted by: harrylaw | Apr 15, 2014 12:03:48 PM | 29

Posted by: Mike Maloney | Apr 15, 2014 11:48:05 AM | 25

The funny thing is that the Russian side seems to make events as big as possible whilst the Kyiv side tries to play them down ...

I mean, if Nato does not wish to get into war with Russia why should the poor Kyiv government go ...

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 12:06:29 PM | 30

oh well

There are about 30 Ukrainian soldiers at #Kramatorsk airport. And probably several hundred angry local civilians protesting against them.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 12:13:13 PM | 31

Now they are flying with fight planes over the protesters, these people are sick in the head!

https://twitter.com/RT_com/statuses/456097990495588353

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 15, 2014 12:16:26 PM | 32

@ Somebody #24
Interesting. CNN as opposed to Reuters is able to read a UN report correctly.

Reuters should not be believed when it concerns the UN and the quest to have regime change in the ME. Check matthew Lee at http://www.innercitypress.com/ to understand the game UNCA plays

Posted by: Yul | Apr 15, 2014 12:24:52 PM | 33

To think of Obama's actions and deeds as synonymous to a human being's, is to make a big mistake. He is the Max Headroom of the corporation of corporations posing as a human being. Obama is an imperial brand no different than Ms. Clairol.

With that in mind, Ms. Clairol has just announced that it is releasing its new and innovative Imperial Obama Line of hair products has been designed to give even the rattiest imperial hair dew a complete make over. We at Clairol know hair coloring is a lie. But, just a small white one!

The Imperial Obama Line comes in various shades for all branding occasions. It is scientifically researched to repackage and brand imperial lowlifes into bouncy and shining highlights!


Obama's Nice-En-Easy Look holds the allure of a dark and mysterious brunette's hope that your imperial ambition will never show its gray and rotting roots!

Bush's Blond Bombshell is for your natural instincts. It is the Bushy straight up scared to death look that takes everyone by shuck and awe.

The Clinton Platinum Line anticipates stunning rewards with the take charge luminous luster to effect maximum confrontation as it disarms your opponents that can not decide what you are.

The Brennan Claroxide Formula) is for those scalps with not a lot sprouts and want to really maximize attention to what's left. It will give your exceedingly large forehead a sheen that will contrast that retreating quaff. It is specially designed to confuse and confound those that can't decide if you want to frighten or knock them dead!

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 15, 2014 12:26:35 PM | 34

@ 34: LMFAO!

Posted by: ben | Apr 15, 2014 12:29:46 PM | 35

Well if you start using violence like the kievfascists youve lost.
What does this mean?
1. That if the killings keep on Russia will move in.
2. If the killing stops, the resistance will getting stronger.

This is exactly like georgia attacked 2008 then too they hade the west backing them in their violence no matter what.

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 15, 2014 12:52:01 PM | 36

Why blame the "West", this is the doing of the Khazars and their quest for their Empire, the control of the desert religions. For this to be successful then the Rus and Persians must be destroyed. I have said before, this is all written by the Mayans, April 14, 15 are important dates for the Khazars, something must be seen to have been done. The outcome will be that history will repeat itself. I will say no more!

Posted by: Hans | Apr 15, 2014 12:59:02 PM | 37

This is the US game plan -))

“I think its possible, I’m not predicting it,” said Brzezinski, who is counselor at the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington.

The Russians should recognize that, unlike in Crimea, the Ukrainians are likely to resist further Russian incursions, he said.

“If the Ukrainians resist, it’s a new ballgame,” he said. “In Crimea, it was a pushover because they didn’t resist. Here, if they resist, it becomes prolonged and could last a long time.”

It will be “very difficult” for the U.S. and European nations “to justify sitting simply on the sidelines” if that happens, he said, suggesting they may be drawn into providing weapons to the Ukrainians.

“Obviously, public sympathy is going to be with the Ukrainians, who are being set upon by a much larger country,” he said.

In the meantime Obama's speaker decorates his walls with calls to join the Soviet army

Afghanistan reloaded.

Just that Kyiv government troops are faced by Ukrainian furious locals.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 12:59:27 PM | 38

http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/727925

Russian Defense Ministry suspends handover of armaments and military hardware to Ukraine

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 12:59:43 PM | 39

February 19, 2014. Near the town of Korsun (Cherkassy region), several buses with passengers who were returning to Crimea from protests against European integration at St. Michael's Square in Kiev were fired upon and stopped at the barricades, where the flags of the UPA, the UDAR (Strike) party and AUU Svoboda were flying. The people, both men and women, were dragged out of the bus through a "corridor" of militants who beat them with bats and entrenching shovels. Then the protesters were knocked down in a heap on the roadside, doused with gasoline, and threatened to be set on fire. Militants from the crowd, according to witnesses, shouted: "Just wait, we’re going to come and get you in Crimea. We are going to stab you and shoot you, that is, the ones of you who we haven’t already beaten to a pulp and shot up yet. Thereafter, many Crimeans were forced to take off their shoes "for the needs of Maidan soldiers", and they driven around the buses like cattle, forced to pick up all the broken glass. The humiliation and abuse continued for several hours. There were casualties among the victims. Most of the buses were burned. The local police chose not to intervene.

