April 14, 2012
These Live Videos Of The "Shelling Of Homs" Are Staged
Three current headlines:
AFP: Syria forces shell Homs as UN votes on observers
Forces loyal to President Bashar al-Assad shelled the Jurat al-Shayah and Al-Qarabis districts of the city for around an hour during the morning, the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said, without giving any immediate word on any casualties.
VoA: Activists Accuse Syria of Renewed Shelling
Activists are accusing Syrian government forces of shelling the central city of Homs, raising new questions about the country's already tenuous cease-fire.
Reuters: Syrian forces shell Homs on day three of truce
Syrian forces loyal to President Bashar al-Assad shelled the battered city of Homs on Saturday, opposition activists said, the first bombings since a ceasefire began two days ago.
I doubt these reports.
There was a lot of twittering this morning about a live video feed from Homs showing the "shelling" taking place. The live feed was on Bambuser which allows to stream cell phone live video to the web. The feed was by the user mahmoud homs. It came in several parts with over an hour of total length. I have watched it all.
The view is mostly across a street towards a ten story high rise which seems to have never been inhabited and which has some serious shelling damage though we do not know when that occurred. There is a slightly damaged van in the street. The camera is about 20-30 meters away from the building.
Lets take this 26 minute part for further analysis.
There is sound of explosions throughout that part though it sounds rather strange.
At 0:56 there is a small explosion though the only thing we see is rather small cloud of dust and smoke. At 1:15 there is another explosion at the facade's fifth floor with a small cloud of dust and smoke which immediately gets blown away. Astonishingly the facade in that place shows no difference before and after that explosion. The following minutes include noise of explosions every few seconds but only few visible impacts at 2:47, 4:05, 4:50 and so on. All of them seem to have some thing in common.
- there are nearly no explosion flashes and those that are visible are very small
- the smoke and dust clouds after each hit are rather small
- there is no discernible damage done by these explosions
One can also hear a car passing by at 5:30 using its horn. At 6:30 one can hear someone walking past. At 11:30 someone nearby the video-grapher is saying something, at 11:38 someone uses a cigarette lighter and there is more talk up to 12:30. All these sounds are quite crisp. The peoples' voices seem content, not like people under an hour long bombardment.
All the sound of the shelling is very different. It seems artificially prolonged with some echo and somewhat muffled. I have heard nothing like that in my times on army tank and artillery ranges. Real guns do make quite crisp and loud sounds.
At 13:30 the camera turns to the ground and one can see a second camera on a tripod and a laptop next to it.
Meanwhile the shelling sound continues coming every few seconds and once a while there is another small dust puff visible.
The following 5 minute and 48 minute videos are quite similar to the first one. In the last one the cameraman is also walking into the open street where all that shelling is taking place. At 20:30 someone steps into the picture into the open street with an explosion just a few meters behind him. He is ranting something and at a point holds up what seem to be the rears of used small mortar rounds. The only words I understand from what he is saying is "Kofi Annan". Then more explosions nearby and still no panic at all. At 27:30 the guy appears again and repeats his stand-up routine.
All this leaves some intriguing questions:
- Homs is a rather large city with some 750,000 inhabitants. How did these people know where the shelling would take place so they could be there with all their equipment just in time to witness it?
- Why would several people with cameras and laptops on the ground stay in the open street while the high rise across the street is subject to shelling with, from the sound, impacts every few seconds and visibly every few minutes?
- Why are those people so near to the shelling so very content and not afraid at all?
- Where is the fresh damage after all these impacts?
- Why would the Syrian army shell an empty high rise with no discernible hostile target for over an hour wasting valuable ammunition and at a time where it is critical for the Syrian government to keep the ceasefire?
My impression is that this whole thing is a staged to impress on the people voting today at the UN Security Council.
The sound of the shelling is likely coming from a tape recorder or a laptop recording which explains the rather different and muffled complex tone in contrast to the clear nearby voices. The visible puffs are from small grenades, probably from some small hand held 40mm grenade launcher fired from nearby. They are certainly not from bigger mortars or artillery.
This foreign financed revolution in Syria has routinely used fake video and untrue accounts of events on the ground. Today's "shelling of Homs" seems to be another one of these fake stories. Unfortunately the media are, again, falling for it.
Posted by b on April 14, 2012 at 09:46 AM | Permalink
Good job, well done b
Posted by: Alexander | Apr 14, 2012 10:41:12 AM | 2
thanks...im posting it around Facebook
Posted by: brian | Apr 14, 2012 10:59:23 AM | 3
Brilliant, b! You have recovered *so well* from your illness! Wonderful! Many thanks!
Posted by: lambent1 | Apr 14, 2012 11:05:42 AM | 4
Thanks b, that is indeed the most sub-standard "shelling" I've ever seen or heard. If that's the best the Syrian military can do, they're screwed. Our basic training exercises,(U.S. Army 66' 69') were more convincing.