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | Apr 15, 2014 1:03:37 PM | 40

Mike Whitney at CounterPunch, is worth reading:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/04/15/is-putin-being-lured-into-a-trap/

He argues that NATO is setting a trap. It probably is but Russia is unlikely to enter it.
The two constants in US Foreign Policy are filibustering, of which the Maidan events were a good example, and attempts to impose variants of the Monroe Doctrine.

The Bush Doctrine extended the Monroe Doctrine to the rest of the world: either states do as the US orders them or there will be consequences, regime changes, trade sanctions, racehorse heads on the pillows, broken legs, accidents to relatives and revocation of banking privileges.

The key to this crisis could be in south America, the original object of the Monroe Doctrine: there is a real political desire on the continent to escape the constant bullying of the US. In some countries, notably Bolivia and Venezuela, governments opposed to the US need real, irrevocable and uncompromising support. In others, emerging from the gringo torture chamber, such as Brazil, Chile, Uruguay and Argentina the future is on a knife edge, as everywhere the light skinned ruling class supports the US because it supports their racial economic hegemony but popular movements and majorities everywhere hate the US.

The question for Russia, China, Iran and other states in the sights of US snipers is whether they will continue to wriggle and finesse their policies, running with the hare and hunting with the hounds, or whether they will throw in their lot with that of the poor.

It is the old Sam Adams observation " If we don't hang together, we will assuredly hang separately."
The era of wars between nations is over. The war in Ukraine is between the global ruling class and the people they intend to devour.

In the end Putin and Lavrov will have to choose a side, if they want to assert independence they will have to take the side of the poor, and the front in the war will run through every city on earth.

The US is not just backing fascists or associated with the grubby remnants of fascism, it is Fascism in the international arena. It pursues fascist policies, with fascist objectives. Those objectives include, as they always did, a determination to wipe out any governments which introduce social or economic policies which, if emulated in the US would cost capitalists money and, more importantly, threaten their control over labour. In the C19th these policies involved crushing abolitionist regimes, refusing to allow countries which emancipated labour to succeed. In the C20th this involved the long cold war against Cuba, not a military threat but, potentially, a potent political threat.

What makes the situation in Ukraine so curious is what is not being said, what neither side is offering: the Kiev side is offering cuts in pensions and living standards, unemployment, hunger and low living standards. And what are the Donbas pro Russian side offering? Nationalisation of industry? Full employment? Higher living standards? Equitable taxation? Trade Union rights for the miners and steelworkers?
No, if they did the Kiev regime would crumble, instead, advised by Putin and his neo-liberal cronies they are trying to mobilise the masses on narrow questions of language rights, cultural heritage and religion. Hence the ability of the US and fascists to project their secular, gay marriage, blue jeans image as modern, desirable and inevitable.

Posted by: bevin | Apr 15, 2014 1:05:57 PM | 41

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | Apr 15, 2014 1:03:37 PM | 40

Please give source to these stories, they smell of propaganda.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 1:18:32 PM | 42

"Obama Urges Ukraine's Military To Not Get Involved (Two Month Ago)"

For those interested in what is happening now, here are a couple of useful sources:

http://rt.com/news/eastern-ukraine-army-operation-680/ Kiev military op in eastern Ukraine LIVE UPDATES

http://voiceofrussia.com/2014_04_14/Ukraine-crisis-Kiev-calls-for-full-scale-antiterrorist-operation-in-south-east-LIVE-UPDATES-0336/

Kiev's military hardware storms Ukrainian south-east. LIVE UPDATES

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 15, 2014 1:25:10 PM | 43

I don't get it. Supposedly, Russia has managed to smuggle thousands of agents into Eastern Ukraine, but cannot smuggle a few anti-tank rockets, mines, or MANPADS.

The appearance of one of these things would make the lives of the Junta troops real interesting, real fast.

Posted by: sid_finster | Apr 15, 2014 1:27:49 PM | 44

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_04_15/US-sends-specialists-to-Ukraine-to-coordinate-activity-of-its-state-structure-source-0277/

US sends specialists to Ukraine to coordinate activity of its state structure - source

"Several US agencies - the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Department of Justice and the Department of State - have commissioned their specialists to Ukraine to help coordinate the activity of Ukrainian state structures on issues of security, law enforcement, interior affairs and international contacts, since the Ukrainian authorities are unable to do it themselves, a source in the Ukrainian Security Service said on Tuesday.

"Since Ukraine's law enforcers have turned out to be unable to ensure intelligence information collection in southeastern regions of Ukraine, now the staff of the US defense attaché in Ukraine is engaged in this activity using the diplomatic immunity status," the source said.

"Since Ukraine's regular army has demonstrated poor efficiency and is not reliable in respect of the new authorities, the Americans recommend the Ukrainian leaders, while staging a 'counter-terrorist operation', to use the army only to cordon off the outer boundaries of populated localities in Ukraine’s southeastern regions," the source said, TASS reports.

Earlier, the White House press secretary, Jay Carney, confirmed that CIA Director John Brennan had made a brief visit to Kiev last weekend.

Meanwhile, Alexei Pushkov, the chairman of the international committee of the Russian State Duma lower parliament house, said Brennan's visit only "proved that Ukraine’s current government is not independent and consults on everything with Washington."

"No wonder that part of the country does not recognize this government," he said, adding that such contacts were another proof that "the United States was behind the change of regimes in Ukraine, having established a regime that is more beneficial for itself."

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 15, 2014 1:31:23 PM | 45

This morning's Russia Today broadcast zeroed in on Obama's threat to arm Obama & BBC's Ukraine protestors, and produced evidence that the US was behind, and financed, the Kiev 'uprising'. Then they spelt out in great detail Kerry/Obama's "time-lapse" hypocrisy pointed out by b.

It's highly amusing to me (with the military option off the table for US-NATO) that the increasingly irrelevant pseudo-International Community is reduced to undignified whining and tooth gnashing...

Obama's latest half-baked idiocy brought to mind a quip by Jaques Chirac years ago...

"He missed a wonderful opportunity to shut up!"

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 15, 2014 1:35:06 PM | 46

@38 - somebody... "Brzezinski" propaganda artist of the first order.

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 1:37:06 PM | 47

Good people of Ukraine, if there still are any, do not lay down your lives and spill blood over this faux crisis. That's what they want. They want you to do the fighting and the dying, and any Ukrainian survivors will be left to pay for the mess and clean it up. Don't play their game. If you remain collectively neutral, it will force their hand. Call The Bluff. Make Russia roll in with tanks and troops. Make NATO roll in with tanks and troops. Let both of them spill their own blood and waste their own bullets and bombs on each other. But guess what? They won't. Want to bet? Don't fall for their trap. Keep calm. Remain neutral and once again, do not spill blood; your's or anyone else's. Ride it out as best you can but do not sacrifice your lives in vain.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Apr 15, 2014 1:41:39 PM | 48

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 1:37:06 PM | 47

anyway - the media does not work according to plan - in German

quoting lots of furious locals talking of unpaid wages, low pensions, rising prices, "none of the money the EU supposedly pays was given to me but my grandchildren will end up repaying the loan."

Posted by: sid_finster | Apr 15, 2014 1:27:49 PM | 44

They are faking the war for Western subsidy. Noone wants to confront Russian speznaz. Noone wants to be filmed killing furious unarmed locals.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 1:50:20 PM | 49

@48 - cold - propaganda artist for the usa - but not of the first order, lol...

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 1:50:45 PM | 50

I guarantee,that for the most part,opposition to the obviously righteous Russian position can be described as being of the feminazi,homonazi and Zionazi(somewhat inclusive)brethren.Historical and sexual animosity writ large.And they will never be on the front lines in any significant number.Simply jawdropping that people don't recognize the impetus of all this hatred.
Some former ambassador at WAPO,that quisling clinic,said send US ground troops in.The overwhelming response(very heartening)was,certify(as in nuts)the bastard.

Posted by: dahoit | Apr 15, 2014 2:10:00 PM | 51

50)

They really, really want Russia to invade. This here is MSNBC - presenters have a problem to keep their faces straight reporting on the "antiterrorist operation".

Posted by: somebody | Apr 15, 2014 2:19:25 PM | 52

#48;We,as Americans,have no skin in this stupid NATO inspired game,but Russia does.Their blood is involved.