I agree, it's staged.
Posted by: ben | Apr 14, 2012 11:27:15 AM | 5
It seems rather strange that all the accusations and demands are levelled at the Syrian government but no mention is made of the fact that there're armed gangs on the ground and they're not held accountable..Even worse, the Western media isn't reporting on the fact that most of these armed men are trained in Turkey.
Turkey arms and trains them and then turns back and complains that there's violence in Syria??? They're playing the role of arsonist and fire-fighters at the same time.No???
The fact that Kofi Annan doesn't even mention armed gangs and their supporters is very telling. It also seems to me that if the Syrian government wasn't that popular, after a year of armed conflict, he would've fallen long time ago..He clearly has a lot of support in the country, contrary to what Washington and her tag-alongs want us to believe.
The mistake they made was that they thought Syria will be as quick as Libya..They never anticipated this will take this long and in the process exposing the whole plan and the main actors behind it.The Arab spring started as the genuine cause which caught the US and her tag-alongs(countries that can't think for themselves) off guard but they sought to ride the waves by launching their own counter revolutions in countries they didn't like.Libya(very easy) was the first to go and Syria next.Seems Syria has spoiled their plans. What has happened though, is that it's pushed Syria more into the camp of Iran, China, Russia and the assorted BRIC countries and left Washington out in the cold. The US has been reduced to relying on their puppets in Turkey and the Persian Gulf petrol stations to do the heavy lifting while they remain in the background pushing things in the UN. But even that, they're being confronted by China and Russia.
The question here is, how will all these exposed actors behave from now on in their relationship with Syria? Turkey will end up the key loser for carrying water for Washington and "democratic states" like Qatar and Saudi Arabia and Syria will shelve any chance or plans of peace talks with Israel regarding the Golan. All this was meant to buy a new life for Israel after Mubarak was kicked out. But the plan seems to have hit a massive rock that won't be fixed unless there's foreign military intervention, which won't happen given all the risks involved. The entire region will be set ablaze.
Oh, what a tangled web of Sh*t they weave when they first learn to deceive...Annan's plan is basically a ploy to buy time for the "rebels" who've been hit hard in Homs, Idlib, Deraa and are on the back-foot..Annan is basically telling the Syrian government to pull back security personal from towns so the rebels can move in and terrorize the people again so that the UN will get a justification to intervene. Is he insane???
Posted by: Zico | Apr 14, 2012 12:16:47 PM | 6
UNSC agress to unarmed observers by 15-0 RT News
Posted by: hans | Apr 14, 2012 1:26:13 PM | 7
Here in the airwaves of the hinterland there's a full court press against the Syrians. Even the local Classical Rock station, which never rises above celebrity gossip and natural disasters, is slamming the "brutal tyrant, who slays his own people yada-yada."
Posted by: ruralito | Apr 14, 2012 2:19:10 PM | 8
Syrian "activists" have added gunshot and explosion noises to videos many times in the past, and this seems to be a repetition of the same tactic.
Posted by: JimSteel | Apr 14, 2012 2:29:13 PM | 9
What happened to Danny? Haven't seen him on Anderson Cooper lately.
Posted by: dh | Apr 14, 2012 2:46:05 PM | 10
What happened to Danny? Haven't seen him on Anderson Cooper lately.
His cover was blown and therefore finished serving his usefulness...The Syrian chaos is mainly waged in the media. Professional journalism has been thrown out of the window and words from "activists" are now kosher..Lies, fabrications and even sometimes "journalists" organizing the killing of people is what passes for "news" these days.
Unfortunately for them, the game has become so see-through that it's not funny anymore. They'll produce another "Danny" soon.
Posted by: Zico | Apr 14, 2012 2:57:52 PM | 11
As mentioned at #7 above, today the UN Security Council adopted a resolution on Syria. I cannot find the text of the UNSC statement at an official website of the UN but I believe the following website does have the authentic text: http://un-report.blogspot.com/2012/04/blue-draft-resolution-on-syria.html . The text includes the statement:
"The Security Council... condemning the widespread violations of human rights by the Syrian authorities, as well as any human rights abuses by armed groups, recalling that those responsible shall be held accountable...."
That is baldly asserting that the Syrian authorities have committed human rights violations. There is no convincing or high-quality evidence that the Syrian authorities committed human rights violations, and I counterassert that any such allegations are falsehoods. If you're a rational and fair-minded person you must concede that the allegations haven't been established as the truth because you haven't seen high-quality evidence in support of them, and the testimonies of dissidents are not high quality evidence. There are a number proven fakes that were concocted by the dissidents to defame the Syrian government in the eyes of ignorant and credulous foreign bigots.
I repeat, it is unacceptable for any fair-minded person to condemn the Syrian authorities for human rights violations when there is no high quality evidence to establish it and the Syrian authorities deny it.