Posted by: dahoit | Apr 15, 2014 2:23:53 PM | 53

Russian FM Lavrov gave an interview with China Daily in preparation for his meeting today in China with President Xi that has some interesting tid-bits.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 15, 2014 2:40:37 PM | 54

Hmm... Link didn't stick, http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/world/2014-04/14/content_17433463.htm

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 15, 2014 2:41:26 PM | 55

@53 - since when in the last 50 years has the usa ever had any skin in the game? (unless one counts 9-11, unless it was an inside job as some speculate).. it is always war on others land and in other peoples country. i guess the banking ponzi scheme doesn't work unless it has every country on the planet sucked in.

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 2:42:20 PM | 56

i am in a fowl mode today. i am posting too much, lol.
Parliament appoints Poltorak as commander of National Guard of Ukraine.
http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/200856.html

what is with this optics bullshit - national guard, lol.. all optics/propaganda from washington headquarters.. i have a new name for the planet - mcdonalds, lol..

Posted by: james | Apr 15, 2014 2:47:44 PM | 57

Russian Spring @diablo3xnews 15h a must see! Victoria Nuland made a new song called: "Fuck the EU" - #EU #US #Ukraine #Russia soundcoud link Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2014 11:07:24 AM | 14
Acid Pauli's remix of Toria Nuland's classic, "Fuck the EU", is also on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlhAQQiegAs

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 15, 2014 2:54:50 PM | 58

So the day they start WW3 at the behest of that fucking living monster Brennan, the TV is instead showing what I guess is to be the birth of a new national tragiday; Boston Strong Day, complete with church bells and Biden, invoking the Holy "They" in reference to the Terrorist Menace. The absurdities of the current myths are even more absurd when made to collide with each other, and I feel like I'm goin fukin nuts here, compañeros.

But the gods are getting foggy in their twilght years. Can't even remember the correct catchphrases anymore. Certainly they mean to call these resisters insurgents, not terrorists, no? Insurgents is the thingy to call them, right? Or am I just stuck in pre-Fallujah Iraq.

Posted by: L Bean | Apr 15, 2014 3:08:15 PM | 59

After Ukrainian nationalists, the biggest Russia haters are Latvians.

Latvia bans Russian state TV

an annual Waffen-SS parade commemorating Nazi collaborators has been held in the Latvian capital for nearly two decades. The Latvian Waffen-SS legion was actively used by Nazi Germany in punitive raids against the Russian, Belarussian and Jewish civil population. […]

According to the BBC, polls indicated that about 66 percent of Russian speakers in Latvia are convinced that Russia should interfere with Latvia's domestic affairs to protect minorities. Latvian officials insist that this is the result of Russia's TV "brainwashing techniques." They claim that Russian RTR programs pose a significant threat to Latvian national security.

The other reason for the decision to ban Russia's state television broadcasting, is, according to Latvian officials, the "biased" coverage of Ukrainian affairs, particularly due to the fact that Russia is "questioning the legitimacy of Ukrainian authorities."

Latvians hate Russians to such an extent that they helped the Bolsheviks impose Soviet rule on the Russian people. They will side with communists and with Nazis—any totalitarian system, just so long as they can hurt Russians.

Latvians are like Ukrainians, in that they are a peasant people. Thus, they have no high culture, only folk culture, so that the only idea that can be the basis of their identity is hatred of Russia.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 3:12:48 PM | 60

An interesting point (this probably has been mentioned before at MoA):

now that Crimea is no longer a part of Ukraine, the east of Ukraine is losing to the West in terms of a number of votes. Until Crimea was part of Ukraine the east and the center of Ukraine together had about 55% of the vote. Now they have less than 50% and that’s why I think they want autonomy for themselves, they want to elect their own governor, they don’t want the governor sent from Kiev. And that’s why we have all these passions running high right now.

This means that letting democracy, in the sense of elections, run its course will lead to a tyranny of the majority. Getting the Ukrainian government to respect the interests of the Russia-oriented minority requires the application of pressure by foreign powers. In that sense, the situation in the Ukraine is analogous to Israel/Palestine: as everyone knows, Israel will not respect the interests of Palestinians unless the USG puts the required pressure on it.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 3:45:30 PM | 61

He did the same at the Libya conflicts. In the beginning Gaddafi said; we are Fighting Kaidda not Libyans! Obama said Libyans ahs the rights to protests and killing Libyans is not acceptable. After having Kaddafi dead and the whole country is a mess Obama said Kaidda is expanding in Libya!!!!

Posted by: basel | Apr 15, 2014 3:48:20 PM | 62

Local Ukrainian Novorossia reports that 27 crew members of Donald Cook warship have quitted after what was described by the Pentagon as a provocation. Has anubody heard anything about it? This source does not seem particularly reliable.

(in Russian)
http://novorus.info/news/policy/15233-pentagon-priznal-chto-imitaciya-ataki-su-24-na-esminec-vms-ssha-proizvela-demoralizuyuschiy-effekt-na-ekipazh.html

Posted by: Grim Deadman | Apr 15, 2014 5:10:49 PM | 64


The Pentagon acknowledged that imitation Su-24 attack on the U.S. Navy destroyer produced a demoralizing effect on the crew.

27 crew members of the destroyer filed resignation. Commenting on their actions, they said they do not intend to expose the dangers of life.
The Pentagon on Monday issued a statement in which he claimed that the Russian Su-24 bomber on Saturday flew several times near the U.S. Navy destroyer Donald Cook in the Black Sea and at the same time several times simulated combat attack.

According to the agency Reuter Pentagon spokesman Col. Steven Warren, twelve times a Russian bomber flew at low altitude near the U.S. destroyer. Warren called such maneuvers frightening and unacceptable. They demoralize staff of the ship and have a negative impact on the overall psychological climate in the military.

Warren noted that the destroyer patrolled the waters of the Black Sea in the west, when the incident occurred. According to him, the ship is safe in the Romanian port, which was immediately evacuated. Members of the crew are the necessary procedures with the psychologist to recover after suffering stress...

Posted by: ProPeace | Apr 15, 2014 5:39:50 PM | 65

i doubt this report. the russians are playing this as cool as cucumbers; it is the empire which is hysteric & suffers from problems attendant to that condition

Posted by: remembererringgiap | Apr 15, 2014 5:46:05 PM | 66

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 3:12:48 PM | 59

Seriously? :D

The problem with this PR site is the "house rebels" are mostly the same thing as the "house slaves". A lot like the "house wines" that middle crust restaurants serve in "enlightened America".

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 15, 2014 5:48:05 PM | 67

After all the hysterical talk on cold and hot war here and the lunatic staring to what the "Big Five" (Obama, Kerry, Putin, Lavrov, Merkel) say and do - why not read and hear to what ordinary and reasonable Ukrainians and Russians have to say? And what they do to prevent war!!

see here google translation from tonights SPIEGEL:

The airport of Kramatorsk had been recaptured, claims the Government of Ukraine. Yet skillful from Kiev soldiers are besieged by an angry crowd.

A torrential outpouring of people moving to the airport from Kramatorsk. Hundreds have already gathered on the southern edge of the military base. " Traitor traitor!" they chanted, when the mayor wants to push through the crowd. They blame him for that landed at the airport helicopter of the Ukrainian military.

At the edge of the airport about a dozen of Ukrainian soldiers are seen. They have pointed their automatic rifles in the direction of the angry crowd. About 30 military should be located entirely on the base. The people of Kramatorsk are in an uproar.

"They call us terrorists! They call us foreign provocateurs ! However, I 'm Ukrainian. I was born in Kramatorsk " shouts a young woman with long blond hair and applied stretches her identity card to the television cameras of the Russian radio station " First Channel". The pro-Kremlin TV channels are at the scenes very welcome , they seem to confirm Vladimir Putin's version that the Russian-speaking Ukrainians in the east are threatened by the new government in Kiev.

and here some of the last clear thinking political folks in that region:

http://borotba.org/communique_11_of_the_borotba_union_and_the_centre_of_antifascist_resistance.html

Communiqué 11 of the "Borotba" union and the Centre of Antifascist Resistance

The Prime Minister Yatsenyuk – the head of Kiev junta - announced the creation of a special "National Defense" fund. The Parliament (under the guidance of Turchinov and 'Svoboda' member Koshulinsky) has immediately ordered to transfer 6.8 billion hryvnia (some $700 million) to the created fund. At the same time, ministers and MPs don’t hide the fact that the money will be obtained by means of social budget cuts. In other words, the right-wing government - that came to power by igniting chauvinistic hysteria in society - the same rightwing government that forcibly brought Ukraine to the brink of war - now wants to make Ukrainians pay for this war. And this government has never asked about the opinion of the impoverished Ukrainian people.

In the course of Maidan, the current rulers of the country called Ukranians to fight against the oligarchs, but in fact the super-rich Ukranians were among the main sponsors of Euromaidan. Therefore, it is not surprising that the neo-liberals and neo-nazis did not take a single penny from oligarchs that accumulated their wealth through plundering of the country. Instead, the oligarchs were given the unlimited power in the industrial regions of the country so that these capitalists could completely rob those regions.

They want the war to be paid with the blood and money of ordinary Ukrainians. The money needed for this "defense fund" (that might be used for profit of corrupt authorities that seized upon power), will be saved through cuts in education and health-care, through delays in payments of pensions, salaries, scholarships and hardship allowances as well. And we should also take into account the permanent rise of prices for basic food and other essential commodities.