The above UNSC text snippet is also saying that those Syrians who commit human rights violations "shall be held accountable". That's hinting at a violation of Syrian sovereignty unless the accountability is wholly under Syrian law.
Yesterday, 13 Apr 2012, Russia put forth an alternative draft statement, the full text of which is at http://un-report.blogspot.com/2012/04/russian-draft-resolution-on-syria.html . Russia's draft makes no allegation or assertion that the Syrian authorities have committed human rights violations. However, the draft that was finally approved today at the UNSC was a USA draft with incorporation of some changes initiated by Russia.
Posted by: Parviziyi | Apr 14, 2012 3:09:50 PM | 12
i'm using this url shortener.
http://goo.gl/vd86z and the hashtag #staged.
Posted by: annie | Apr 14, 2012 6:10:46 PM | 14
foreign minister lieberman to bibi...
if we stir up the kurds, that's another handle on turkey, you know? ...we can murder turks to our heart's content, but turks are fucked, and they know it.
we got the plan, we got the juice, we will grab the oil and gas, and turkey will knuckle under... in return, we will mute out support for kurdish independence... but not so much that they wont ship their oil to haifa.
russia has no leverage on turkey... energy to europe through turkey doesnt make sense, just because of the geography... on the other hand, turkey is right smack dab in the middle our our pipeline routes to europe from our oil and gas deposits in the persian gulf.
we got those lousy turks over a barrel!
bibi to lieberman...
i thought the plan was to bypass turkey and do pipelines through syria and lebanon, then use tankers for the rest of the trip to europe... isnt that what the wars in syria and iran are about?
lieberman to bibi...
ssshhh! there might be a turk in the woodwork.
and so it goes in the zionist fantasyland.
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 14, 2012 9:09:46 PM | 16
B, you are courageous to undertake such a thing as to watch more than an hour of fake videos.
But it is worth doing it. I think these videos need to be analysed as they are made. They are of course irritating but they document what will emerge to be the biggest disinformation operation in contemporary ME history, after the staged fall of Tripoli by AlJazeera one week before it happened.
To my knowledge this has been done only by Syrian TV Addounia and only for a small portion of the fake videos which the army found in Bab Amro. We need to keep track of these videos.
Posted by: Sophia | Apr 14, 2012 9:43:25 PM | 17
sophia, i'm beginning to think it's the "reason to believe" syndrome... the videos dont have to be convincing, in fact there might be some "resistance is futile" at play here, as deliberately inept videos are crammed down our throats just to demonstrate to us how powerful the PNAC operation is.
the media doesnt necessarily believe them, either, but at least the videos give them a reason to parrot the PNAC party line... reporters have to follow the party line to keep their jobs, and a video, no matter how inept, gives them a reason to believe whether they believe or not.
you dont have to believe, all you need is a reason to believe.
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 14, 2012 9:57:33 PM | 18
this is possibly the most desperately stupid post in this fast-forward collapse of the corrupt Asad regime. Vive l'ancien régime.
Conspracies, b. Everywhere.
One thing is incorruptibly certain. The Syrian people are, to every corporeal unit, incomparably stupid arabs. According to you, evidently.
I do wish you would devote your time to translating the musings of the dozing old Nazi criminals about Israel.
Posted by: slothrop | Apr 14, 2012 11:05:20 PM | 19
"The Syrian people are, to every corporeal unit, incomparably stupid arabs."
on the other hand...
April 9AP EL-ARISH, Egypt — Militants on Monday blew up a gas pipeline in Egypt’s Sinai Peninsula that transports fuel to neighboring Israel and Jordan, a senior Egyptian security official said.
The attack was the 14th on the pipeline since last year’s popular uprising that ousted Egypt’s longtime leader Hosni Mubarak.
Militants attack Egypt’s gas pipeline to Israel and Jordan washington post 8apr12
these militants are gonna have a new book out soon... "pipeline destruction for dummies"...
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 14, 2012 11:21:49 PM | 21
it's a routine... you dangle pipeline revenue under the noses of a few ex-pat psychopaths, arm them, send them home to raise hell.
then you either double-cross them, like the croats, albanians, afghans, pakistanis, sudanese, ugandans and lord knows how many others, or you pay them if the pipeline fits into the PNAC plan.
and sometimes, even if the pipeline fits into the PNAC plan, it doesnt pan out so well.
ask yossi maiman about his egypt pipeline to israel.
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 14, 2012 11:28:41 PM | 22
I'm not a "buddy" to any party here. I simply refuse to believe that a majority of economically oppressed, largely shia majority in the populated levant-country of Syria, are not entitled to exploit this interregnum of possible empowerment, to topple what is demonstrably a complete asshole regime.
But, please notice how b conveniently discovers that the humble countryfolk of iran who support the vapidly incompetent Ahmadinejad are world-historical actors on the cosmic stage in the struggle to overturn "Empire" (Don't look in the rearview window, b, on the autobahn to hell, because it looks like Merkel and her phalanx of bankers are doing just fine by Empire diktat).
b. What a fucking hypocrite. A whore, really.
Posted by: slothrop | Apr 14, 2012 11:38:13 PM | 23
the question is this... how you gonna secure another 1500 miles of pipeline when you cant even secure yossi's pipeline from egypt?
then you got another 400 miles of water pipeline from that big reservoir on the euphrates...
this syria project looks like another zionist pipedream, doesnt it?
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 14, 2012 11:45:24 PM | 24
the initial zionist pipedream being, of course, bibi's expectations that kurds' oil would soon be arriving in israel shortly after the israeli american invasion of iraq.
you remember that, dont you, slothrop?
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 15, 2012 12:00:48 AM | 25
Good catch. Just watching portions of the 26 minute video and I agree it's totally suspect.
Just after 6:50 there is an explosion right in front of the camera (smoke appears after a boom), yet the camera doesn't pan toward where the "shell" landed nor does the cameraman look disturbed at all--he doesn't retreat from this death zone. Then shortly after 7:00 there are a couple of hits to the building, with some smoke and maybe some rubble falling down.
But the sounds and sights don't match up.
The sound of "shelling" in the video does echo. I don't know if this is odd because there does seem to be tall buildings in the area so maybe sound would echo.
It sounds most like an RPG to me or a faraway big gun like from a tank (see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MASe_0mNHRc at about 2:35 for the sound of an RPG) (at 3;33 in the same video you see the GP-25, I think--that's a bit quieter than the RPG).
Anyway, the end result doesn't look like an RPG or GP-25 round hitting. It mostly seems like puffs of smoke, like maybe a 50 caliber round hit the dusty concrete, or something. Maybe it is an explosive round?
Also, if Syria were shelling, wouldn't they have bigger guns than RPGs? I even see the insurgents claiming that the government is using Russian 2S1 Gvozdika tanks to fire self propelled Howitzer shells: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwZr3A7rRzk
Plus, the camera angle is suspicious. Why not pan around to give us an idea of the scene? Why focus on such a narrow vantage point? And it's hard to believe this person would feel safe standing in nearly the same spot for so long during a bombardment--staring at one small view--and in the open and only a few feet away from the action in some instances! Wasn't the cameraman curious if troops were approaching behind him?
It's not a believable video.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 15, 2012 2:32:42 AM | 26
And that has what to do with the fake videos?
Posted by: Alexander | Apr 15, 2012 2:32:45 AM | 27
Actually, at 22:30, of that 26 minute video, you can see some sort of explosion at the left building. I can't tell if it's an explosive round hitting the building, or an planted explosive. But one thing is for sure, it doesn't appear to be an incoming Howitzer/RGP/GP-25/Artillery round to me.
It hits a very thin support structure but doesn't seem to harm the structure much.
It would be helpful to be able to look at these frame by frame to see this explosion better.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 15, 2012 2:47:56 AM | 28
the "phony video" tradition probably started with the bin laden "confession" video...
a week of hype, then they finally cough up an inept video of a bad bin laden double... a tape they supposedly found in afghanistan... sure, they found a tape but they still havent found any evidence against bin laden.
anyhow, rove goes to hollywood in november of 2001 to enlist hollywood in the "war on terror", and a month later, the confession tape surfaces, and it's horrible quality... i guess we're supposed to think that arabs are too stupid to take decent videos... and the sound quality is equally bad... translators cant agree on what he's saying.
i guess, even if hollywood made the tape, it would have to be shit quality because the bin laden double was such a poor match...
it's almost as if they were testing their wings with the bin laden confession tape... seeing how gullible americans are, after being bombarded with propaganda for a week solid before the tape was released... or maybe it was just more "resistance if futile, so you might as well believe the official story".
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 15, 2012 7:12:22 AM | 29
@slothrop I simply refuse to believe that a majority of economically oppressed, largely shia majority in the populated levant-country of Syria,
Someone who doesn't even know which part of Islam the majority of Syrians belong to should probably not discuss anything about that country.
Posted by: b | Apr 15, 2012 8:40:14 AM | 30
Spring has arrived in Afghanistan.
Posted by: Maracatu | Apr 15, 2012 9:24:31 AM | 31
Sunni, I meant.
Posted by: slothrop | Apr 15, 2012 10:03:48 AM | 32
Indeed Maracatu, large Taliban attacks in Afghanistan. Rundown of attacks I've read.
- Kabul, 7 locations attacked (Afghan Parliment, NATO Headquarters, US Embassy, British Embassy, German Embassy, Japan Embassy, Kabul Star hotel).
- Jalalabad, 4 Suicide Bombers attacked airfield used by US forces.
- Logar and Paktia provinces, unknown attacks in these two provinces.