However, the new government is negotiating with the International Monetary Fund over maximum cuts of pensions and social benefits so that to get the new loans. And those loans will be immediately ‘used’ for own purpose by the greedy coalition of officials, Nazis and oligarchs.

Meanwhile, the Parliament announced another military mobilization – it calls us to give our lives for them. Thus, the junta wants to divert our attention from the process of plundering Ukrainians and to direct the popular anger toward an external enemy or mythical "pro-kremlin thugs". Furthermore, military spending is an easy pretext to write off a large-scale waste of money taken away from the people. "The fog of war covers all the waste-spending" – as people say.

In fact, the Kiev government and the Parliament both act exactly like those armed ultra-right gangs that first brought them to power and now are engaged in a banal robbery of offices and citizens’ apartments – the practice that is usually justified by "wartime reasons" or "the interests of Ukraine."

Having taken money of Ukrainians away under the pretext of ‘war’, all the corrupt politicians and militarists will call us to "suffer in the name of defending the homeland" and ‘tighten our belts more’.

Certainly, the Kiev government understands rather well that such a cynical robbery will inevitably lead soon to new outbursts of popular anger. A war is necessary for them also in order (under pretext of military mobilization and army operational readiness) to impose the state of emergency and ban or disperse protest actions.

And this war will be a civil war – in fact it is already glowing in the eastern regions of Ukraine.

Thus, the junta is preparing a war against its own people but waged for people’s money. The "Borotba" union declares that current war hysteria is necessary for the rightwing government in order to keep the looted Ukrainians in total obedience!

We demand to stop the militarization of the country and to repulse the military madness of the nationalists!

We won’t let them to buy tanks at the expense of our pensions and salaries, at the expense of the education and health-care cuts!

No to the martial law that would enforce far-right dictatorship!

Let’s unite against chauvinism and militarism! Let’s unite for social and civil rights for all citizens of Ukraine!

http://borotba.org/interview_with_sergey_kirichuk_of_the_borotba_party_by_haneul_naavi_and_michael_bielawski.html

http://borotba.org/on_the_situation_in_ukraine_for_the_antifascist_meeting_in_athens.html

and here something for the Hebrew speaking reader: http://borotba.org/1.html

נגד המלחמה! למען הגדרה עצמית!


The union ‘Borotba’

Posted by: thomas | Apr 15, 2014 5:52:45 PM | 68

"Latvians hate Russians to such an extent that they helped the Bolsheviks impose Soviet rule on the Russian people."

or, was it rather, Latvians and Russians cooperated to keep imperial bayonets out of their own sides?

Posted by: ruralito | Apr 15, 2014 5:56:12 PM | 69

"Thus, they have no high culture, only folk culture..."

So, no golf. Got it.

Posted by: ruralito | Apr 15, 2014 5:58:29 PM | 70

Posted by: ruralito | Apr 15, 2014 5:58:29 PM | 69

"So, no golf. Got it."

Never underestimate the golf culture in the west, where beating on small balls with a club is a rite of "manhood". And submitting to such is a requirement of leadership.

;)

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 15, 2014 6:02:51 PM | 71

@37

Mayans? Khazars? You need to get some psychological help man.

Posted by: Massinissa | Apr 15, 2014 6:04:24 PM | 72

you can tell this is the apex of 21st century politcal rhetoric - an attack on civilians is called "an anti-terror" operation. as were the attacks on Occupy (not to compare the two) but this is where the post 9/11 mentality has arrived - so far.

Posted by: guest77 | Apr 15, 2014 6:17:05 PM | 73

Not sure what to make of this: Netenyahu phoned Putin to discuss what's happening in the Ukraine (in Russian).

The article states that Merkel also phoned Putin.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 6:31:58 PM | 74

@71

No need for personal attacks...

Posted by: crone | Apr 15, 2014 6:35:30 PM | 75

There is no excuse to attack Iran, so... where are the carriers heading now?

Posted by: Michał | Apr 15, 2014 7:24:16 PM | 76

@37 @71

>> Mayans? Khazars? You need to get some psychological help man.

Well I think that was the only positive news I read here today.

I'd even agree to some point - those ppl who're now passively supporting NATO takeover are the farmers who don't really belong to some nation - they just live somewhere in all the Ukraine/Poland/Southern Russia. Why don't we call them Khazars? It's both convenient and may deliver us some lulz in a few decades (like Khazar Emiratistan declares independence from you, you and you).

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 7:54:59 PM | 77

OK, so Mike Whitney has another piece on the Ukraine situation up at CounterPunch. It doesn't tell us anything that we don't know; it's main merit is three juicy Paul Wolfowitz quotes that bluntly state that the USG will do everything in its power to maintain a unipolar world.