- Just across the border in the tribal areas of Pakistan an attack last night on a prison freed 400 prisoners including Adnan Rasheed who was arrested years ago for attempting to assassinate former President Musharraf. Taliban statement reads ""We have freed hundreds of our comrades in Bannu in this attack. Several of our people have reached their destinations, others are on their way."
Like the previous large attacks on Kabul this one is being blamed on the Haqqanni Network. Since the Haqqanni is located to the East of Kabul it is probably the closest Taliban faction to the city while most others are concentrated in the South of Afghanistan. Official Taliban spokesman says that these attacks are the official start of the Fighting Season (however been a lot of attacks already April 1-8 had 8 NATO deaths for instance, and a helicopter crashed in Eastern Afghanistan yesterday.)
Posted by: Colm O' Toole | Apr 15, 2012 10:04:01 AM | 33
I can't stop thinking about Danny. His youthful enthusiasm was infectious. I expect Anderson Cooper will be doing a follow up....he likes to keep 'em honest.
Posted by: dh | Apr 15, 2012 10:15:42 AM | 35
Interesting videos. However,
I downloaded the 26 min video first then the other two, 5 min and 48 min and I am watching closely and trying to understand the words coming out of the people talking ( i am a syrian by birth and can understand some of the language). All i can say is that the videos are real, at least the explosions that are captured seem to be real except, the converstaion is edited and dubbed.
On the 48 min video, when the little guy comes out and starts talking and showing the spent ammo, this is definitely dubbed inside a studio somewhere. the video was taken some time ago likely when homs was under siege. But, if you listen carefully you will hear whispering sounds as if someone is dictating the words to the little guy and when he steps out in front of the camera, his words are not being captured live, they are dubbed.
My assumption is that they used an old video and broadcast it while dubbing descritpion of what they're seeing as after the ceasefire. the little guy is calling to support the FSA and begging the arabs and the world to intervene militarily.
On the 26 min video there is a skype call near the end and the conversation is the same, "see what assad is doing,...." the problem is in all the videos, the sound is too clear considering they're using a video camera but no street noises that make any sense, ie, no wind noise, as everyone knows when you take a live video the wind makes a real mess of the audio, and considering the bombing they sure seem casual about walking around, however, no street noise that can be shown along with actual vehicles or anything. Also, you hear heavy vehicles moving once in a while, almost like a tank going by, but you don't see anything.
You also hear a sound on the 48 min video that sounds like something moving like a remote control not sure what that is but definitely a studio type equipment. I don't have a great audio editing tool although i am now interetsed in getting some if someone can recommend any, i would really like to decipher the content of these videos better. The videos are real, but they are definitley staged with dubbed sound from anothre time.
I will keep listening and see if anything else jumps out. Thanx b,.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 15, 2012 12:17:16 PM | 36
Staying on the 26 min. vid . . .
At 2:45 there is a substantial explosion that I think is the screen shot (or a few seconds after) that CBS and CNN used today in their stories.
I paused it right when the explosion occurred and it appears to effect two floors. Smoke is ejected out of two stories.
Comparing a shot after the smoke clears with one from before, you can see a puncture hole near the second window from the left, one floor from the top.
So this does appear to be a RPG or artillery type shot. It's not nearly as big of a puncture wound as the bigger holes already in the building. But it does appear to have more force than anything else I saw in the video (although I've only skipped around and not watched it all). Most of the explosions appear to have smaller force than the blow at 2:45.
It's also *odd* that the cameraman comes in tight on this building right when the biggest explosion in this whole "attack" hits that building.
It's also *odd* that there doesn't seem to be a military objective to this assault and that there is no team, or tanks, that come close to the building to clear it, or investigate further, etc. There is no fire coming from the building so why doesn't the Syrian Army come close instead of just whaling away from afar?
Here's my guess on how the video hoax was pulled off:
I'm guessing there were a few charges laid. Then maybe someone shot some exploding rounds, or smoke rounds or something, for the smoke effects. Or maybe these were simply added in via cgi later. That is very easy to do.
Then they used at least one RPG shot to simulate the shelling. It was probably a hit and run thing, while the team filmed from that one location (probably 3 guys--one cameraman, one lookout/assistant, one driver).
But based on the condition of the building I'm guessing the insurgents use real explosives and rounds to simulate shelling, etc. Maybe there once was a real battle here. Who knows. The other buildings don't look they've been damaged much at all. Makes me wonder what the rest of the neighborhood looks like.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 15, 2012 1:10:03 PM | 37
@ani souri - Thanks for your analysis.
I doubt though that these are pictures from real shelling. See above for the reasons - no damage etc. What you say is a skype call sounded like a walkie talkie to me. But anyay - the judgements seems clear. The video does not show what it says it shows.
Aside from that: There were several videos of shelling in Homs uploaded today that seemed real though the shelling was restricted to a rather small area. I have no idea if those were old videos uploaded again or old ones or what is going on Homs right now.
From the death reported by Sana there is certainly some serious insurgency action still going on.
Posted by: b | Apr 15, 2012 1:12:04 PM | 38
near the end of the 48 min video, someone is walking and talking describing the bombing and damage to the city, yet with all the sounds of the bombs that we hear, this person never skips a step or stops talking. This part of the video for sure is dubbed in a studio somewhere. The video was taken sometime ago and then they added the narration and sounds of bombings. Poor job actually.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 15, 2012 1:13:53 PM | 39
More; from the 5 min video;
In the very beginning they chase away someone in a van who was getting close and they tell the driver to leave , sorry can't make out the whole conversation, wil lkeep trying. It just seems like they were chasing away the white van and told the driver to go away there is something that wil be taking place there. need to slow down the audio and translate carefully. This is key as it seems a lot of staging going on.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 15, 2012 1:18:00 PM | 40
Didn't mean real shelling, i meant real videos of someone hitting something and that may very well be same guys hitting with RPGs or something similar which explains the small damage. A tank shell or anything like we hear in the background of heavy shelling would have done far more damage than is shown.
Definitly Skype. also the conversation is skype like as he asks if he has his screen up or not and then gives an interview. I am trying to decipher who they are talking to.
I am also focusing on the 5 min video, lots of conversations in the background, almost sure they did not mean to include it. Need to listen carefully over and over to understand the words.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 15, 2012 1:30:06 PM | 41
To clarify my description of where you can see the damage done from the explosion at 2:45:
I wrote "second" window from the left, but it's actually the 3rd window from the left, if you count the window in the balcony that makes up the left most side of the building.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 15, 2012 1:36:39 PM | 42
@ana souri Definitly Skype. also the conversation is skype like as he asks if he has his screen up or not and then gives an interview. I am trying to decipher who they are talking to.
My bet would be on Al Jazerrah Arabic or some Saudi station. Presented as "live TV" just like the Danny show for CNN.
The white car and the walking around - I had the same impression you have. The car was chased away as it disturbed the show. The walking around could have been in Bab Amer which was pretty much shelled weeks ago - could you ask someone from Homs who may recognize the neighborhood?
Posted by: b | Apr 15, 2012 2:40:47 PM | 44
sent request to a couple of Syrian sites asking them to look into it. may be a while before any reply, will post if and when i get anything.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 15, 2012 2:59:23 PM | 45
long time reader, first time commenter
I've analyzed the audio.
the voices have the reverberation of a indoor structure
the explosions have a different spectral profile than the other sounds, like they were being played on small speakers
and many of the explosions occur exactly 9.7 seconds apart, like clockwork
PS @ pissedoffamerican
I've aired some of your comments ;)
Posted by: crazy_inventor | Apr 15, 2012 6:32:42 PM | 46
"I've aired some of your comments"
WTF does that mean???
Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | Apr 15, 2012 6:41:43 PM | 47
I operate radio stations, and when especially good comments are posted I use a text-to-speech utility, (neo-speech Julie sounds the most natural) which converts the comments into voice.
the fake news story about the captured israeli drone and our 'withdraw' from Iraq, etc..
I've found your comments particularly enlightening, and accurate, and so your comments are the ones I mostly convert to air - as an example of what astute americans say (compared to the clueless dumbasses here where I live)
it goes without saying I'm in agreement with almost everything you post, otherwise you wouldn't be the person I have 'speak' over the air mostly..
Posted by: crazy_inventor | Apr 15, 2012 8:22:50 PM | 48
Walter Wit Man said:
"It's also *odd* that there doesn't seem to be a military objective to this assault and that there is no team, or tanks, that come close to the building to clear it, or investigate further, etc. There is no fire coming from the building so why doesn't the Syrian Army come close instead of just whaling away from afar?"
Yes, and it's *odd* that at Youtube in February a number of videos were posted showing buildings in Homs getting assaulted by explosives, where the Syrian army was out of sight, the rebels were out of sight, and there was no military objective for either side in sight. Vacant buildings were being assaulted with explosives for no discernibe reason. The adjacent buildings were left alone. It must be then that the Syrian army is mindlessly depraved.
Or else the people who give credence to what the dissidents claim these videos are depicting are the ones who are mindlessly depraved.
Posted by: Parviziyi | Apr 15, 2012 8:42:47 PM | 49
As Patrick Henningsen points out, "if Obama was faced with this situation, to have US militias armed and being aided by the Chinese, Canadians or the Mexicans and terrorising cities in the US, you'd better believe that the US Federal Government would give two fingers up to the United Nations and tell them 'stay out of our business because we have a domestic insurgency problem which we need to put down in order to bring stability to our state' - why isn't Syria viewed this way?"
Posted by: brian | Apr 15, 2012 10:07:27 PM | 50
I may be missing the tone of your comment, and if so I apologize, but it appears you are saying I am "depraved" and that I "give credence" to what the"dissidents"* are saying.
Uh, no I'm not.