The problem I have with Whitney's piece is that Whitney seems to think that he's smarter than Putin:

Wolfowitz figured the moment would come when the US would have to square off with Moscow in order to pursue it’s imperial strategy in Asia. Putin doesn’t seem to grasp that yet. He still clings to the misguided notion that rational people will find rational solutions to end the crisis. But he’s mistaken. Washington does not want a peaceful solution. Washington wants a confrontation. Washington wants to draw Moscow into a long-term conflict in Ukraine that will recreate Afghanistan in the 1990s.

I really don't see how Whitney could write that "Putin doesn’t seem to grasp that yet" if he had watched either Putin's informal press conference about the Crimea or his speech to the Duma on the same subject. Putin knows exactly what the USG is trying to do, as do the people in the Russian foreign ministry and intelligence service. In this article, Whitney comes across as a chauvinistic American hick.

Also, it is by no means clear that the USG's intent is to get Russia into a quagmire in the Ukraine, the way it did in Afghanistan. What is clear is that USG was caught completely off guard by Russia's effortless snatching up of the Crimea. The plan was to turn the Ukraine into another vassal state, like Germany or Poland; it was not to get Russia enmeshed into a fourth generation war.

Furthermore, I think that even USG understands by now—but not Whitney!—that Russia is not going to overtly intervene militarily in the Ukraine unless the Kiev regime commits atrocities on such a level that even Western journalists will have to admit that it needs to be stopped.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 8:07:36 PM | 78

Totally OT but I think some here might appreciate knowing this:

RIP Mike Ruppert

I am very sad.

Posted by: juannie | Apr 15, 2014 8:26:47 PM | 79

@74 Sorry but anyone who calls jews 'Khazars' really does need psychological help. Its not a personal attack, its the truth.

Posted by: Massinissa | Apr 15, 2014 8:27:11 PM | 80

Well, a young Jewish Israeli scientist disagrees with you. See findings of his research here -

http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/37821/title/Genetic-Roots-of-the-Ashkenazi-Jews/

Posted by: crone | Apr 15, 2014 8:33:44 PM | 81

@77, Demian

As for you wrote about Putin been "smart" or anything.

Whatever is the Putin's IQ itself, it's clear that there's no idiots around and overall understanding in Russia's Mgmt is clear.

It doesn't make it easier anyhow.

The US already succeeded - they created a huge problem for Russia which has no easy way to resolve. 2 basic options are

1) Ignore the genocide which is upcoming now.
: His internal support will suck. And it's not even about the support. He's old after all - he doesn't have to prove anything - he just have to resolve the shit which is happening.

2) Intervene, and looks like now it's possible with all the power only. This kind of intervention may look not too good to many "Ukranian" citizens, thx to the US propaganda success. It may look better later once Kiev nazis will "clear" more ppl but the timing may be late.
: His internal support will skyrocket. For a short time. And then the US *will* make the Russian market to suffer, economy to drop etc.

That's a fucking war and Russia is on a loosing side alone.

I do hope only for the internal "west" problems - the US and the "west" overall won't gain anything from this war either.

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 8:35:26 PM | 82

Back OT:

THE VINEYARD OF THE SAKER

The first day of what will become the Ukrainian Civil war has finished

A very interesting evaluation.

Posted by: juannie | Apr 15, 2014 8:36:05 PM | 83

@41 - bevin:

Thank you for that astute observation. If your analysis fits (seems likely), that's unfortunate. I'm hoping Putin, and his boss(es), will keep in mind that an inverted pyramid is quite unstable. That, IMO, has been a recent failing of the Empire...less bread and more circuses does not a happy populace make.

Posted by: Dr. Wellington Yueh | Apr 15, 2014 8:37:21 PM | 84

@79, Massinissa

How did you assume that the original message has anything to do with the jews?

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 8:39:00 PM | 85

Sergey: in the west, there is a conspiracy theory, popular among persons of an antisemitic tendency, that European Jews are somehow the descendants of the Khazars and not the Jews of the Bible.

This allows such people to be antisemitic, and at the same time, claim to be Christian, because they can attribute their conspiracies to the "Khazars," while admitting that Jesus and other persons in the Bible were Jews.

Needless to say, there is no scientific support for this idea. Even if it were true, who cares?

Posted by: sid_finster | Apr 15, 2014 8:53:04 PM | 86

@84

Who ELSE would he be referring to as Khazars? Most modern jews are thought to be descendants of the khazars. Seeing as how the khazars have been dead for a thousand years, who else would he be referring to?

Posted by: Massinissa | Apr 15, 2014 8:53:29 PM | 87

@84 Continued, by thought to be, I mean thought to be by antisemites.