I'm analyzing the video and simply saying the localized damage and lack of a military objective is further PROOF that the "dissidents" are lying . . . I think this video is a hoax, if that wasn't clear to you . . .
I guess you're still sore about our previous disagreement and so you wildly misread me? ;)
I'd rather analyze the facts than get in a stupid pissing contest.
I've notice an incredible amount of obfuscation and gatekeeping around the Syria story it's simply amazing. So many people with an agenda . . .
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 15, 2012 11:50:37 PM | 51
B - You seem to have the background. Could you find video of the actual effect of various sorts of tank and artillery fire, and mortar fire, on structures, to compare with this video?
Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 16, 2012 12:44:01 AM | 52
'I've notice an incredible amount of obfuscation and gatekeeping around the Syria story it's simply amazing. So many people with an agenda .'
the only 'agendas' are those of the US the sauds their fellow travellers and the insurgents
Posted by: brian | Apr 16, 2012 12:47:29 AM | 53
Life is a bit more complicated than that brian.
Even putative allies can have secret agendas.
Hell, the progressive blogosphere is filled with controlled opposition. It's more of the rule rather than the exception.
And I didn't mean to accuse Parviziyi of being obtuse or a gatekeeper . . . I don't know his intent . . . I'm just frustrated about how difficult it is to have an honest discussion on Syria.
What do you think about my analysis of the video?
Did you see any other big explosions that could be RPG, like at 2:45 in the 26 min. vid?
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 16, 2012 1:02:45 AM | 54
If you look at my comment #26, I link to a video of the U.S. training Afghan troops and shooting the RPG and the GP-25. They also shoot bigger 50 caliber guns. These all could also conceivably be used to replicate this attack but the RPG comes the closest to sounding like the booms we hear in the video.
Also, here's a video of Russian 2S1 Gvozdika shooting the howitzer round that the insurgents/West accuse Syria of shooting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_poCCSeVc0&feature=related At about 3:00 you see/hear the gun firing. The sound seems closer to what we hear in the video, but from a greater distance, but the explosion looks much bigger than those we see in the video.
The discussion above about the audio is an important lead. The voices and the "shelling" do sound like they were recorded in different environment than the voice.
The sounds/sights don't seem to match. Then we only get a very tight shot of the supposed action. The video is surely a hoax.
It was irresponsible for the press to search through those videos and appear to show the worst shot (at 2:45 in the 26 min. vid.?right?). If the MSM took the trouble to find that surely they could figure out the video was unreliable.
This is a sure indication our media is completely corrupt.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 16, 2012 1:17:28 AM | 55
Oops, that wasn't the Russian tank mentioned above, but a similar Polish one, I think . . . appreciate any clarifications . . . but I think the round it is shooting is very similar.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Apr 16, 2012 1:19:36 AM | 56
All this leaves some intriguing questions:
Homs is a rather large city with some 750,000 inhabitants. How did these people know where the shelling would take place so they could be there with all their equipment just in time to witness it?
Hold it right there.
That question pretty well nails it. It can be Q.E.D'd by asking "how come the camera operator manages to get the target at frame-centre before the explosion?"
I'm pretty good with a video camera, but I still have to wait for the impact before I can film the conclusion of, say, a field sport, air show, or car race mishap.
I'd like to meet the "experts" evaluating these ridiculously brainless concoctions.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 16, 2012 5:01:00 AM | 57
Here's some great "sssshhhhhssshhh"ing rocket footage:
That youtube channel seems very prolific and if you take a look, there's hints of how this shall be turned into a religious war. Titles like "sunni mosque massacre" "Assad shoots sunni on mosque steps" "Assad targeting Bin Walid Mosque" etc. etc. shall probably raise hate towards the Shiites and Alawites. It really seems like a proxy "war" of Turkey and Saudis against mostly Iran and on the way Russia, too.
Posted by: peter radiator | Apr 16, 2012 5:31:22 AM | 58
the root of the whole operation is contempt, isnt it?
the people that pull stunts like this are contemptuous of the believers, because the believers are stupid enough to believe.
they have contempt for the people that dont believe, and object, because the objectors are powerless.
the only people worthy of respect are the people who know it's a lie, and pretend to believe so they can profit in some way or another.
the empire at its finest.
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 16, 2012 8:52:47 AM | 59
For Tunisia and Egypt, the W was taken by surprise. The W supported those heads of state and moreover loathes change and surprises, as it signals a lack of control and need for adaptability. So they switched to grudging pro-democracy discourse, yet e. g. continue to support the Military Cabal in Egypt.
Unrest in Lybia provided opportunity for mayhem and war-mongering (e.g. The Sark) and suddenly getting rid of the then pliant but unpredictable Khadafi became the rage.
The Arab Spring became a golden opportunity to liquidate regimes that displeased, because they are/were, nationalistic, socialistic, anti-US-Isr, and relatively strong because held together by some kind of National Unity under a Gvmt. of some type (legit or not, oppressive or not, etc.), free of ethnic strife, like Saddam’s Iraq or Iran today. Destroying Iraq cost a bomb - Lybia? Pennies...
Syria is a continuation of that exercise, presented as support for a ppl’s liberation movement.
No doubt many in Syria want regime change, so to speak, and want to have the ‘right’ to express that but don’t have the platform, besides violence, to do so. Assad and his wife are objectionable idiots, for sure. Idealism is always welcome. Things could always be better. Nobody in the US attempted to overthrow Bush Junior and Laura, and had they tried, they would have found no support from any foreign power. (that was for sloth..)
Islam and Islamists have nothing much to do with all this, except that the W demonizes Islam for the general public but of course favors it as a method of control and gaining subservient stooges who will enter into deals and line their various pockets. Which is in itself a mismatch, but then, one more contradiction, who cares...
Individual and societal ‘rights’ and some kind of redistribution of assets, profits, etc. under an agreed on or imposed scheme are not allowed. Ppl are supposed to be slaves to Big Bosses and Corporations, work without demands or complaint, be afraid of SWAT teams, the TSA, the drug war, prison, etc. and die quietly without health care, at 10, or 30, or 75. So I’m going a bit off the rails here, but these wars are about assets (energy, minerals, transport routes, etc.), business oppos, of course, but also, very deeply, about societal models.
Posted by: Noirette | Apr 16, 2012 11:05:54 AM | 60
you can say to the "believers" --the zionists and the deathwish christians and the wingnuts who may or may not believe but at least profit from the project--- "here you go, here's a reason to believe... or, a reason to pretend you believe."
meanwhile, you're also saying to the skeptics and heretics, "well, you dont have to believe, because we got the juice, and resistance is futile... you might as well shut your goddamned yaps, bend over, and take it."
you never hear much about the psywar shrinks, but operations like this stink of bent psychologists.
in fact, the whole PNAC project stinks of doc aumann's game theory, bent psychology, and contempt for anyone who doesnt buy "might makes right", jewish theories of racial supremacy, and the likud party line.
Posted by: retreatingbladestall | Apr 16, 2012 11:09:32 AM | 61
At the top of this thread 'b' linked to "live" videos of "shelling in Homs" that have a date of 14 Apr 2012. The following are videos of explosions and smoke coming out of the same building in Homs, with an earlier date:
Uploaded on 10 Apr 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDzmp2ySpSU
Uploaded on 11 Apr 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3VDQGn-b_c
In the one uploaded 11 Apr 2012, the rebel glimpsed at time 0:03 is the very same rebel in the very same location as in the one uploaded 10 Apr 2012, which implies they were both recorded on the same date, and, after consideration, the date of the recording is probably 10 April. The rebels are staging the stuff seen in the above videos. That is clear to me. The fakery in the video uploaded 10 April was commented upon in Arabic in the following video that was uploaded by a pro-regime uploader on 12 April: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycXi2Rk3hRw
The rebels have been staging stuff at that building since 10 Apr 2012 (or before), and the stuff linked to by 'b' dated 14 Apr 2012 is a continuation of it. This is worrisome to me because it indicates that the forces of law and order are not in control of the area, and seemingly are not present in the area at all.
By the way, the building in those videos is in the neighborhood in Homs called جورة الشياح and more videos featuring that building can be found at Youtube by searching for that neighborhood name at Youtube. Here's one that was recorded by the same camera in the same place as the ones above and was uploaded on 10 Apr 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYHfYqBIpmU
Posted by: Parviziyi | Apr 16, 2012 5:43:08 PM | 63
@ani souri - the man in the first video Parviziyi and you linked os Khaled Abu Saleh working for Al Jazeerah but having been reproduced in many other "news" reports.
Posted by: b | Apr 17, 2012 2:45:49 PM | 65
A new video uploaded today showed the same building. It is very likely by now that this was damaged a quite long tome ago in a now rather quiet area is therefore now a preferred video scene for insurgency stunts.
Posted by: b | Apr 17, 2012 2:51:56 PM | 66
Danny is currently looking for work. Things didn't go well with Anderson Cooper. He has been venting his frustration on that building.
Posted by: dh | Apr 17, 2012 3:23:35 PM | 67
This is the same guy who appeared on many Homs videos and in some he was a dr. In some a patient. This is Danny
Check your posts there was videos listed and he was in them. Anyway, I am now more than sure all this is fake and the damage may have been done during the original assault on Homs and this is where the rebels used the bldg as their base to fire on the army. Unfortunately I have not received any feedback from the sites I asked to review the videos so I guess it's just another piece for history.
Posted by: ana souri | Apr 17, 2012 5:11:30 PM | 68
I'm pretty sure this is Danny talking to Anderson Cooper....
The damage to the building most likely occurred when the rebels were building a humanitarian corridor.
Posted by: dh | Apr 17, 2012 5:22:00 PM | 69