Heres a quote from the wikipedia page on Khazars.

"Beginning in the 8th century, Khazar royalty and notable segments of the aristocracy converted to Judaism; the populace appears to have been multi-confessional—a mosaic of pagan, Tengrist, Jewish, Christian and Muslim worshippers—and polyethnic.[15] A modern theory, that the core of Ashkenazi Jewry emerged from a hypothetical Khazarian Jewish diaspora, is now viewed with scepticism by most scholars, but occasionally supported by others. This Khazarian hypothesis is sometimes associated with antisemitism and anti-Zionism."

Posted by: Massinissa | Apr 15, 2014 8:55:38 PM | 88

@85, @86, sid_finster, Massinissa

Thx for your comments, surprise for me. I'd share that "Khazars" is the "well-known nation" in Russia since it's mentioned in a few most ancient slavic literature which are actually studied in high school.

As for the link of Khazars and jews - I guess I'm one of a very few ppl here who know it exists at all. And as for my history books, jews just *influenced slightly* Khazaria, not made it.

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 9:01:04 PM | 89

@Sergey #81:

Yeah, sorry about the "smart" remark. That is a vulgar, impolite American way of speaking.

As for what the outcome of all this will be, I think nobody can know that. But this is nothing new. As the Saker explains, the West has been trying to use "the Ukraine" to destroy Russia ever since Clement VIII was Pope.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 15, 2014 9:06:44 PM | 90

Demian #73

There is this in the JPost.

Not too many details but there is this Haaretz article that provides some context.

Both Netanyahu and Lieberman value their ties to Putin. After all Putin did renege on his deal to sell those S300 aa missile batteries to Iran. It was never clear why that happened but if Israel ever decides to bomb Iran, those missiles could cause some serious problems for the attacking force.

Posted by: ToivoS | Apr 15, 2014 9:37:07 PM | 91

@89 Demian,

Read it all. Remarks to 1984 look valid and hopeless.
There are also some references to Yugoslavia which I do find terrifying.

Overall, all of these recent "west" actions just make preliminary 1st strike feasible. "let's suck together" or smth.

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 9:41:00 PM | 92

Believing in an invisible man, or Harvey for that matter, is grounds for being locked up in the feed farm. Yet, life is hard and most are harmless -Harvey is a prankster and is generally innocuous. However, when an entire nation is founded and based upon the word of Harvey with access to WMDs,that is pucker time!

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 15, 2014 9:44:11 PM | 93

@92, HAHA

Exactly the way the nation was formed in the US. Just having Colt instead of WMD.

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 9:53:04 PM | 94

"the US will do everything in their power to maintain global supremacy"

This is simple phrase defines the single prism through which to view American behavior. By definition, the actions taken will be amoral, anti-spiritual, and unscrupulous because the end, is solely material. I am starting to understand why the Saker describes this conflict in religious terms.

Posted by: guest77 | Apr 15, 2014 9:56:32 PM | 95

That is 200 years ago, when the hell is Harvey going to leave us alone?

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 15, 2014 9:57:57 PM | 96

@95

Very good question.
I keep asking myself the same for the last 10-20 years.
Recent thoughtful analysis says: NEVER.
Though clearly any analysis result won't matter for real optimist. Like me.

Posted by: Sergey | Apr 15, 2014 10:02:57 PM | 97

@96

BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY:

We never left the Dark Ages! It has to do with how humans organize themselves --oligarchies. Every institution is based upon top down beliefs in; gospels, laws, white-papers, etc. Especially, scientific institutions. Why? because of complexity. It is similar to moving from first order logic to more complex logical systems. You have to "BELIEVE" in the laws of first order logic to accomplish anything in symbolic logic. This is the basis of the human belief system that

This system can only function if their is trust in the institutional authority. When the trust is removed by liars, thieves and gangsters, the system must descend into chaos. --it is inevitable!

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 15, 2014 10:21:47 PM | 98

a small suggestion for those who don't already: spend time if u can not only posting in blog's like this which speak the truth, but also on blog's and news sites which could use some of it. as the Saker noted, this is not a call to cast pearls before swine, but to make your voice heard in places which need to hear it.

Posted by: guest77 | Apr 15, 2014 10:28:02 PM | 99

"As usual Liberty was the watchword and disguise of freebooters, pirates and plunderers...Slaveholders, slave traders, and cold blooded tyrants of every grade poured forth their welling words of sympathy with the oppressed and execration of the oppressors."

Frederick Douglass: "What to the Slave is the Fourth of July?"

Posted by: bevin | Apr 15, 2014 10:44:46 PM | 100

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